Class of 23 & 24 Shotgunning

Being in the military requires you to move - every 2-3 years. And every time that happens you change people. You get really good at creating camaraderie because you are rarely in your home towns, and rarely with the exact same group of people for a long time. But you collect great people along the way - and they stay with you in one way or another. These kids have had a crazy year - as have had so many at other schools also - it's been a different version of tough in many places. These mids achieved their spots, though, by hopefully showing some degree of perseverance. I think it stinks, and rightly so, for many of them now. I also have faith that they will get through this, and hope that USNA is doing its best to prepare them for life as commissioned officers. And you all are great parents for giving them a space to rant and moan and groan. That probably helps more than you can imagine!
 
My Youngster son is not thrilled with the shotgun....but he accepts the challange and says they need to change things up a bit. He and his roommates all get along really well ... but he's looking forward to making new friends. Says he will miss the 7th co. Plebes which he really liked being a mentor to. Was happy to be practicing Ultimate Frisbee today. Go Navy!
 
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ders_dad said:
I'm entitled to my opinion but my DS shares yours - "you're not here" he says. But my youngster DS says if feels like a "last f__ you from the Dant" who "doesn't understand how "s__y" the last year has been for us" and it is "just a kick in the b__s" - so believe me, I get it. I am worried about 2-7 attrition in this family.
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Isn’t the Dant a submarine officer? Yeah the year has sucked, but being below the ocean for however many weeks… with no outside comms… is right up there.
 
One thing to note also… with all the technology out there Mids will get creative with group chats, discord’s, etc to help get the new companies together. Pizza nights, meet ups, coffee on liberty. They will run across the new company mates the next few weeks and over the summer. At the end of the day, USNA is small, everyone knows everyone. It will stretch these classes in good ways. Sure there is discomfort in what is new and fear of losing some relationships. Mids are resilient, it’s one of the traits they learn and this will help grow them.

For the soon to be 1/C… one of the best things my new company did prior to us going away for the summer was invite all of us new company mates over for a meet and greet. We were technically still 4/C at the time but they treated us like soon to be 3/C. We got to meet everyone, know our new company area, phone numbers for our 1/C leadership and company officer/enlisted for the summer. It’s a great chance to step up as leaders and find ways to embrace and build that new company culture and morale.
 
NavyHoops said:
One thing to note also… with all the technology out there Mids will get creative with group chats, discord’s, etc to help get the new companies together. Pizza nights, meet ups, coffee on liberty. They will run across the new company mates the next few weeks and over the summer. At the end of the day, USNA is small, everyone knows everyone. It will stretch these classes in good ways. Sure there is discomfort in what is new and fear of losing some relationships. Mids are resilient, it’s one of the traits they learn and this will help grow them.

For the soon to be 1/C… one of the best things my new company did prior to us going away for the summer was invite all of us new company mates over for a meet and greet. We were technically still 4/C at the time but they treated us like soon to be 3/C. We got to meet everyone, know our new company area, phone numbers for our 1/C leadership and company officer/enlisted for the summer. It’s a great chance to step up as leaders and find ways to embrace and build that new company culture and morale.
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Our plebe holds several of his training staff in high regard. They checked in on their plebes tonight and were very supportive. They have mentored them well. I look forward to them continuing their relationships in the future. It was a big moment today when in a private conversation an upper told him it was okay to call him by his first name in that off the books chat. Of course plebe will continue to follow all protocols, but on a rough day their checking in and empathy was noted.
 
I get the point that this is going to prepare them for military life, to a degree. But do entire crews leave a ship and get replaced at once? I've never served, so please correct me if I am wrong. I always thought it was individuals or groups changing, which keeps a flow.

I do feel bad for next year's Firsties. They will now be in charge of a bunch of complete strangers, for the most part. The company's culture and personality will pretty much vanish. I think it will be odd to acknowledge this semester's color company at football games next year, considering that 75% of the Mids in that company would not have been a part of it.

I talked to my youngster son tonight. He isn't happy, but also said his happiness was most likely not a factor in the leadership's decision-making process. He's going to be fine, but he is concerned about a lot of his company-mates. He has spent countless hours tutoring many of them. He is worried about them.
 
brewmeist said:
I get the point that this is going to prepare them for military life, to a degree. But do entire crews leave a ship and get replaced at once? I've never served, so please correct me if I am wrong. I always thought it was individuals or groups changing, which keeps a flow.

I do feel bad for next year's Firsties. They will now be in charge of a bunch of complete strangers, for the most part. The company's culture and personality will pretty much vanish. I think it will be odd to acknowledge this semester's color company at football games next year, considering that 75% of the Mids in that company would not have been a part of it.

