Just got off the phone with Liason

J

Jamienemomin

5-Year Member
Joined
Jul 31, 2013
Messages
4
He told me about the ranks of a candidate and that I was placed on a competitive status. There are candidates that are qualified and admissible. My CDC told me that my application is not as strong as it should be for it to be considered qualified and admissible (I did not get an LOA). My entire application is complete and I'm waiting for my interviews.

He told me that if I rock the interviews and get the appointment from them, I will be considered admissible by WP?

I am currently :confused::confused: as to what I can do to strengthen my file... It has been my dream since I was a child to get into WP and those words had brought things to perspective.

Respectfully,
Jamie Min
 
Jamienemomin said:
He told me about the ranks of a candidate and that I was placed on a competitive status. There are candidates that are qualified and admissible. My CDC told me that my application is not as strong as it should be for it to be considered qualified and admissible (I did not get an LOA). My entire application is complete and I'm waiting for my interviews.

He told me that if I rock the interviews and get the appointment from them, I will be considered admissible by WP?

I am currently :confused::confused: as to what I can do to strengthen my file... It has been my dream since I was a child to get into WP and those words had brought things to perspective.

Respectfully,
Jamie Min
Click to expand...

Well, it seems like it would have been a good question to ask the liason. Not knowing what your app looks like it's hard to say, but I expect the best area to have a big impact at this late date is to improve SAT/ACT scores.
 
Repost....

I agree with Kinnem. The best way to elevate yourself is to retake the ACT/SAT test again. And again. Here is the formula how points are generated for your WCS.


This is how WP adds up a WCS. "Whole Candidate Score" This is part of the formula they use to grade a candidate who has opened a file.

Academics (60%)
Class rank (15 points)
SAT score (35)
High School Grades (10)
Extra points for Valedictorian/National Honor Society/National Merit Scholar

Leadership (30%)
School Leadership – extra points for class or student body president
Eagle Scout/Gold Star Girls Scout
Boys and Girls State
Athletic Participation – Team Captain Status
Team sports

Fitness CFA (10%)

Being a recruited athlete /Under Represented Minority/Active Service can fall in to different category pertaining to WP Class compositions.

The standardized testing is a huge part of WCS and it is important to do your very very best and take the tests multiply times. My DS has taken ACT/SAT 8 times.

This is how WP breaks it down.

WP thinks your high school rank is more important than your GPA. However, to have a high rank (top 15%) you need a great GPA.

Also to improve your WCS, get those SAT/ACT scores as high as you can.

Again, resist comparing yourself to others. What is more important is ask yourself, "Have I Done My Very Best, How Can I Improve?"


Push Hard, Press Forward
 
Think about this....

A Plan B has always been encouraged here on the SAF. Your case is not alone. Now you understand there is no substitute for hard work in school. There are no secret codes hidden in paragraphs here. If you’re serious about wanting to attend WP you will need to reformulate your plan. I challenge you to research the thought attending a prep school as “non sponsored or free agent” student or maybe you can find a scholarship to one of many prep schools. They well certainly polish you up and if you work hard, WP will recognize this.

It’s worth considering.

Push Hard, Press Forward
 
And of course ROTC as a scholarship cadet or college programmer are other viable plan Bs. Not too late to execute on those if you are not doing so already. I agree with tug on asking yourself if this is the best you can do. If it is, stand proudly. I believe this thinking also applies to plan B, whatever it may be.
 
Academics, academics, academics

it is what they want, the other stuff is important, but if you don't have at least a 32 on the ACt or 2100 on the SAT, and rank top 10-15% in your class, you don't have much of a chance, unless you area a recruited athlete, or fall into the "underrepresented" group i.e. female, or racial minority--you still need decent scores because it doesn't help the student or WP if you are in that group and can't cut it academically.
 
lemlac said:
Academics, academics, academics

it is what they want, the other stuff is important, but if you don't have at least a 32 on the ACt or 2100 on the SAT, and rank top 10-15% in your class, you don't have much of a chance, unless you area a recruited athlete, or fall into the "underrepresented" group i.e. female, or racial minority--you still need decent scores because it doesn't help the student or WP if you are in that group and can't cut it academically.
Click to expand...

While I agree generally with what you are saying, I disagree with this:
lemlac said:
.....if you don't have at least a 32 on the ACt or 2100 on the SAT, and rank top 10-15% in your class, you don't have much of a chance....
Click to expand...

True- academics is 60% of your WCS and you should make the best grades you can taking the hardest classes you can take at your school. You should also take the SAT/ACT multiple times to reach your highest superscore, but to tell a candidate (not a recruited athlete or URM) with a 29 ACT or a 1900 SAT in the top 25% of their class that they don't have a chance, is un-neccesarily discouraging.
Nominations play a large role too. You can have lower scores/class rank than 32ACT/2100SAT and still be 3Q'd. Throw in a Principle nomination and you have an appointment. You can have higher scores than 32ACT/2100SAT and still not be the #1 on your MOCs slate, be put on the NWL and not come off - IOW - no appointment.
There have been times where I've scratched my head on offered candidates and also on those not offered an appointment. There are so many moving parts between both admissions and nominations.
Give WP your best file. Do the best YOU can do in every area of your file. Your best is your best. Finish and submit your file as early as you can, then wait and see what happens.
 
