April 15th

USMC Crayons said:
So what exactly is the purpose of keeping a candidate pending this long without a nomination? And why did they ask for additional information in Feb, when they already knew he didn't have a nomination?
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If they asked for additional information in February, it means there is something they are interested in... so there is still a chance. Beyond that, I can't say why USNA doesn't send TWE when they have made a rejection decision, and frankly can't say with any certainty whether a final decision is made in any given case. Admissions states April 15 is their target date and any expectation beyond that is a creation of the internet ..people watch others getting appointed and declined and want to know.

USMC Crayons said:
I asked if typically they try to fill the NAPS class with priors before HS kids first.
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The original intent /purpose of NAPS was to provide a means for getting promising young enlisted sailors and Marines prepared for academics at the Naval Academy. I would expect (and hope) that this is still the primary consideration, but the original intent has morphed and now there is a mix of athletes and other candidates a NAPS. (Perhaps a current Napster or someone with more recent experience can tell the current class composition).

I don't think anyone here can tell you with any certainty whether a particular candidate would get NAPS v. getting a TWE - it's not a black and white thing .
 
Old Navy BGO said:
If they asked for additional information in February, it means there is something they are interested in... so there is still a chance. Beyond that, I can't say why USNA doesn't send TWE when they have made a rejection decision, and frankly can't say with any certainty whether a final decision is made in any given case. Admissions states April 15 is their target date and any expectation beyond that is a creation of the internet ..people watch others getting appointed and declined and want to know.


The original intent /purpose of NAPS was to provide a means for getting promising young enlisted sailors and Marines prepared for academics at the Naval Academy. I would expect (and hope) that this is still the primary consideration, but the original intent has morphed and now there is a mix of athletes and other candidates a NAPS. (Perhaps a current Napster or someone with more recent experience can tell the current class composition).

I don't think anyone here can tell you with any certainty whether a particular candidate would get NAPS v. getting a TWE - it's not a black and white thing .
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Class of 2027 stats say about 40 of the 209 that came from NAPS were prior enlisted...so that's 20% +/-. I get the original intent, but that's a whole lotta people coming from Newport that are one year removed from high school, with maybe a couple of candidates mixed in that have a year of college. I get it that NAPS is not an alternate form of entry for people who didn't get a nom, but you can't tell me that all (or even most) of the 169 students there had a nomination in hand. If in fact they did, and it is the Naval Academies intent that most that go to NAPS have a nomination, then it's pretty bad optics to string kids along in a pending status that have zero chance of a positive outcome.
 
It is my opinion, and experience, that NAPS is there to refine candidates that the Academy wants who have some sort of deficiency that can be improved upon in a year's time, or for those in service who have been out of academics for a while (active duty service members). It could be academics, it could be leadership, it could be fitness, or any combination thereof.

If there is a stellar candidate who has nearly all the qualities they are looking for, but lacks a nomination, NAPS is not going to be the place for them, or a foundation. There is little room for improvement. If they had wanted the candidate so much initially, they would have had the opportunity to use one of their discretionary noms.

And, if there is someone who is a college re-applicant, they have already had the chance to show they could improve with another year out of high school. NAPS is almost assuredly not going to be offered to them.
 
USMC Crayons said:
So what exactly is the purpose of keeping a candidate pending this long without a nomination? And why did they ask for additional information in Feb, when they already knew he didn't have a nomination? If it's unlikely, then what is the point? Especially when you consider that lots of candidates with a nom already have their TWE. I realize it's the Navy, and I am familiar with how they roll, but just end it for crying out loud.
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Turn a positive lens on it - perhaps they don’t want to let him go just yet, and they don’t have enough “nom magic” right now to make an offer. Perhaps they have extended their first group of appointment offers associated with the VP nom, and are waiting to hear back - if there is a declination, perhaps that nom gets reassigned and another offer made. No news can be good news.
 
USMC Crayons said:
Class of 2027 stats say about 40 of the 209 that came from NAPS were prior enlisted...so that's 20% +/-. I get the original intent, but that's a whole lotta people coming from Newport that are one year removed from high school, with maybe a couple of candidates mixed in that have a year of college. I get it that NAPS is not an alternate form of entry for people who didn't get a nom, but you can't tell me that all (or even most) of the 169 students there had a nomination in hand. If in fact they did, and it is the Naval Academies intent that most that go to NAPS have a nomination, then it's pretty bad optics to string kids along in a pending status that have zero chance of a positive outcome.
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Some kids that aren’t already TWE’ed, made it this far, and eventually do receive one close to the April 15 date, may feel ‘strung along’.

Other kids that are still in it at this point, but ultimately do receive a ‘not this year’ TWE, may view it in positive light, that they made it this far, so were competitive.

The fact of the matter is that if you are still in the running, you haven’t been taken out of the running.

I guess it’s how you look at it. Half empty, or half full.

(Posted at the same time as CaptMJ. Its so nice to have this occur again!!)
 
