Mentorship and Application

[Dragomir]

Similar to the moderator thread I created, I'm wondering if this example of a mentorship I will explain to you is worth mentioning in interviews and on my application: during my senior year of high school, I befriended a freshman student. Our friendship was more of that of a mentor and a mentee. I would give her a lot of advice and tried my best to lead her on the right path to success. I wasn't an official assigned mentor or anything, at the end of the day she was my friend, but as I said, I would mentor her throughout her freshman year. Is this something that's good enough to be mentioned on my application and in interviews? There are other mentorships that I've done which did have an official position given to it (not necessarily mentor, but being a mentor was a part of the position) which I will definitely include on my application and interviews but I'm wondering if the one between my friend and I also counts.

I have another question to ask. I am pondering over whether I should finish and submit my application by the end of August as I originally intended OR wait a couple months later. I understand that generally, the earlier you submit it, the better, however, the reason why I'm pondering over waiting is that through my role in student government at my university, I am 99% sure that there will be some leadership opportunities available for me throughout this incoming fall semester. The thing is, it's only in the fall semester. I have to wait. And school begins August 23rd so that conflicts with my goal of submitting my application by the end of August. My question is should I wait until I take on these opportunities so I can then include them in my application or submit the application early without them?

 

[sleepymid]

Being a helpful friend isn't unique, and I would leave it off of a resume. It sounds more like reaching for extra content rather than an accomplishment. You could mention mentorship in your interview, but a friendship really isn't something that the board is going to want to hear.

You could include you intend to seek a position in student government, but do not include it as if you have a position when you don't. No harm in submitting it later or sending an updated version if something changes.

 

[Dragomir]

Being a helpful friend isn't unique, and I would leave it off of a resume. It sounds more like reaching for extra content rather than an accomplishment. You could mention mentorship in your interview, but a friendship really isn't something that the board is going to want to hear.

You could include you intend to seek a position in student government, but do not include it as if you have a position when you don't. No harm in submitting it later or sending an updated version if something changes.

Okay, understood.

I already have a position in student government. What I'm talking about is the opportunities that will come with the position and if I should wait to at the very least embark on those opportunities before submitting my application.

 

[Heatherg21]

As I understand it you are a college re-applicant. That means waiting until the end of term to send grades.
It means waiting to establish relationships with professors and advisors who are your evaluators.
So, pursue the leadership positions you want to attain and go for it.

Add them to your resume with examples of how you proved great stewardship and leadership. Then submit. That’s my opinion. For free (which means not worth much).

 

[Dragomir]

As I understand it you are a college re-applicant. That means waiting until the end of term to send grades.
It means waiting to establish relationships with professors and advisors who are your evaluators.
So, pursue the leadership positions you want to attain and go for it.

Add them to your resume with examples of how you proved great stewardship and leadership. Then submit. That’s my opinion. For free (which means not worth much).

I'm a little different type of college re-applicant. I didn't reapply immediately after receiving the turndown. I instead decided to take a year off to make significant improvements to really increase my chances for the second application. I'm an upcoming sophomore at my university. So, right now, I'm applying similarly to a first-time applicant, so I don't necessarily need to wait until the end of the term before sending in my transcript. I hope that makes sense.

 

[Heatherg21]

I'm a little different type of college re-applicant. I didn't reapply immediately after receiving the turndown. I instead decided to take a year off to make significant improvements to really increase my chances for the second application. I'm an upcoming sophomore at my university. So, right now, I'm applying similarly to a first-time applicant, so I don't necessarily need to wait until the end of the term before sending in my transcript. I hope that makes sense.

It does. Just be prepared for them to ask for current grades for your current semester /term.

 

[Small Team Bacsi]

How are you similar to a first time applicant if you have been turned down already?

IMO you would be better off giving the folks here an idea of the strong points you will be depending on in terms of your application. And let the experts give you advice on those.

For instance—-what leadership positions do you hold now, grades, test scores, scouts, sports, awards, volunteer activities? what is it that sets you apart from the rest?

being a helpful friend and spending time on an Internet forum are not the type of things you want to base an application on.

 

[Dragomir]

How are you similar to a first time applicant if you have been turned down already?

I'm similar in how I don't need to wait until the end of the term before sending in my transcript as a normal college reapplicant does. I can submit everything early if I want to. That's what I meant.

IMO you would be better off giving the folks here an idea of the strong points you will be depending on in terms of your application. And let the experts give you advice on those.

For instance—-what leadership positions do you hold now, grades, test scores, scouts, sports, awards, volunteer activities? what is it that sets you apart from the rest?

being a helpful friend and spending time on an Internet forum are not the type of things you want to base an application on.

I was never intending to base my application on those two things. I just wanted to know if including them would help and I realize now that they wouldn't.