I agree buff81. If my DS truly believed in the high ACT/SAT scores 100%, he never would have applied. We know that, in his case, he truly may not make the cut(and he has known this from Day1), and we have excellent Plan B's, already with some great merit scholarship offers. The thing is, he is determined, and has already passed a few hurdles we thought he would not, so we won't give up hope until.....Beast starts! Will he struggle academically if he is offered an appointment? Maybe a bit more than the top candidates, however, determination plays a huge role in success. I have seen it academically, on the sports field, and in the "real life" work force.
 
tug_boat said:
This is how WP adds up a WCS. "Whole Candidate Score"

Academics (60%)
Class rank (15 points)
SAT score (35)
High School Grades (10)
Extra points for Valedictorian/National Honor Society/National Merit Scholar

Leadership (30%)
School Leadership – extra points for class or student body president
Eagle Scout/Gold Star Girls Scout
Boys and Girls State
Athletic Participation – Team Captain Status
Team sports

Fitness CFA (10%)

Being a recruited athlete /Under Represented Minority/Active Service can fall in to different category pertaining to WP Class compositions.
Click to expand...

Tugboat, I haven't come across this formula information publicly anywhere in this level of detail. What's your source?
 
Legit info....

A tug boat captains heart is an ocean of secrets.....

Push Hard, Press Forward
 
This is the breakdown that FFRs are given on how WCS points are weighted:
60% Academics
1/2 class rank (or 30%)
1/2 SAT/ACT scores (30%)
30% Leadership
1/3 ECs (10%)
1/3 Athletics (10%)
1/3 SOEs (10%)
10% CFA

Everything has a certain # of points assigned to it.
ie. Class president = x # of pts, Captain of sports team = x # of points, Eagle scout = x # of pts, NHS = x# of pts, Boys/Girls State = x # of pts, editor of the school newspaper = x # of pts, member of the debate team = x # of pts etc, etc, etc.
The points and how they are weighted are what constitute the WCS.
GPA is not used at all in the academic evaluation. Only class rank and SAT/ACT scores. They will look at the candidate's transcript to determine the competitiveness of the school (which can be used to tweak the class rank) and also the classes that the school offers.

Class composition goals are set each year either by the Director of Admissions or the Supe (I can't remember which). These are % goals for leaders, soldiers, scholars, athletes, URMs and women. These are goals not quotas.
The NWL is used to help meet these goals. After the top 150 (per WCS) are taken off the NWL, WP can then fill the class regardless of WCS to help meet their class composition goals. WP is unique in this aspect in that USAFA and USNA don't have class composition goals (unless that has changed in the past couple of years).
 
lemlac said:
Academics, academics, academics

it is what they want, the other stuff is important, but if you don't have at least a 32 on the ACt or 2100 on the SAT, and rank top 10-15% in your class, you don't have much of a chance, unless you area a recruited athlete, or fall into the "underrepresented" group i.e. female, or racial minority--you still need decent scores because it doesn't help the student or WP if you are in that group and can't cut it academically.
Click to expand...

Don't forget about the Congressional nomination. One year in one Congressional district in MD, there was no qualified candidate for West Point. I have been plenty of candidates they don't have 32 SAT or 2100 SAT that are "regular" candidates get appointments. The threshold for getting academically qualified different from winning your Congressional district.

Typically "underrepresented" group are appointment in different categories so they don't affect Congressional competition.

Academics is important because West Point don't want to lose you. I believe academic failure is #1 reason for separation. In my opinion, West Point is not questioning anyone's desire or commitment. They are just accepting that there are only 24 hours a day. Once a cadet falls behind academically, it becomes harder and harder to catch up as requirements don't go away. There is no I am not going to play an intramural sports because I need to study. There is no this course is too hard so I am going to drop it. There is no I am going to major in English so no need for me to take Physics.
 
buff81 said:
This is the breakdown that FFRs are given on how WCS points are weighted:
60% Academics
1/2 class rank (or 30%)
1/2 SAT/ACT scores (30%)
30% Leadership
1/3 ECs (10%)
1/3 Athletics (10%)
1/3 SOEs (10%)
10% CFA
Click to expand...

Can someone tell me what the aggravations mean? I am new.
Thanks
 
Could you be more specific?
For example, do you want to know what WP looks for in ECs or Athletic activities?
 
Those 3 categories are under the Leadership portion of the file evaluation. Therefore, WP is looking for leadership potential in all of these areas.
They want to see that you have taken leadership roles in what you are involved in.

ECs (Extra-curriculars):
If you are in a club - be the president
If you are in Scouting - be an Eagle scout (Boy's) or Gold Award (Girl's)
If you are on a sports team - be the captain
If you are in student government - be the class president or student body president

Being the leader of one club will get you more points than being a member of many clubs.

Athletics:
WP values varsity team contact sports - like football.
It is better to be a leader (captain) of one sports team than a member of many.

SOEs ( School Official Evaluations):
These are not the typical letters of recommendation. SOEs are in the Leadership section of the file evaluation, so the questions asked of the Math, English and Chemistry or Physics teacher, are geared towards leadership potential.

In summary - be a leader in whatever you are involved in.
 
CFA - Candidate Fitness Assessment:
- pass/fail in that if you fail one portion of the CFA - you fail the whole test.
- the minimums are not published but if you score avg in each section, you will pass.
- don't go over the max. You will not get extra points for doing so. Stop once you reach the max and reserve your energy for the next section.
- if you can't pass the CFA - you will not be offered an appointment, no matter how glowing the rest of your file is.
 
Great info.
I was worried about only one sport, but his soccer is 12 months out of the year 4 times a week, He is the captain. He just does not have the time for other sports.
 
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