Looking for moms & dads of FEMALE ROTC cadets or cadets themselves (past, present, future)

I

interestinrotc

Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2023
Messages
51
Would love any and all insight or advice you have as we navigate daughter's plans for ROTC (she's 2024, so hitting campus Fall of 24). Not a sexist, just curious to hear specifics on the female experience.
 
My daughter was AFROTC and she has no regrets about her choice. She experienced a few comments like "you're here because you're a woman," guys being upset when women were selected as student leaders ("the women all voted for each other" but not making that comment when the guys all vote for each other), and side comments about women not being good pilots. But she had good cadre commanders and enjoyed the experience overall and the opportunities provided (immediately after commissioning she was selected to get her Masters). Her mom (my wife) is retired AF, so my daughter had a good mentor.

I would encourage you and your daughter to review the units where you are applying and make sure they are diverse. People may criticize this, but I'd avoid units where all the Active Duty cadre are men. Along with this, visit the desired schools and then meet the cadre.
Good luck!
 
"Women shouldn't be in the military" is the most common obstacle my DD has faced. However she will face this belief in big Army/Navy/Air Force also. As you probably already know with your daughter, smart strong woman have to overcome dumb weak men.

Much will depend on the school chosen.
 
Grantsville MD dd Dad said:
"Women shouldn't be in the military" is the most common obstacle my DD has faced. However she will face this belief in big Army/Navy/Air Force also. As you probably already know with your daughter, smart strong woman have to overcome dumb weak men.

Much will depend on the school chosen.
Click to expand...
Just have her reply “It’s my honor and privilege to defend your right to say that.” And smile.

It’s a phase. Most of them get over it.
 
unkown1961 said:
People may criticize this, but I'd avoid units where all the Active Duty cadre are men.
Click to expand...
Remember that cadre change over regularly. An all-male group could easily be 60/40 a couple years later. Above all, pick the school first. If the cadet/mid doesn’t enjoy the school, little else matters. After all, ROTC is but a small fraction of time spent in college. And it’s largely a reflection of the school.
 
so one thing I will add here; my daughter did Army ROTC on a four year scholarship and is serving in the reserves. Of course
there were fewer women in her ROTC detachment than men. The woman she met, and became friends with were strong and smart and really had each other’s backs. she often says one of the best things about her ROTC experience was her female friends that she made, and they will be best friends for life. they have traveled internationally together together and they meet up several times a year. I can’t say this will be like that for your daughter, but these women really held each other up and and helped each other develop into strong leaders.
 
From my 2 boys’ perspective (an SA, not ROTC), ‘as long as they do the work, idk what they are’. No more, no less. They’ve thought of females mates as their ‘bro’s. Just like their male friends.
 
It’s an SA and not ROTC, but…DD’s best buddies included both men and women. She considers one man and one woman her two very best friends. One winter break, she brought back female visitors to our home. Another time, she brought back male visitors. The men were nothing but respectful, polite, engaging and fun. (As were the women.)

Fact is, your daughter will be surrounded by men. That’s the nature of the military beast. As long as she knows what she’s getting into, and realizes that competence is the main measuring stick, she’ll be fine.
 
Former NROTC-MO MIDN here. I agree with the general consensus here; as long as she performs and puts in 100%, she will be treated with the same respect her male peers receive. One incident - although it hardly qualifies as that, since it was a passing comment and nothing more - I do remember is one of the males saying rather snidely that girls get hurt all the time and get to sit out, presumably because we couldn't handle the intensity of the training. Annoying? Yes. Unnecessary? Yes. But it wasn't anything we weren't expecting, and developing thick skin just comes with the territory.

There were other moments like that when the males made throwaway comments about females, but the best way to deal with it is to just put your head down and keep putting out. Once you prove that you can perform as well as anyone, they'll shut up for the most part. As long as your DD lets any negative comments roll off her, strives to work as hard as she can, and keeps her bearing, she will be fine. Keeping her bearing is the first way to get any naysayers off her back. There were times when I felt like the male mids were being unnecessarily nasty to me without any particular reason to see if I would crack. Remaining calm was critical during these moments; if I had gotten emotional, it would've fed into the nastiness, and also would have proved their notions that females are too emotional and can't handle the pressure.

Best of luck to your DD!
 
Women have been in the military in ever larger numbers since WWI, over 100 years. Most combat exclusions were lifted in the 1990s. Women have gone into harm’s way, been injured or killed, in service to their country.