But okay, here is the stuff that I will base it on: Dean's List for my freshman year at college (both first and second semester and yes, I did take plebe level classes), joined the Freshman Leadership Council at my school (activities include listening to leadership presentations, mentoring middle schoolers, organizing a schoolwide event), was awarded the Outstanding Freshman Leadership Council Member Award 2021-2022, campaigned for a senator position in student government and won my election (this is the role in student government I was talking), was just recently a student ambassador for an international program at my school, I've accumulated over 200 volunteer hours and counting from volunteering at my local hospital, I'm currently leading a litter clean-up group to pick up trash at local neighborhoods, and my ACT score is 29. Also, I have 3 toddler siblings who I babysit. I'm not sure how significant that is but I was told by my BGO and another person to definitely mention it on my application. And lastly, something that sets me apart from other applicants is that I'm a naturalized citizen. I immigrated to the United States.

 

[Huursoldaat]

I have 3 toddler siblings who I babysit. I'm not sure how significant that is but I was told by my BGO and another person to definitely mention it on my application.

This is worth mentioning, but mentoring a freshman isn't? I'd be curious to hear from the responders on your other thread about how babysitting toddlers builds military style leadership?

BTW, is this person you mentored a freshman in college (same as you?) or highschool?

 

[Dragomir]

This is worth mentioning, but mentoring a freshman isn't? I'd be curious to hear from the responders on your other thread about how babysitting toddlers builds military style leadership?

My BGO and that other person told me that it shows the admissions board that I'm a responsible person. I also assume it makes the overall application a little better as it says that I was able to accomplish all that I did while babysitting 3 siblings no older than 5 years old.

BTW, is this person you mentored a freshman in college (same as you?) or highschool?

High school. She was a freshman and I was a senior.

 

[Small Team Bacsi]

Good for you.

And I think the babysitting does show a positive that should be mentioned. Time consuming and shows a commitment to family. Much more important than highlighting Internet activities IMO.

Being naturalized also a positive. Have a second language?

Maybe you finish by mentioning that you also have several hobbies——mentoring younger students (assuming this is not an official duty ) , being a mod on a forum, among them. Thrown them in casually don’t stress them. That will seem forced. But be ready to discuss them if asked on an interview.

Good Luck

 

[Don't Give Up the Ship]

Babysitting young siblings shows responsibility, accountability and caring. It may also, in some cases, be a hardship-all of interest to USNA Admissions. Mentorship of a friend is also worth mentioning. Its one thing to be a friend its another to mentor, coach and help out. These are traits of leadership, commitment, ethics and caring. Be prepared to answer questions such as: "what did you learn form mentoring ?"

 

[Dragomir]

Good for you.

And I think the babysitting does show a positive that should be mentioned. Time consuming and shows a commitment to family. Much more important than highlighting Internet activities IMO.

Being naturalized also a positive. Have a second language?

Maybe you finish by mentioning that you also have several hobbies——mentoring younger students (assuming this is not an official duty ) , being a mod on a forum, among them. Thrown them in casually don’t stress them. That will seem forced. But be ready to discuss them if asked on an interview.

Good Luck

Yes, I do speak a second language (and third but this third is an indigenous African language so I'm not sure if that would help). French, I'm not as fluent as I used to be as when I immigrated here, I lost it all while learning English. But I am relearning it by having studied it in high school and now in college so I'm decently proficient at it right now.

Thank you for the advice!

Babysitting young siblings shows responsibility, accountability and caring. It may also, in some cases, be a hardship-all of interest to USNA Admissions. Mentorship of a friend is also worth mentioning. Its one thing to be a friend its another to mentor, coach and help out. These are traits of leadership, commitment, ethics and caring. Be prepared to answer questions such as: "what did you learn form mentoring ?"

Thank you, sir! About preparing for questions, since you are a BGO yourself, what questions would you ask me if we did an interview and I told you all of this in the quote below?

But okay, here is the stuff that I will base it on: Dean's List for my freshman year at college (both first and second semester and yes, I did take plebe level classes), joined the Freshman Leadership Council at my school (activities include listening to leadership presentations, mentoring middle schoolers, organizing a schoolwide event), was awarded the Outstanding Freshman Leadership Council Member Award 2021-2022, campaigned for a senator position in student government and won my election (this is the role in student government I was talking), was just recently a student ambassador for an international program at my school, I've accumulated over 200 volunteer hours and counting from volunteering at my local hospital, I'm currently leading a litter clean-up group to pick up trash at local neighborhoods, and my ACT score is 29. Also, I have 3 toddler siblings who I babysit. I'm not sure how significant that is but I was told by my BGO and another person to definitely mention it on my application. And lastly, something that sets me apart from other applicants is that I'm a naturalized citizen. I immigrated to the United States.

 

[Don't Give Up the Ship]

...

Thank you, sir! About preparing for questions, since you are a BGO yourself, what questions would you ask me if we did an interview and I told you all of this in the quote below?

Keep in mind that Admissions has a series of recommended and mandatory questions for BGOs to ask. I would ask open ended questions that probe you're understanding that Leadership is a continuous learning journey. The best candidates often explain what they learned and where they could have done better with various ECA's vs. the BGO asking "What did you learn from Mentoring middle schoolers?". Tell me about your 3 toddler siblings and why you babysit for them? Often candidates who have home responsibilities like that...indicates they can be successful at USNA where there will be multiple demands placed upon MIDN. If the babysitting helps because of cost savings for the family that's a good thing...there is no right answer.