I talked to my youngster son tonight. He isn't happy, but also said his happiness was most likely not a factor in the leadership's decision-making process. He's going to be fine, but he is concerned about a lot of his company-mates. He has spent countless hours tutoring many of them. He is worried about them.
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My plebe year, the First Class had just scrambled from where they'd been for the prior year. I think that this was their second time so they were in three different companies during their time at USNA. No social media of course and not much prep - when they returned from summer training/leave, they just reported to their new company areas. Pretty much the only contact within the battalions were the guys who had been on Plebe Detail as the Plebe Summer organization had them in their post-scramble arrangement.
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So the Firsties were leading three classes and knew none of them before reform. Maybe that's why they were so nasty to us. . .
 
brewmeist said:
I get the point that this is going to prepare them for military life, to a degree. But do entire crews leave a ship and get replaced at once? I've never served, so please correct me if I am wrong. I always thought it was individuals or groups changing, which keeps a flow.

I do feel bad for next year's Firsties. They will now be in charge of a bunch of complete strangers, for the most part. The company's culture and personality will pretty much vanish. I think it will be odd to acknowledge this semester's color company at football games next year, considering that 75% of the Mids in that company would not have been a part of it.

I talked to my youngster son tonight. He isn't happy, but also said his happiness was most likely not a factor in the leadership's decision-making process. He's going to be fine, but he is concerned about a lot of his company-mates. He has spent countless hours tutoring many of them. He is worried about them.
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Not normally, but I have seen 50% or more get replaced in depts or ships. I have seen entire new crewe if someone is a plankowner. The culture will be there. The 1/C will establish it.
 
brewmeist said:
I do feel bad for next year's Firsties. They will now be in charge of a bunch of complete strangers, for the most part.
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Spoke this evening with DD, a soon-to-be firstie. She said that her class is generally understanding and in favor of this move. That their feeling is the lower classes have become complacent and entitled. That there’s genuine concern about professionalism and respect slipping badly. And that while there are obvious reasons for the slippage, it nonetheless must be addressed.

It’s one mid’s perspective. And she admittedly has a small and self-selected sample. But by virtue of DD’s billet — her current one and the one upcoming — she has an ear to the ground with both midshipmen leadership and academy leadership. So what she’s saying isn’t coming out of left field.
 
MidCakePa said:
Spoke this evening with DD, a soon-to-be firstie. She said that her class is generally understanding and in favor of this move. That their feeling is the lower classes have become complacent and entitled. That there’s genuine concern about professionalism and respect slipping badly. And that while there are obvious reasons for the slippage, it nonetheless must be addressed.

It’s one mid’s perspective. And she admittedly has a small and self-selected sample. But by virtue of DD’s billet — her current one and the one upcoming — she has an ear to the ground with both midshipmen leadership and academy leadership. So what she’s saying isn’t coming out of left field.
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I have heard from our plebe that there is complacency and apathy within some mids. Maybe that has always been true.

I am seeing it in my high school students at a much higher rate than normal for teens prior to Covid lockdowns and virtual learning.
Whether this may be true within the brigade I don’t know. But if it is, where does the buck stop? Is it company leadership that failed? Is it academy leadership? Is it a pandemic that left us all holding our cajones and building our respective planes while flying them?
Every cohort at the academy to include 2020 is directly affected by this pandemic and the lack of well thought out, planned training and mentoring they would have had prior to this debacle. They are all operating without a playbook. Mids included.
 
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Agreed. The failure lies with leadership, including 2021 and 2022, as much, and more than, it does with 2023 and 2024.

They should be taking a long, hard look in the mirror.
 
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FutureAdademyDad? said:
The failure lies with with leadership, including 2021 and 2022, as much, and more than, it does with 2023 and 2024.
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Not exactly sure or clear about what the “failure” is here.

As @NavyHoops, @Capt MJ, @Old Navy BGO, @OldRetSWO — all veterans of the USNA experience — have said, shotguns and scrambles are normal if sporadic parts of the academy experience. They were happening long before any pandemic hit. And they’ll happen long after this pandemic is gone. The mids survive and are better for the experience.

Did academy leadership handle the pandemic perfectly? Of course not. Did they do the best they could with the information they had? I believe so. Are a lot of people looking back and saying they would have done differently and better if put in the same position? Absolutely — and isn’t it nice to have the luxury of 20/20 hindsight.

If there indeed was a failure, then I credit leadership with trying to do something about it. Real leadership is about doing the hard right and not the easy wrong. Some of the best decisions are also highly unpopular. Such is life.
 
