LOA vs Nomination

[chhappy]

Hi everyone! I was really honored and excited to see that I received a LOA from Navy yesterday. I was not expecting it at all, especially coming from an EXTREMELY competitive district (apparently the most competitive district in the US for Navy).

Receiving the LOA made me feel relieved knowing that Navy had approved of my application and the only thing I am waiting for is a nomination. I hear back earliest late January.

Unfortunately, I was only allowed to rank the academies for my congressman. The two senators I applied to only allowed me to choose one academy, and I chose another academy knowing that my state was hard. I am sort of stuck and realize that it might have been unwise of me to choose the other academy if I really wanted Navy, but I also knew I wanted to serve and commission at one of the two academies at the end of the day.

Is there any words of encouragement or advice? Thank you.

 

[creation123]

You might still be able to message your senators to change your first choice academy if you hear back in January, and I think that might be a good option if you really want USNA. Plus it couldn’t hurt to give them a sly mention of the LOA in that email which might boost your chances of getting that nomination especially in a competitive district

On that same note, definitely notify your district MOC of the LOA too. Worst case scenario they won’t care, best case your chances skyrocket.

good luck! you are definitely competitive for all 3 academies so dont sweat it regardless of what happens

 

[Academician]

I recommend the same; reach out to your MoCs and ask them for the USNA nomination in light of the LOA. The worst thing that happens is that they do not react in time. Good luck and congratulations!

 

[smokey%]

I was in the exact same situation and my senators and congressman reranked my order of preferences on their end of gave me new interview dates. Just email them notifying them of your LOA (include a copy in the email as well) and say that USNA is now your top choice. Best of luck!

 

[usna1985]

I definitely agree with contacting your MOCs. If you have already had your MOC interviews, this COULD be a hard ask. The reason is that the MOC committee compared you to others who had the same SA as their choice. So, for example, if you selected USMA, the committee evaluated you against the others that selected USMA. At this point, it's hard for them to go back and compare you against candidates who selected USNA. The MOC might even have entirely separate committees for each SA. If I were on the MOC nominating committee (and, in the past, I was on one) and we'd finished our job and given you a nom to your first choice SA, I would say: the candidate got his/her first choice; s/he should be happy; we're not going to revisit it (and take a nom away from someone else).

If, OTOH, they've not done their interviews, better chance. But you will get asked why you changed your preference.

Your best hope is that the MOC can "swap" your nom with someone on another slate. Some MOCs are willing to work through this; others aren't.

For the OP, if you received an LOA to USNA, hopefully you'll also receive one to the SA you listed as your first choice for the MOC. Or just receive an appointment. Then all will be good, because I assume you put as your first choice the SA that actually was your first choice.

For other candidates: my advice (which you're free to ignore but comes with decades of experience) is NEVER put down as a first choice with an MOC any SA that you do not 100% want to attend. If you are equally happy attending multiple SAs, then it's ok to pick the one you see as less competitive from an MOC standpoint in your area.

 

[phatman]

Concur w/ what others said, reach out ASAP to senator's office about preferences and let them know of LOA.

Anecdotal story: DS received LOA from USMA but had USNA as top of list for MOC nomination. He debated whether to alert MOC office for a while as he wanted to reorder USMA to top since he had that LOA from them (he wanted to avoid LOA but no nom and not get into either school), but by the time he reached out, it was too late as nominations were already determined. In the end, he received nom from congressperson and appointment to USMA (I believe there is a lot of back and forth discussion between MOC office and academies where they consider awarded LOAs). After Senate interview, he received LOA from USNA so IMMEDIATELY alerted Senator office of that. He is still torn between the two options and hopes to get Senate nomination to USNA so he has choice between two, but is grateful to be in one SA.

 

[IronmanDaremo]

My kid received an LOA in his first cycle at the end of November. He had already had one of his MoC interview panels, but not the other two. He immediately let the one he already held know that he had received the LOA, and was sure to let the panels know in the next two interviews for the other ones that he had received the LOA.

We are also in a super competitive District (I would not be surprised if you are from MD or NoVA if yo are claiming a super competitive area). In MD, they tend to spread the wealth and typically coordinate nom slates to submit with rarely ever getting more than one nom to an individual SA per kid. With well over 225+ kids interviewing for a USNA nom, it is a tough place to get one.

