Summer Seminar SAT/ACT

On the Summer Seminar application, are standardized test scores optional? Do they play a big role in the selection process? DD's scores are a "work in progress." Thanks for any advice!

It plays a role when choosing similar applicants. But not the most important factor for summer selection. Summer is to seek out who can benefit the most from the program. But. SAT/ACT will open your official file if high enough. I believe ACT 27+ or SAT 1100 would qualify for Juniors. But may need higher score for Seniors to open Apps to advance to next level, this is subject to your district competitiveness and your ethnic group. Thus, can demand much higher score. I believe URMs and female applicants get second hard look. Good luck to your kid.

CrewDad said:

It plays a role when choosing similar applicants. But not the most important factor for summer selection. Summer is to seek out who can benefit the most from the program. But. SAT/ACT will open your official file if high enough. I believe ACT 27+ or SAT 1100 would qualify for Juniors. But may need higher score for Seniors to open Apps to advance to next level, this is subject to your district competitiveness and your ethnic group. Thus, can demand much higher score. I believe URMs and female applicants get second hard look. Good luck to your kid.

Click to expand...

Thanks CrewDad. Do you think if junior applicants list their SAT, it is automatically assumed by USAFA that they will be taken again? She doesn't want to sink her application if scores will come up in March.

If she has something she’s comfortable submitting now you should submit now. I wouldn’t submit score if it is under 27. You can still qualify AFASS with school grades. You can always update scores until Apps close on Jan 31 2019. If she has ACT 29+ SAT 1300+ and has overall strong package, she may be invited to compete for Merit Scholarship which offers Air ticket and Free Seminar. If invited she will be asked to submit CFA done by March. So in addition to consideration to AFASS she can be ID’d as someone they want to follow and ID to encourage to complete App early and for LOA consideration. So many Merit Scholars are considered for LOA if they continue to maintain strong package when they start their Part 2 App for Appointment in July. For example, my DS applied with 31 ACT to AFASS and got selected for Merit Scholar after, upon invitation, turning in additional Essays and CFA and school transcript and Recommendation. For his final score he turned in 34 ACT. So you can continue to upgrade your package until the deadline.

CrewDad said:

If she has something she’s comfortable submitting now you should submit now. I wouldn’t submit score if it is under 27. You can still qualify AFASS with school grades. You can always update scores until Apps close on Jan 31 2019. If she has ACT 29+ SAT 1300+ and has overall strong package, she may be invited to compete for Merit Scholarship which offers Air ticket and Free Seminar. If invited she will be asked to submit CFA done by March. So in addition to consideration to AFASS she can be ID’d as someone they want to follow and ID to encourage to complete App early and for LOA consideration. So many Merit Scholars are considered for LOA if they continue to maintain strong package when they start their Part 2 App for Appointment in July. For example, my DS applied with 31 ACT to AFASS and got selected for Merit Scholar after, upon invitation, turning in additional Essays and CFA and school transcript and Recommendation. For his final score he turned in 34 ACT. So you can continue to upgrade your package until the deadline.

Click to expand...

What does a 27 convert to in SAT score? Thanks for the help!

A score of 24 on the ACT is the minimum to open a candidate file, not 27.

Stealth_81

As many have said on posts I would not bet on min standard to get by. I believe Dadx4 is seeking a competitive package as DD opens the Package. To that end, I recommend to open with USAFA +/- Avg Test Score and not the bottom 5% score. My estimate for 27 Composite is about 1150.

Dadx4. Here’s what I got on the conversion chart. 27 = 1260-1290. It’s higher than what I thought. Pretty good score. This is Composite only. If you break the subjects down, you can end up with a very different score. Especially when you super score. And if interested in the Navy and Coast Guard, they only consider English and Math so you can have higher or lower combined scores.

https://www.studypoint.com/ed/sat-act-concordance/

If she has ACT 29+ SAT 1300+ and has overall strong package, she may be invited to compete for Merit Scholarship which offers Air ticket and Free Seminar. If invited she will be asked to submit CFA done by March. So in addition to consideration to AFASS she can be ID’d as someone they want to follow and ID to encourage to complete App early and for LOA consideration. So many Merit Scholars are considered for LOA if they continue to maintain strong package when they start their Part 2 App for Appointment in July. For example, my DS applied with 31 ACT to AFASS and got selected for Merit Scholar after, upon invitation, turning in additional Essays and CFA and school transcript and Recommendation. For his final score he turned in 34 ACT.