I was at USNA that had a class that had been shot gunned after Plebe Year, then scrambled after 3/C year and then some were shotgunned before 1/C. Not all, just some. They were a fun group, seriously, not even sarcasm in that. That class was a lot of fun. My class just got shotgunned. I went from a very ‘tough’ strict company to one that had a terrible reputation and was known as behind east and unprofessional. 1/C year we were second in color points. Culture changes, leadership changes, traditions morph and grow.
 
My point is taking to task the statement that the lower classes have become "complacent and entitled".

If so, the responsibility for that falls at the feet of leadership.

Period.
 
I just spent some time digging for one of the Supe’s statements from around March of last year, when it had become clear life as we all knew it was changing rapidly, and tough decisions had to be made.

I didn’t find it, but the one I am talking about is where he introduces his strategic vision:
- Graduate 2020
- Bring in 2024
- Educate and train the other classes
- Health is paramount

Every tactical leadership decision on how things would be done/not done has been done with those strategic pillars in mind. “Nice to have” events and long-standing traditions went out the window. Expectations and assumptions were universally disrupted.

Everyone, but everyone, is grumbling out loud or internally (because leaders do their best to project calm in the midst of a poopstorm, cue Tom Hanks in “Greyhound”), and the suck is universal, intense and seemingly never-ending.

It has been and is still messy, ugly, difficult, awash in conflicting guidance from on high, with no precedents to rely on, no playbook, no gouge, the science emerging in real-time, decisions being made with the best info on hand in a danged-if-you-do-danged-if-you-don’t-critics-on-all-sides environment, with barrages of email, calls and other communications coming from Navy senior leadership, Maryland leadership, Navy medicine, other SAs, the Fleet, parents, alumni, with exhausted staff trying to figure this out on the fly - and not just USNA, across all Navy schoolhouses, shore commands and operating units. Leadership in circumstances like this tests every tool in the toolkit to the breaking point.

Mids do not realize this, but they are soaking up insights into just how difficult leadership is in an operationally dynamic situation, even for seniors who have advanced toolkits.

Morale is low at the moment. The good thing is, midshipmen are 100% in charge of how they choose to feel about things they cannot control.

I’ve often posted these two readings when the going gets tough. Mids are learning to be resilient, resourceful and pragmatic in a real-world situation with a high suck factor. No case study this with a paper due mid-term, it is all most definitely real.
 
The point about a lack of professionalism and discipline is a generalization, but it is a problem with many mids in ‘23 and ‘24 in the eyes of the senior officers on the Yard. But I do think it’s not all their fault.

‘24 had several ROMs that interfered with training. The class of ‘23 missed out on the second half of spring semester and the first half of this most recent fall semester during the phased return, and got no summer trainings. 3/C have always been at a higher risk for conduct cases since they no longer are under continuous supervision while still having few privileges, but this year it’s even starker, along with the large number of physics honor cases.

Fumbling past a field grade officer in the hall instead of confidently greeting is common from a Plebe during first semester, but when a lot of 3/C make mistakes in professionalism like that, it is seen as a lack of training, which again is not even their fault, but still it exists. Then there’s all the stuff anonymously posted on social media which undermines good order and discipline. In general there is a concern that companies have become isolated bubbles during covid leading to some unhealthy habits. One example explained to my company was a room full of plebes recently caught drinking in the hall. Supposedly there’s been a significant uptick in lapses of judgement like that.

These aren’t my concerns, this is just how the senior officers on the Yard view the situation. The scramble is not meant to be a punishment but rather a way to force these mids and all 30 companies to rebuild their reputations. Will it work? I’ll leave that for more experienced minds than mine.
 
NavyHoops said:
Not normally, but I have seen 50% or more get replaced in depts or ships. I have seen entire new crewe if someone is a plankowner. The culture will be there. The 1/C will establish it.
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My first ship was a precom (new ship) and some of us, especially the nuke officers were onboard for a year or two before commissioning. We commissioned and then did 7 or 8 months of a variety of new-ship type certifications and then went back to the shipyard for a preplanned "Post Shakedown Availability" which was 6 months long. We had so many of our Plankowner (original crew) Officers leave that it was difficult to create experienced watchteams when we first went to sea. This was a cruiser (larger and more senior group) but we were Port and Starboard for OODs for a couple of weeks until experienced SWOs got re-qualified for the watchstations. FWIW, all three line Department Heads had switched as well as almost all of the experienced LTs. For this discussion, it was just about a complete leadership change.
 
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