In that cycle, he was applying to the USAFA and the USNA. He split priorities for top schools on his nom applications. Our House rep ended up giving him a nom to the USAFA and offered one to the USMA as well since my kid had originally put that on the rank list, even though he did not ever put in an application there. The Senator staffers sent him a "congrats on the USAFA nom" and left it at that. Our actual House District tat we are in is the same one that Annapolis is in, so you can guess that there are a lot of people throwing their hat in the ring from here.

Apparently, having an LOA didn't mean sh-t to any of the MoC panels. He did not get a USNA nom from any of them. And he ended up getting the TWE in the final purge at the end of April in that cycle.

Flash forward to the next cycle? No LOA, doing great as a Freshman in college as a college programmer (walk-on) in NROTC .......... still no frickin' MoC noms received. Thank Zeus, Odin, Buddha, and all the gods that his PNS gave him a recommendation/nom from his NROTC unit.

 

[gniyji]

Another similar story. Same as PP, DS has an LOA from USMA but USNA as top the choice. It was intent to avoid competition to his classmate who had USMA as a sole choice.

By the time of interview, DS has all USNA completed (CFA qualified) but USMA incomplete (because he failed one event of CFA for the army, it seems Army is a lot more strict than Navy). As LOA deadline approaches, he decided not to mention of USMA at all-- just to get a norm for USNA which is complete. The interview was conducted by two retired navy officers -- it was all about USNA and Navy ---

In the end, he got both norms --- he was surprised to have a norm for USMA --- and one week later -- he passed USMA CFA --- just 6 days before his LOA expires.

I think MOC office was also notified by USMA of his LOA

 

[usna1985]

Having both applied to USNA from a super-competitive district/state, worked as a BGO in the same area and sat on a nom committee in that area, my advice remains the same:

If you have a clear first choice, go with it for all MOCs, even if you think it's a long(er) shot. Be clear with the committees that this is your first (and maybe only) choice. IMO, there is nothing wrong with "going all in" on one SA.

If you truly would be happy at more than one SA, then it may be advantageous to split your first choice among MOCs. However, be 100% sure that, if you get either nom, you will be perfectly happy. Think of it as two envelopes -- are you equally happen whichever is opened?

I've had several situations over the years when a candidate selected a second choice SA as his/her first choice with one or more MOCs. Ended up getting a nom to second choice SA, attended that SA, and was miserable. I understand the desire to serve, but there are ways to serve -- and to become an officer -- other than attending a SA that you don't really want to attend.

 

[time2]

For other candidates: my advice (which you're free to ignore but comes with decades of experience) is NEVER put down as a first choice with an MOC any SA that you do not 100% want to attend. If you are equally happy attending multiple SAs, then it's ok to pick the one you see as less competitive from an MOC standpoint in your area.

I agree, you can find many older threads on here where someone tried to 'game' the MOC NOM process and it didn't go well for them. Don't try to out-guess the process by choosing an SA that really isn't your first choice. You could end up with a NOM to someplace you really do not want to attend. Changing your mind AFTER the interviews are over is likely to not go over well with the NOM committee.

 

[usna1985]

Years ago, I had a candidate call me with the following story: I put USMA as my first choice with my 2 Senators and USNA first with my Rep, because I thought I had a better shot at the Rep nom. I got the nom for USMA from my senator but no USNA nom from my rep. What should I do? [Note: candidate had an LOA from USMA]

My response: Go to USMA.

Candidate: But, I don't want to go to USMA.

Me: Then why did you put it down as your first choice?

Candidate: Because I thought it would be easier to get a nom for USMA.

Me: You put USMA down as your first choice. Your Senator gave you a nom to your first choice school. Not sure anyone is going to understand the problem.

I'd like to say this story had a happy ending, but it didn't. The candidate didn't get a USNA nom or appointment. Candidate ended up going to USMA and was miserable. Candidate's father sent ME a letter after youngster year complaining about how miserable his child was. Don't know if the cadet stayed or quit.

The above is not to say that USMA is a miserable place. It's a fantastic place . . . for those who truly want to be there. Don't think you'll "learn to love" a SA. It's hard enough to love a SA that you 100% wanted to attend; it's nearly impossible to love one that you weren't excited about up front.

"Gaming the system" is a perfectly fine strategy . . . just be prepared for the consequences, which aren't always what you expect.