If someone does their best for their unit, is a good shipmate/battle buddy/wingman or woman, is strong and confident in themselves, is able to set boundaries and advocate for themselves, they will be fine. Man or woman. Sustained superior performance is always a winning strategy.

There always seem to be a few who can’t resist needling, disparaging or passive-aggressive remarks. Usually it’s a power play to get a rise out of someone, or a “I’m just joking” but borderline nasty. I have coached many of the female USNA midshipmen we have sponsored over the years, with the same techniques taught to me by senior female officers:
- Decide which battles to fight and which to walk away from. At USNA, companies are tight-knit families and it’s years together in the same house. Sometimes it’s best to walk away and do battle another day, and allow others to be grumpy and not at their best.
- If a peer says something to you about where you do and do not belong, or something else in that vein, look at them, wait a beat to let them know you have heard their inane comment, and in a perfectly pleasant, neutral tone of voice (this is key, game face on), smile and comment on the weather, the additional drill practice, whatever. Change the topic, refuse to submit to the power play in defensive mode, don’t engage, exert your own power to speak about a topic of your choosing.
- If it’s really idiotic, engage with the eyes, wait a beat, say “Wow” in a quiet tone, and walk away.
- If you simply can’t resist and have had enough, and you’ve considered all ramifications, feel free to go back with a question about the source of their claims or concerns and engage full on with strength, confidence and professionalism.

A small sea story from the overflowing sea chest. I was a JO in the early 1980s. Women had just been ordered to sea duty on non-combatants. At a base social event, a LCDR took pains to tell me, “I have no problem with women in the Navy, and I think they are just as smart as men. But to put them on ships will be disastrous.” Of course, I had to ask why. Dead serious, he described in great detail how woman’s personal items would clog up the ship’s systems and make them unable to get underway and perform their mission. Equally gravely, I replied, “Oh yes, I see your point. We can put human beings on the moon but that is definitely unsolvable.” I am not necessarily proud of myself for that, but it was irresistible in the moment.

A sense of humor in the military, for women and men, is a necessary part of the toolkit.

And, it is never too early to develop the foundations of command presence, for women or men.
 
Last edited:
In my non-military experience, men that say this crap are either immature men who haven’t grown out of sophomoric humor, or they are insecure.

The best workers I have employed over the years have been women.
 
A1Janitor said:
In my non-military experience, men that say this crap are either immature men who haven’t grown out of sophomoric humor, or they are insecure.

The best workers I have employed over the years have been women.
Click to expand...
+1. Some of my best bosses have been women.

On the ROTC side. DS is the platoon leader at his school. He has mentioned how the women always look out for each other. Freshman coming will probably need a mentor at first to help with the hair.

One example last year. They were on a 18 mile ruck last November and one of the ladies legs cramped up. Her friend stayed with her until other non rucking cadets showed up to take her away.

The friend missed her time needed for the badge but it was her battle buddy.

DD was in JROTC. Different environment, but she was thick as thieves with all her JROTC lady friends. They all came from different walks of life.
 
AN21 said:
Former NROTC-MO MIDN here. I agree with the general consensus here; as long as she performs and puts in 100%, she will be treated with the same respect her male peers receive. One incident - although it hardly qualifies as that, since it was a passing comment and nothing more - I do remember is one of the males saying rather snidely that girls get hurt all the time and get to sit out, presumably because we couldn't handle the intensity of the training. Annoying? Yes. Unnecessary? Yes. But it wasn't anything we weren't expecting, and developing thick skin just comes with the territory.

There were other moments like that when the males made throwaway comments about females, but the best way to deal with it is to just put your head down and keep putting out. Once you prove that you can perform as well as anyone, they'll shut up for the most part. As long as your DD lets any negative comments roll off her, strives to work as hard as she can, and keeps her bearing, she will be fine. Keeping her bearing is the first way to get any naysayers off her back. There were times when I felt like the male mids were being unnecessarily nasty to me without any particular reason to see if I would crack. Remaining calm was critical during these moments; if I had gotten emotional, it would've fed into the nastiness, and also would have proved their notions that females are too emotional and can't handle the pressure.

Best of luck to your DD!
Click to expand...

Capt MJ said:
Women have been in the military in ever larger numbers since WWI, over 100 years. Most combat exclusions were lifted in the 1990s. Women have gone into harm’s way, been injured or killed, in service to their country.