@CrewDad what is the ‘merit scholar’ (and airfare, etc) you mention? Do you mean USAFA has a merit scholar program? And is this only for their summer seminar program?

I will let CrewDad answer for himself, but I have never heard of a scholars program for Summer Seminar. Once a candidate is selected for Summer Seminar, there is an opportunity to request financial aid for the $300 cost of Summer Seminar. There is a limited amount of funding to fill these requests and it is based on applicant's situation and demonstrated financial need. I have not heard of airfare being provided for Summer Seminar but that doesn't mean it cannot happen.

Stealth_81

Why are you so worried about Summer Seminar? It will have zero affect on the treasured appointment.

Summer Merit Scholar Award is a targeted award by the Academy to recruit HYPO Candidates and it is not need based. It is merit based so you can be a rich kid poor kid white hispanic black Asian different doesn’t matter. Admissions use this opportunity to target candidates they want to recruit and encourage them to complete the package in their senior year. They will pick you, you can’t pick them. You have to be invited to compete after you have been selected to the program. About 150 out of 700 accepted candidates are invited and about 30 are selected. To be successful to the final you just have to be prepared to provide more to the package except DODMERB and Nomination. You have to complete your CFA, additional essays, high quality classes GPA with official transcripts, high ACT/SAT (especially in English and Math 32-36 or 750-800 each sections this is what they like to see not a must have, they care less about Reading Science) recommendations, strong foot print in athletics and leaderships. So if selected to the program you have a better idea where you stand with potential Appointment. Scholars have separate admissions session with Admissions Director and your regional commander to provide more direct contact and meet and greet opportunity. My DS was given a private session with his Regional Director after he had a separate group session. I decided to attend the private session on the last day after parents attended the dinner the day before. It’s a great way to complete your package with possible LOA offer in Aug-Dec.

Need based is a separate ask if you need financial assistance. You can ask but not guaranteed. All Academies offer some limited need based assistance. I hope this was helpful.

CrewDad said:

Summer Merit Scholar Award is a targeted award by the Academy to recruit HYPO Candidates and it is not need based. It is merit based so you can be a rich kid poor kid white hispanic black Asian different doesn’t matter. Admissions use this opportunity to target candidates they want to recruit and encourage them to complete the package in their senior year. They will pick you, you can’t pick them. You have to be invited to compete after you have been selected to the program. About 150 out of 700 accepted candidates are invited and about 30 are selected. To be successful to the final you just have to be prepared to provide more to the package except DODMERB and Nomination. You have to complete your CFA, additional essays, high quality classes GPA with official transcripts, high ACT/SAT (especially in English and Math 32-36 or 750-800 each sections this is what they like to see not a must have, they care less about Reading Science) recommendations, strong foot print in athletics and leaderships. So if selected to the program you have a better idea where you stand with potential Appointment. Scholars have separate admissions session with Admissions Director and your regional commander to provide more direct contact and meet and greet opportunity. My DS was given a private session with his Regional Director after he had a separate group session. I decided to attend the private session on the last day after parents attended the dinner the day before. It’s a great way to complete your package with possible LOA offer in Aug-Dec.

Need based is a separate ask if you need financial assistance. You can ask but not guaranteed. All Academies offer some limited need based assistance. I hope this was helpful.

Click to expand...

Whoa, had no idea! I’ve been here over a year and never seen or heard this referenced. Very interesting. Puts a different spin on the old “does summer seminar matter” debate. What does HYPO mean?

fencersmother said:

Why are you so worried about Summer Seminar? It will have zero affect on the treasured appointment.

Click to expand...

I did t get the sense that OP was “so worried”, rather they were inquiring about an strategy to setting themselves up for the best look ultimately FOR an appointment.

DS was I this same position when he applied for SS. He had only tested once to see where he was at. His scores did nit represent his best effort. He chose to NOT start his candidate package with his SS application.