Tell me what you have learned about your leadership skills through these various activities? What have you learned about leadership in college that you didn't know when in high school? How do you manage your time with all these things? What techniques for time management do you use? Tell me about becoming a US Citizen and what that means to you? What challenges have you faced over the last few years? How did you manage those challenges? Often how a candidate answers a question will lead to more detailed questions. One of the objectives of the BGO interview is to discover things about the candidate that Admissions doesn't know...I try to discover what sets the candidate apart from the numerous quality applicants with strong academic, leadership and physical fitness qualities. This information is important to Admissions and should go into the BGO interview report. The best BGOs make the candidate feel comfortable and try to understand why they want to attend USNA and their likelihood of success. Hope this helps you.

 

[Old Navy BGO]

I didn't respond to the original thread, and didn't originally agree on the answer re: Moderator...but my view is similar to Don't Give Up; I tell my Candidates up front that one of my goals in the interview is to paint a picture who you are, and fill in the gaps that the check the block portions of the application don't cover. If Moderator or Mentor is important to you, mention it to your BGO -- he/she will decide whether its worth including in the write up. I don't think either hurts ...but frankly probably wouldn't mention it. Caring for siblings could be relevant -- it shows responsibility, and as previously noted could serve as example of overcoming hardship or other factors limiting school activities,

Finally, kind of general comment for Candidates -- don't try to plan or prejudge what you are going to mention or not. A good BGO will take the interview in the direction he/she wants. While I have checklist/script -- I rarely follow it. (In fact, if I am relying on the script, it means the interview isn't really that good -- a good interview is more natural, conversational ...not checking blocks ! Keep in mind, every BGO is different -- this is just my view, so don't worry if YOUR BGO goes strictly by the script).

 

[Dragomir]

Keep in mind that Admissions has a series of recommended and mandatory questions for BGOs to ask. I would ask open ended questions that probe you're understanding that Leadership is a continuous learning journey. The best candidates often explain what they learned and where they could have done better with various ECA's vs. the BGO asking "What did you learn from Mentoring middle schoolers?". Tell me about your 3 toddler siblings and why you babysit for them? Often candidates who have home responsibilities like that...indicates they can be successful at USNA where there will be multiple demands placed upon MIDN. If the babysitting helps because of cost savings for the family that's a good thing...there is no right answer.

Tell me what you have learned about your leadership skills through these various activities? What have you learned about leadership in college that you didn't know when in high school? How do you manage your time with all these things? What techniques for time management do you use? Tell me about becoming a US Citizen and what that means to you? What challenges have you faced over the last few years? How did you manage those challenges? Often how a candidate answers a question will lead to more detailed questions. One of the objectives of the BGO interview is to discover things about the candidate that Admissions doesn't know...I try to discover what sets the candidate apart from the numerous quality applicants with strong academic, leadership and physical fitness qualities. This information is important to Admissions and should go into the BGO interview report. The best BGOs make the candidate feel comfortable and try to understand why they want to attend USNA and their likelihood of success. Hope this helps you.

I didn't respond to the original thread, and didn't originally agree on the answer re: Moderator...but my view is similar to Don't Give Up; I tell my Candidates up front that one of my goals in the interview is to paint a picture who you are, and fill in the gaps that the check the block portions of the application don't cover. If Moderator or Mentor is important to you, mention it to your BGO -- he/she will decide whether its worth including in the write up. I don't think either hurts ...but frankly probably wouldn't mention it. Caring for siblings could be relevant -- it shows responsibility, and as previously noted could serve as example of overcoming hardship or other factors limiting school activities,

Finally, kind of general comment for Candidates -- don't try to plan or prejudge what you are going to mention or not. A good BGO will take the interview in the direction he/she wants. While I have checklist/script -- I rarely follow it. (In fact, if I am relying on the script, it means the interview isn't really that good -- a good interview is more natural, conversational ...not checking blocks ! Keep in mind, every BGO is different -- this is just my view, so don't worry if YOUR BGO goes strictly by the script).

Wow, this is incredibly insightful, thank you!

What do you two think about my dilemma about submitting my application early or waiting until later? Which do you recommend I go with based on the circumstances?

 

[Old Navy BGO]

What do you two think about my dilemma about submitting my application early or waiting until later?

If you think you are going to have a stronger record in September /October than you have now, then wait.
You could submit early, and supplement --but frankly your application could go before the Admissions Board at anytime, and I don't know how much the supplemental information is even considered after the Admissions Board gives the Admissions Q (it would be relevant to Noms and Appointments, but I don't know how their magic QUIJI board works)

 

[Don't Give Up the Ship]

I agree with Old Navy BGO...his analysis and experience is worth noting.

 

[Dragomir]

If you think you are going to have a stronger record in September /October than you have now, then wait.
You could submit early, and supplement --but frankly your application could go before the Admissions Board at anytime, and I don't know how much the supplemental information is even considered after the Admissions Board gives the Admissions Q (it would be relevant to Noms and Appointments, but I don't know how their magic QUIJI board works)

Understood.

Thank you so much for the advice, everyone!

 

[AROTC-dad]

This forum is so fortunate to have a bevy of BGOs to offer support and guidance to our candidates.