Blessedmom
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Oh do Plebes get cut from D & B Corps? I thought DS made the band...I guess he didn't. So is Plebe Summer just try out & good Plebes get selected?
2020 class profile?
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Memphis9489
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I may have this wrong, but wasn't the Naval Academy bragging about how the class of 2019 didn't have a single Plebe quit during Plebe Summer - the first time in history? Quite frankly, I was amazed by that. If 13 members of the class of 2020 have already quit, just two weeks in, it's hard to make the argument that they are the "most competitive class". Either the class of 2020 isn't as good as the Admissions Department anticipated, or the class of 2016 was really easy on the class of 2019.
MiddyB
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I may have this wrong, but wasn't the Naval Academy bragging about how the class of 2019 didn't have a single Plebe quit during Plebe Summer - the first time in history? Quite frankly, I was amazed by that. If 13 members of the class of 2020 have already quit, just two weeks in, it's hard to make the argument that they are the "most competitive class". Either the class of 2020 isn't as good as the Admissions Department anticipated, or the class of 2016 was really easy on the class of 2019.
Not a single female dropped during '19 PS.
Memphis9489
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I would think the main criteria for making the D&B is not whether you're a "good Plebe" but, rather, if you can competently play the required instrument.
Memphis9489
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Oh, thanks! That sounds right. I think I do remember it being females only. Tough girls!
I really have no idea. When I looked online I realized that there was a Plebe Summer D &B AND the USNA D &B. I just noticed the numbers didn't match up, that's all. Hopefully they will all get to stay on if they choose! I think the plebe D &B will perform at PPW!!!!!
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D&B takes a LOT of time away from company, and a lot of time, period, so many plebes do not continue with it after the summer. I always had/still have the utmost respect for USNA D&B and the handful who stick with it the entire 4 years. They do have their nicknames and are on the butt end of gentle ribbing from other mids, but they are respected for their commitment. I have watched D&B size vary over the years, so my guess is that if they are competent with their instrument and have the desire, they can continue with D&B.
The term "band" at USNA is generally used in reference to the Naval Academy Band, a regular non-mid Navy Band.
https://www.usna.edu/USNABand/
That particular Plebe was a prior who was originally from South Dakota. One of the parents from our parent group met her fiancé at the hotel and told us that we had another SD Plebe that we hadn't known about. She had enlisted four years ago and had been serving as some kind of Aviation Electronics Technician (or something like that). By the following day when we had tracked down her mom to tell her about our parent group, she told us that her daughter had "enrolled yesterday morning and opted out last night." I'm not sure if it was hard to look around and see that you were surrounded by what must seem like a lot of kids, or if it was the thought of not being able to marry the fiancé for four years, or what? I also wondered if she would have been allowed to continue the relationship with the fiancé since he is an enlisted sailor? Are Mids allowed to date enlisted personnel?
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No. There have been a few threads on this recently. USNA in general follows Navy fraternization regs, and in MidRegs, it is specifically addressed. You will hear the term "prior relationship," but that only applies if two mids are dating, and one graduates before the other to become an ensign or 2LT, they can continue. Officers can't date mids otherwise. Plebes can date other plebes and civilians. Upperclass can date each other and civilians. It can become an issue for prior enlisted who have a relationship with a currently serving enlisted member, or a right-from-HS plebe has a HS BF/GF who enlisted.
While many, many priors come direct or via NAPS to USNA and handle the abrupt lifestyle change very well, keeping an eye on the long-term goal of a commission, many who had an off-base apartment, "stuff," car, relative freedom, steady relationship, more money - it's just too much to give up. Plebes, even if 21, cannot drink alcohol on liberty. They can't drive a car even if BF/GF comes to visit, or wear civvies when they do.
The enlisted member you mention is no doubt smart and a top performer, otherwise, she wouldn't have gained the support of her command to compete for an appointment. She has the potential to do well in her enlisted career, gain her degree through other Enlisted Commissioning Programs or use Tuition Assistance. This is not unusual. It's the "yeah...no" when the real nature of SA life and impact on personal relationships stares them in the face.