USMC Crayons said:
Thanks for the feedback. Hoping for NAPS or foundation (foundation preferred, only because they don't have DS's sport at NAPS). Have to imagine that he would have known about foundation already (maybe not). Do athletes and priors have first dibs on NAPS, or does that not matter?
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Captain Hughes told me that the academy is SOOOOO behind with foundation. Like they barely have anyone passed onto Foundation bc they're that behind
 
Capt MJ said:
Turn a positive lens on it - perhaps they don’t want to let him go just yet, and they don’t have enough “nom magic” right now to make an offer. Perhaps they have extended their first group of appointment offers associated with the VP nom, and are waiting to hear back - if there is a declination, perhaps that nom gets reassigned and another offer made. No news can be good news.
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I always appreciate your balanced, objective input instead of all of the "not probably going to happen" and "unlikely" quotes. That indeed might be the case, but I have to imagine admissions has better things to do then just have dead wood lying around. If nothing else, it would help decrease calls to admissions for status...have to imagine they are fielding tons of phone and email inquiries.
 
Old Navy BGO said:
True, but not a realistic expectation. NAPS/Foundation is not intended as an alternative source of entry for those without Noms. It is possible, but unlikely.



^ This , history shows that that there will be a number of TWE's issued around April 15, a few BFE, a few waitlist, and Appointments will trickle on for weeks. Latest I heard was just a few weeks before I Day.
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There are plenty of kids at NAPS (and other Academy prep schools for that matter) who did not receive nominations.
 
USMC Crayons said:
Class of 2027 stats say about 40 of the 209 that came from NAPS were prior enlisted...so that's 20% +/-. I get the original intent, but that's a whole lotta people coming from Newport that are one year removed from high school, with maybe a couple of candidates mixed in that have a year of college. I get it that NAPS is not an alternate form of entry for people who didn't get a nom, but you can't tell me that all (or even most) of the 169 students there had a nomination in hand. If in fact they did, and it is the Naval Academies intent that most that go to NAPS have a nomination, then it's pretty bad optics to string kids along in a pending status that have zero chance of a positive outcome.
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You are correct. Many did not have nominations when they received their NAPS appointments.

If you look at that Class of 2027 profile, you'll see there are nearly 200 appointments for NAPS, 45 for Foundation and 20 from the fleet directly. That's roughly 265 of the outstanding appointments that are going to non-direct / non-re-applicants. This demonstrates how hard it is to get an appointment directly out of high school. According to the Class of 2027 profile, there were 1175 in the class. Of that 1175, 839 were directs. That's a really small number.

It's also important to remember that a nomination can best be described as an endorsement. While necessary for an appointment to USNA, it does not always result in an appointment. Every year there are kids with multiple nominations who do not receive appointments. (You can already see some in this year's threads.) Looking at the Class of 2027 profile, simple math says receiving one gives you roughly a 23% chance at gaining an appointment, whereas not receiving one takes your chances to 0. If there were 5997 nominations and 1379 offers of appointment for the class of 2027, then 1379 / 5997 = 23%. Here's the stats for the class of 2027:

www.usna.edu

Class Portrait

Class Portrait page for Admissions at USNA.edu. Updated Sun Apr 21 04:34:10 EDT 2024.
www.usna.edu


I think the Academy doesn't necessarily string kids along. If you were not competitive, you likely already received your TWE. I think the April 15th deadline gives them flexibility to juggle nominations and offer kids other avenues to gain an eventual appointment (NAPS / Foundation) that are competitive.
 
Lots of good advice and words of wisdom here. That said, it is a very difficult time for parents and the candidates. I feel for all of them and know how stressful these next two weeks are to everyone.

Hoping for the best for everyone!
 
Your DS is still in it if his file is still open. Anything can happen! Keep hope alive!

As some have mentioned, the majority of candidates will know something by mid-April, but so many things can happen between now and I-day as admissions finalizes the class.

My 2027 DD entered April 2023 with an open file with no nomination, and ended up receiving a Supe nom and USNA direct appointment a couple of days before 4/15.
 
Edmund said:
There are plenty of kids at NAPS (and other Academy prep schools for that matter) who did not receive nominations.
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May be true, but that does not necessarily equate to getting selected for NAPS because they didn't have a Nomination. The Admissions Board being meeting in September, and makes the determination of whether a Candidate is Admissions Board Qualified (one of the three Q's) or whether to recommend NAPS because they see something in the Candidate that needs improvement to ensure they are better prepared for success at USNA. This can, and often does, happen before Nominations are even announced in December/January.

Edmund said:
While necessary for an appointment to USNA, it does not always result in an appointment. Every year there are kids with multiple nominations who do not receive appointments
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There are many many threads on the relationship between Nomination and Appointments. I wouldn't consider the nomination as an "endorsement" as much as an "invitation to compete". Most MOC award competitive nominations, with up to 10 nominations for each competitive slot. It is up to Nominations and Appointments to rack and stack the Nominees and determine who among the various 3Q Candidates is best qualified for the particular slot.