As I recall, he didn’t have this option when applying for NASS. Ultimately he was candidate for both.

Lots and lots and lots of debate about whether the summer programs “matter”. Perhaps as a line item on a checklist that either service academy looks at, the official answer is ‘no’. However, at least in our case, DS received at least one of his (3 noms, 2 of them principals and one ranked),from a senator that specifically said (paraphrasing) ‘we need to add points (or credit, or whatever their process is...) for attending SS Bc is show interest, dedication, exposure, and desire to attend the academy’ (I heard these words spoken to him at a meet and greet).

So I am confident that at least periodically, attending helped as it help him with his receipt of his nomination. He is a happy Plebe now.

justdoit19 said:

Whoa, had no idea! I’ve been here over a year and never seen or heard this referenced. Very interesting. Puts a different spin on the old “does summer seminar matter” debate. What does HYPO mean?

Click to expand...

HYPO High Potential. It is a term often used in the corporate world to target and ID potential future star managers. USAFA also has a unique Scholar program for select few after Plebes complete their first half. Most don’t know about it because most are not invited and they don’t make it public. It started experimentally 4 years ago. About 35 Plebes are privately invited that they maybe selected into their Scholar program at the end of Fall Term. If selected and want to be in the program, you will be in an entirely different program with its own independent cohort and a dedicated academic Advisor for the remaining 3.5 years. You can build your own 3.5 year curriculum with your Academic Advisor to meet your academic goals. Many take more Social Science and Humanities or create their own Engineering program. The goal is to produce Rhodes, Marshall, Gates Scholars from the Program. Only condition is to retain min 3.7 GPA. If falls below you go back to the normal program. Other Academies have no equal yet. USNA has Trident Scholars where all top 15% of the class can be Trident Scholars. You are automatically considered in your 2/C. Trident Scholars participate in independent research and produce their thesis around their research and compete among Trident Scholars for the best research. Tridents are honored at the Academy and throughout their Naval Career. It is proven by Navy stats that Tridents advance significantly better in their Naval Career, many reaching O6 and higher. This is normally open to all Supe Scholars. USMA has something similar and it is open to their top 6% of the class. Purpose of these programs are to offer an environment for deeper Scholar research and interaction with faculty and the Air Force, Navy, and the Army Innovations.

Just to add to the does SS matter debate: DS was waitlisted last year for AFASS and eventually was turned down. He was also waitlisted for AIM and SLE and was turned down as well. (He did get into NASS and loved it) He was disappointed and was worried he was not competitive.

He received an LOA from the USAFA Saturday (Merry Christmas!). A turn down for SS does not equal no chance of appointment.

As others have said it is a recruiting tool and nobody really knows why some get selected and some do not. Just put together the best app you can and if you get to go have a great time!

BBQ-Devil said:

Just to add to the does SS matter debate: DS was waitlisted last year for AFASS and eventually was turned down. He was also waitlisted for AIM and SLE and was turned down as well. (He did get into NASS and loved it) He was disappointed and was worried he was not competitive.

He received an LOA from the USAFA Saturday (Merry Christmas!). A turn down for SS does not equal no chance of appointment.

As others have said it is a recruiting tool and nobody really knows why some get selected and some do not. Just put together the best app you can and if you get to go have a great time!

Click to expand...

Good to know!!!

fencersmother said:

Why are you so worried about Summer Seminar? It will have zero affect on the treasured appointment.

Click to expand...

She would like to see if it's a good fit for her. And she sent the scores with her SS app but did not make her SS app into an admissions app. Scores were too low.

@Dadx4, unless I’m terribly uninformed, SS applications automatically become appointment applications. I don’t believe you have any say in that. But as @fencersmother says, don’t sweat the test scores. USAFA knows that most candidates will be updating their scores over time.

MidCakePa said:

@Dadx4, unless I’m terribly uninformed, SS applications automatically become appointment applications. I don’t believe you have any say in that. But as @fencersmother says, don’t sweat the test scores. USAFA knows that most candidates will be updating their scores over time.

Click to expand...

I'm not sure. She said there was a specific question whether applicants wanted to use SS app as Admissions app. She checked no because of the low scores.