ASTB Minimums Change

Discussion in 'Naval Academy - USNA' started by Juvat, Apr 24, 2018.

Tags:
  1. Juvat

    Juvat Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2014
    Messages:
    190
    Likes Received:
    102
    Just learned from my 2019 Mid that ASTB (Aviation Selection Test Battery) score minimums have been increased for Pilot and NFO hopefuls. This is causing some 2019'ers to retake the exam before service selection in a few months in order to meet the new minimums. Semper Gumby...
     
    reapplicant_2017 likes this.
  2. MidwestDad

    MidwestDad Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2017
    Messages:
    584
    Likes Received:
    396
    Meanwhile USAF is desperately short on pilots . . .
     
  3. SCMids

    SCMids Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2016
    Messages:
    145
    Likes Received:
    167
    Worse than that. You can take the test three times. Some have done so to get the old score. If their score isn’t good enough under the new number and if they’ve taken it 3 times already, they’re screwed.
     
    Juvat likes this.
  4. Nemo567

    Nemo567 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2017
    Messages:
    169
    Likes Received:
    136
    What are the new standards?
     
  5. Juvat

    Juvat Member

    Joined:
    Aug 11, 2014
    Messages:
    190
    Likes Received:
    102
    Not sure of the new minimums but my Mid is now no longer qualified for Pilot nor NFO and has to retake the exam. She is not too happy about this.
     
  6. NavyHoops

    NavyHoops Super Moderator 5-Year Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2011
    Messages:
    5,801
    Likes Received:
    6,130
    Navy is struggling on pilots too. Be curious as to their reasoning. So many aids for training and help with the Internet, I am sure they will adapt. Part of the gig of being in the military. If they have taken it 3 times and were qualified previously I think it sucks they aren’t letting them take it again with the change in score.
     
    Juvat likes this.
  7. Nemo567

    Nemo567 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2017
    Messages:
    169
    Likes Received:
    136
    Navy may be struggling for pilots in the fleet, but the flight school pipeline is really backed up at the moment. It's an output and retention issue, not an intake one.
     
  8. NavyHoops

    NavyHoops Super Moderator 5-Year Member

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2011
    Messages:
    5,801
    Likes Received:
    6,130
    Always has been. Been that way for a long time. Air Force has the same issue. Retention bonuses are higher than they have ever been on the Navy side.
     
  9. Hurricane12

    Hurricane12 USNA 2012 5-Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Messages:
    848
    Likes Received:
    451
    As alluded to above, the Navy may not be hurting for SNAs and is just being choosy because they can.

    The other possibility is that they have determined that students meeting the lower standard do not perform adequately in flight school. Contrary to what candidates might think, the Navy wants people to succeed once they’ve started investing in them. They are always collecting data on who succeeds, who fails, and why. To save everyone time and the Navy money, it makes sense to only bring in those with a good chance of success.
    A nasty truth here is that the ASTB ain’t hard. Someone who struggles on the ASTB will likely struggle with flight school. There may have been a determination that people above the new score generally perform better/pass at a higher rate than those at the new standard.

    Navy manning is unwieldy, awkward and reactionary, but it’s normally not arbitrary.
     
    Juvat likes this.
  10. pleber16

    pleber16 USNA 2016 5-Year Member

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2012
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    193
    My guess is it’s a combo of what nemo and hurricane said. All the pipelines are backed up. Almost a year ago we were told there would be fewer slots for the class of 18 to help with that.

    There’s also a new policy from CNATRA that any SNA or SNFO that hits 3 failures (starting with IFS all the way until you wing) and it’s an automatic ticket to an Initial Progress Check, which is only about 2 steps away from a decision to attrite or retain a student. So I wouldn’t be surprised if the new score requirements are tied to that.
     
  11. Hurricane12

    Hurricane12 USNA 2012 5-Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2011
    Messages:
    848
    Likes Received:
    451
    Pleber, out of curiosity do you mean three cumulative failures? As in you could pink sheet one event each in API, primary, and advanced and be sent to an IPC? Interesting...
     
  12. pleber16

    pleber16 USNA 2016 5-Year Member

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2012
    Messages:
    238
    Likes Received:
    193
    Yes, exactly. I personally don't think it's a great policy, nor do any of my classmates I've talked to.
     
  13. MidwestDad

    MidwestDad Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2017
    Messages:
    584
    Likes Received:
    396
    What % / how many aviation slots are typical for USNA graduating class?
    USAFA is over 50% now I believe.
     
    Skipper07 likes this.
  14. Skipper07

    Skipper07 Member

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2017
    Messages:
    142
    Likes Received:
    149
    From a thread about USNA ‘17:
     

    Attached Files:

  15. Harbor1

    Harbor1 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2013
    Messages:
    49
    Likes Received:
    11
    The new Minimum ASTB is 5-6-6, but to what it all stands for in the end, who knows. During briefs it was said to get a Powered flight training block would be based mainly on the ASTB, a score of 8-8-9 which was in the top 2% and med qualified for all airframes didn't get powered flight, but rather a 2nd choice Aviation cruise, but another mid in the same company who didn't even list as a requested training, nor wants to select Pilot or NFO was scheduled for it.
     
  16. Cerberi

    Cerberi Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2015
    Messages:
    748
    Likes Received:
    858
    USAF is short of experienced pilots. Retention is the issue not lowering standards to get more candidates into the pipeline.

    I think USN and USMC are also short on experienced pilots.
     
  17. pilot2b

    pilot2b 5-Year Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2011
    Messages:
    329
    Likes Received:
    16
    Don't know how long it will take to be introduced, but the next generation of the ASTB is being developed/tested currently.