This isn't about "odds" of appointment if you have a nomination. It is a competition, and the " more qualified" candidate has much chance than the lesser qualified candidate. (I will leave it at that, as opinions of more or lesser qualified may vary).
 
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Old Navy BGO said:
May be true, but that does not necessarily equate to getting selected for NAPS because they didn't have a Nomination. The Admissions Board being meeting in September, and makes the determination of whether a Candidate is Admissions Board Qualified (one of the three Q's) or whether to recommend NAPS because they see something in the Candidate that needs improvement to ensure they are better prepared for success at USNA. This can, and often does, happen before Nominations are even announced in December/January.
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I don't think anyone is arguing that someone received a NAPS appointment simply because they didn't have a nomination. Rather, I pointed out that there are a lot of kids at NAPS who received their appointments there without having a nomination.
Old Navy BGO said:
There are many many threads on the relationship between Nomination and Appointments. I wouldn't consider the nomination as an "endorsement" as much as an "invitation to compete". Most MOC award competitive nominations, with up to 10 nominations for each competitive slot. It is up to Nominations and Appointments to rack and stack the Nominees and determine who among the various 3Q Candidates is best qualified for the particular slot.
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An endorsement is how the Academy actually describes them. If you are a BGO, this shouldn't come as a surprise since it's the terminology USNA uses to train all BGOs. Click on the second slide in this powerpoint...

 
Or maybe here, where I had posted the link to clarify a misconception:

Replying to this thread until appointment/redirection (with a JROTC nom)

I just read that @blinkus (who started theirs) got their appointment to the Naval Acadmey after 52 days! This manifestation has also encouraged me to start my own. For background, I have a JROTC nom and people from my state/ district are getting their appointments right now. I have a USAFA...
www.serviceacademyforums.com

;)
 
Edmund said:
You are correct. Many did not have nominations when they received their NAPS appointments.

If you look at that Class of 2027 profile, you'll see there are nearly 200 appointments for NAPS, 45 for Foundation and 20 from the fleet directly. That's roughly 265 of the outstanding appointments that are going to non-direct / non-re-applicants. This demonstrates how hard it is to get an appointment directly out of high school. According to the Class of 2027 profile, there were 1175 in the class. Of that 1175, 839 were directs. That's a really small number.

It's also important to remember that a nomination can best be described as an endorsement. While necessary for an appointment to USNA, it does not always result in an appointment. Every year there are kids with multiple nominations who do not receive appointments. (You can already see some in this year's threads.) Looking at the Class of 2027 profile, simple math says receiving one gives you roughly a 23% chance at gaining an appointment, whereas not receiving one takes your chances to 0. If there were 5997 nominations and 1379 offers of appointment for the class of 2027, then 1379 / 5997 = 23%. Here's the stats for the class of 2027:

www.usna.edu

Class Portrait

Class Portrait page for Admissions at USNA.edu. Updated Sun Apr 21 04:34:10 EDT 2024.
www.usna.edu


I think the Academy doesn't necessarily string kids along. If you were not competitive, you likely already received your TWE. I think the April 15th deadline gives them flexibility to juggle nominations and offer kids other avenues to gain an eventual appointment (NAPS / Foundation) that are competitive.
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Is there any data on P-Nom chances? I heard something about USAFA and USMA basically having to give appointments (if at all possible) to P-Nom recipients. Is that true? Regardless, how do P-Noms affect your chances at USNA?

Thanks in advance,
- H
 
Hopful_Mil_Kid said:
Is there any data on P-Nom chances? I heard something about USAFA and USMA basically having to give appointments (if at all possible) to P-Nom recipients. Is that true? Regardless, how do P-Noms affect your chances at USNA?

Thanks in advance,
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The principal nomination method essentially forces the service academy to offer an appointment to that candidate, IF they are fully qualified medically, physically and academically/all other factors. It doesn’t matter how that individual is ranked by the service academy against others on the slate. Interestingly, the law is very clear for USMA and USAFA, but USNA has some wiggle room to not choose a principal nominee. They usually will, though, if the candidate is fully qualified, in the interests of harmony.

See the link below for “Noms 101.” I expect it will be updated in the coming months to show the increase in slate size from 10 to 15.

 
justdoit19 said:
Some kids that aren’t already TWE’ed, made it this far, and eventually do receive one close to the April 15 date, may feel ‘strung along’.

Other kids that are still in it at this point, but ultimately do receive a ‘not this year’ TWE, may view it in positive light, that they made it this far, so were competitive.

The fact of the matter is that if you are still in the running, you haven’t been taken out of the running.

I guess it’s how you look at it. Half empty, or half full.

(Posted at the same time as CaptMJ. Its so nice to have this occur again!!)
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My DS received his TWE from USNA last year with the big “purge”, April 11or 12. Luckily he already had his USMA appointment, but we both felt if he made it that far, he was competitive, and just couldn’t find a place for him. Seems legit to me 😆
 
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