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Yes the AC year is much harder than Plebe Summer. You slowly realize during PS the yelling doesn't matter and you can PT all day. Sure it's hot and sucks, but you don't have to think much except what they tell you. I know that's hard to fathom for new Plebes and parents right now. The AC year is longer, harder in a totally different way and responsibilities are greater. You get a lot less sleep and it's not 5 weeks and Mom & Dad show up, it's long months with sometimes weeks between Liberty when obligations and duty get added in. Don't worry, they will make it thru like all of us have. They will be better for it.
13 Plebes is still incredibly low. Don't feel bad for them, it is what is best. To leave this early means they were there for the wrong reasons and I don't want those who don't want to be there in the future leading Sailors and Marines. They deserve better. It doesn't mean they aren't great, smart kids, it means they picked the wrong future and it's a good thing they realized it. It's why all of old grads always say candidates must own this process themselves. It's also why we focus on other topics besides the academics because that is why they leave and what their future holds. I come from the years that had 25% or more attrition for a class. You can tell when someone starts to doubt themselves and leaves for the wrong reasons. That does happen. I had several friends and classmates leave and apply to come back. But they did it 3/C year not week 2. A few actually became Tango Detailers as they had a unique perspective to give and talk to Plebes.
Capt MJ nailed D&B. They spend a lot of time and get some ribbing for it. Some realize they want to do other things or just don't want that time commitment. They really don't cut Plebes it's more self selection.
13 Plebes is still incredibly low. Don't feel bad for them, it is what is best. To leave this early means they were there for the wrong reasons and I don't want those who don't want to be there in the future leading Sailors and Marines. They deserve better. It doesn't mean they aren't great, smart kids, it means they picked the wrong future and it's a good thing they realized it. It's why all of old grads always say candidates must own this process themselves. It's also why we focus on other topics besides the academics because that is why they leave and what their future holds. I come from the years that had 25% or more attrition for a class. You can tell when someone starts to doubt themselves and leaves for the wrong reasons. That does happen. I had several friends and classmates leave and apply to come back. But they did it 3/C year not week 2. A few actually became Tango Detailers as they had a unique perspective to give and talk to Plebes.
Capt MJ nailed D&B. They spend a lot of time and get some ribbing for it. Some realize they want to do other things or just don't want that time commitment. They really don't cut Plebes it's more self selection.
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It gets harder for all the reasons posted above and drops or separations continue to happen right up to graduation. Compare the number of incoming Plebes to that classes' graduating numbers to get a feel for how each class shrinks. This year, over 1,300 new cadets showed up on R-Day at USMA for an expected graduating class of around 1,000 which is the target each year.
Scuttlebutt at army is that drops have reached 25 so far.
Lukieboy06
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This was shared to the parents last IDay
HopefulDad3210
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Yes on your opening comment. My son's main comment on the phone call was "it's not like they're grading me on this. I'll get through it". I'm sure academic year is a different story obviously. He knows that too, at least intellectually. Who knows when it hits him in the face.
Well technically he is graded. At USNA there are different grades... Academic, performance, and military grades. Conduct plays into these too. Plebe summer they get a performance grade, but it's not really used for much if anything. All Mids are ranked each semester based upon performance against their peers in their company. It's a learning exercise as the military works this way and the 1/C are responsible for presenting this to the company officer each semester. Nothing to worry about for a New Plebe. They are learning the system.
hopeful1998
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I recently sent my plebe son the transcript of Seal Commander and Admiral William McRaven's commencement speech at UT Austin. In the letter, I highlighted the comment of "you have to get over being a sugar cookie". That speech is filled with so much wisdom and optimism - I highly recommend plebes, parents or anyone to google it, watch it, read it, take it to heart and send your plebe a copy. …….and stop being a sugar cookie
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Good stuff in there, but I couldn't disagree with you more that it doesn't get better. It gets dramatically better. My Firstie will tell you it gets better, and I'm certain my Plebe will say the same as time goes on.
It gets much better. It's still incredibly difficult but the experience of a lifetime.
And when I say strongly that it gets better, I do not mean that it gets easier. Here's the only advice I've given my two sons: The only real difference between you and them is that they know what comes next. When you start to learn what comes next, things will slow down and it will be better and not quite as hard.