 

[Capt MJ]

Years ago, I had a candidate call me with the following story: I put USMA as my first choice with my 2 Senators and USNA first with my Rep, because I thought I had a better shot at the Rep nom. I got the nom for USMA from my senator but no USNA nom from my rep. What should I do? [Note: candidate had an LOA from USMA]

My response: Go to USMA.

Candidate: But, I don't want to go to USMA.

Me: Then why did you put it down as your first choice?

Candidate: Because I thought it would be easier to get a nom for USMA.

Me: You put USMA down as your first choice. Your Senator gave you a nom to your first choice school. Not sure anyone is going to understand the problem.

I'd like to say this story had a happy ending, but it didn't. The candidate didn't get a USNA nom or appointment. Candidate ended up going to USMA and was miserable. Candidate's father sent ME a letter after youngster year complaining about how miserable his child was. Don't know if the cadet stayed or quit.

The above is not to say that USMA is a miserable place. It's a fantastic place . . . for those who truly want to be there. Don't think you'll "learn to love" a SA. It's hard enough to love a SA that you 100% wanted to attend; it's nearly impossible to love one that you weren't excited about up front.

"Gaming the system" is a perfectly fine strategy . . . just be prepared for the consequences, which aren't always what you expect.

Bookmarking this. Comes up every year.

I know people say they would be happy to serve anywhere. That makes me think of “I just want to be married. I would be happy with anyone in that group of 5.” That doesn’t seem right, because it is a serious decision with consequences. Because it is like a marriage in some respects, going to a SA in 24/7 active duty status followed by at least 5 years. That’s a relationship. I think it’s understandable at the start of the journey to be open to all paths, but as more knowledge and understanding are gained, there will be “The One.” But that is just me.

 

[99Gold]

The above is not to say that USMA is a miserable place. It's a fantastic place . . . for those who truly want to be there. Don't think you'll "learn to love" a SA. It's hard enough to love a SA that you 100% wanted to attend; it's nearly impossible to love one that you weren't excited about up front.

What a true statement!!

Bookmarking this. Comes up every year.

I know people say they would be happy to serve anywhere. That makes me think of “I just want to be married. I would be happy with anyone in that group of 5.” That doesn’t seem right, because it is a serious decision with consequences. Because it is like a marriage in some respects, going to a SA in 24/7 active duty status followed by at least 5 years. That’s a relationship. I think it’s understandable at the start of the journey to be open to all paths, but as more knowledge and understanding are gained, there will be “The One.” But that is just me.

I think this is true to a certain extent. Three of my boys have decided that they do not want to be anywhere near ships or boats and ruled out the Navy, Marines, and Coast Guard. While all of them have a preference between the Air/Space Force and Army, they’ve decided that they can have a fulfilling career (or at least 5 years) in the other branch. They are/will be only applying to SAs and ROTC programs they actually want to attend. I do think there are people out there who just want to serve and really don’t care how. Those people could probably be happy in a marriage to almost anyone.

 

[A1Janitor]

Everybody is different. My son only wanted to propose to USNA. Refused to even flirt with the other SAs and their ugly Ivy League cousins. Made everything easier.

 

[NomSeeker]

I agree, you can find many older threads on here where someone tried to 'game' the MOC NOM process and it didn't go well for them. Don't try to out-guess the process by choosing an SA that really isn't your first choice. You could end up with a NOM to someplace you really do not want to attend. Changing your mind AFTER the interviews are over is likely to not go over well with the NOM committee.

Well said. Had two kids go through this process and picked the same academy (and only that academy) with congressperson, both senators -and VP. Both received appointments for that academy. A wise man once said, “if you don’t show a clear preference, you just might get it”

 

[Texark147]

I agree, you can find many older threads on here where someone tried to 'game' the MOC NOM process and it didn't go well for them. Don't try to out-guess the process by choosing an SA that really isn't your first choice. You could end up with a NOM to someplace you really do not want to attend. Changing your mind AFTER the interviews are over is likely to not go over well with the NOM committee.

My DS took the advice on this forum about not trying to game the system. He put USMA as the number #1 choice for all 3 MOCs, because that's where he really wants to be. He has said that he thinks he could be happy at another academy and a career in another branch, but his heart is at West Point and the Army for now.