If someone does their best for their unit, is a good shipmate/battle buddy/wingman or woman, is strong and confident in themselves, is able to set boundaries and advocate for themselves, they will be fine. Man or woman. Sustained superior performance is always a winning strategy.

There always seem to be a few who can’t resist needling, disparaging or passive-aggressive remarks. Usually it’s a power play to get a rise out of someone, or a “I’m just joking” but borderline nasty. I have coached many of the female USNA midshipmen we have sponsored over the years, with the same techniques taught to me by senior female officers:
- Decide which battles to fight and which to walk away from. At USNA, companies are tight-knit families and it’s years together in the same house. Sometimes it’s best to walk away and do battle another day, and allow others to be grumpy and not at their best.
- If a peer says something to you about where you do and do not belong, or something else in that vein, look at them, wait a beat to let them know you have heard their inane comment, and in a perfectly pleasant, neutral tone of voice (this is key, game face on), smile and comment on the weather, the additional drill practice, whatever. Change the topic, refuse to submit to the power play in defensive mode, don’t engage, exert your own power to speak about a topic of your choosing.
- If it’s really idiotic, engage with the eyes, wait a beat, say “Wow” in a quiet tone, and walk away.
- If you simply can’t resist and have had enough, and you’ve considered all ramifications, feel free to go back with a question about the source of their claims or concerns and engage full on with strength, confidence and professionalism.

A small sea story from the overflowing sea chest. I was a JO in the early 1980s. Women had just been ordered to sea duty on non-combatants. At a base social event, a LCDR took pains to tell me, “I have no problem with women in the Navy, and I think they are just as smart as men. But to put them on ships will be disastrous.” Of course, I had to ask why. Dead serious, he described in great detail how woman’s personal items would clog up the ship’s systems and make them unable to get underway and perform their mission. Equally gravely, I replied, “Oh yes, I see your point. We can put human beings on the moon but that is definitely unsolvable.” I am not necessarily proud of myself for that, but it was irresistible in the moment.

A sense of humor in the military, for women and men, is a necessary part of the toolkit.

And, it is never too early to develop the foundations of command presence, for women or men.
Click to expand...
You know reading through these, I think this could be her first time she'll see some of this separation. She's at a co-ed parochial high school where she's a top athlete and leads a lot of groups. She sells herself well and probably has never had to face any push back or questions to her legitimacy. I don't know if I was thinking that way when I made the post either, so getting these responses is really good for both of us. I don't have much of a role in what the future holds for her - supporting role of course, but she's gotta do the work. Sharing all this advice will be one way I can contribute. thank you!
 
OP you may want to change your username for anonymity purposes. For you, and your daughter. This is an anonymous forum so all feel free to ask questions openly.

Good luck to her!!
 
TBVADAD said:
+1. Some of my best bosses have been women.

On the ROTC side. DS is the platoon leader at his school. He has mentioned how the women always look out for each other. Freshman coming will probably need a mentor at first to help with the hair.

One example last year. They were on a 18 mile ruck last November and one of the ladies legs cramped up. Her friend stayed with her until other non rucking cadets showed up to take her away.

The friend missed her time needed for the badge but it was her battle buddy.

DD was in JROTC. Different environment, but she was thick as thieves with all her JROTC lady friends. They all came from different walks of life.
Click to expand...
Funny you mention hair - she has a running list of things she has to do "master" before next fall - KEEPING MY HAIR IN A BUN is second on her list!
 
I currently have a daughter on an AFROTC scholarship. If your daughter wants to serve, great! If I could offer some input. PT! Gain as much upper body strength as she can. Study hard!! My daughter has had a great experience so far. It's been even more fun when she does more pushups than the men. Ha!
 
amycribbs said:
Funny you mention hair - she has a running list of things she has to do "master" before next fall - KEEPING MY HAIR IN A BUN is second on her list!
Click to expand...
Bunhead bun pins, XL, choose color to match hair, by Capezio, from Capezio online or Amazon. There is a trick to putting in bun pins for max hold. Do not put them straight into bun at base. Stand on end in a 90 degree angle to base of bun, inserted inside some outer strands of hair. Push in toward scalp (no need to puncture scalp!), “turn the corner” and slide slightly upward and into bun.

And, there are endless YouTube videos. Search “military women’s bun” and “military sock bun.”

Posted by someone who can still put hair in a regulation bun in about 20 seconds, from comb to twist to buns to pins.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top