So during Plebe Summer, it is fashioned to be a bootcamp style freshmen orientation, so I’m assuming your detailers will be yelling at you and giving you a hard time about stuff? The detailers aren’t drill instructors so are they really that intimidating? During NASS when we did the fake Indoc, it was hard to keep a straight face while my squad leader was screaming at me, and I was wondering if thats what its like during PS. And are you allowed to ask questions if you don’t understand something during PS? For Example if I was reading my Reef Points and dont comprehend one of them, am I allowed to ask for clarification? I am very curious about plebe summer and if it would be better compared to NASS or Basic Training. Thank you!
Plebe Summer Questions
- Thread starter tylerd
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I know you will receive answers from many who have experienced PS first-hand. In the meantime, I recommend that you read this thread (It is a USNA sticky note on this forum). It is full of great advice.
https://www.serviceacademyforums.co...wisdom-for-plebe-summer-parts-i-and-ii.13029/
https://www.serviceacademyforums.co...wisdom-for-plebe-summer-parts-i-and-ii.13029/
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To quote my DD in the midst of Plebe Summer: “The highs are really high. The lows are really low. It’s great to be here. But it really sucks.” She was no doubt speaking for most (all?) of her fellow plebes.
As the Supe says, it’s “positive pressure with a purpose.” The detailers aren’t mean or cruel. They’re there to introduce you to the discipline, focus, perseverance and resilience that’s required to get through four years at USNA and five years (at least) on active duty. The detailers want to show you that to lead effectively, you must follow effectively. They want to reveal your weak point, so they can show you how to overcome it. And they want you to fail at something, so they can show you how to bounce back. (Now, if a detailer makes you want to laugh or smirk, more power to you. But that proves nothing and won’t make you a better midshipman or officer.)
The people who’ll intimidate you likely won’t be the detailers. Instead, it’ll be your company mates — and the prospect of letting them down. What I mean is, you should be intimidated by the possibility of not pulling your weight, not doing your part, not achieving the standard, not coming through for the team. I believe for my DD, it’s that which motivates her, not any yelling or screaming from the detailers.
Regardless of what you experienced at Summer Seminar, should you be so fortunate to make it to Plebe Summer, you’d be well served to approach it with humbleness and humility and a deep desire to help your shipmates.
As the Supe says, it’s “positive pressure with a purpose.” The detailers aren’t mean or cruel. They’re there to introduce you to the discipline, focus, perseverance and resilience that’s required to get through four years at USNA and five years (at least) on active duty. The detailers want to show you that to lead effectively, you must follow effectively. They want to reveal your weak point, so they can show you how to overcome it. And they want you to fail at something, so they can show you how to bounce back. (Now, if a detailer makes you want to laugh or smirk, more power to you. But that proves nothing and won’t make you a better midshipman or officer.)
The people who’ll intimidate you likely won’t be the detailers. Instead, it’ll be your company mates — and the prospect of letting them down. What I mean is, you should be intimidated by the possibility of not pulling your weight, not doing your part, not achieving the standard, not coming through for the team. I believe for my DD, it’s that which motivates her, not any yelling or screaming from the detailers.
Regardless of what you experienced at Summer Seminar, should you be so fortunate to make it to Plebe Summer, you’d be well served to approach it with humbleness and humility and a deep desire to help your shipmates.
Clarification has a time and place. If you think a detailer will stop to answer every question... they won’t. It’s your job to find an answer. One of your 5 basic responses is ‘I will find out sir/ma’am.’ You have classmates and they should be your first stop. Read Man in the Arena and Message to Garcia you will get an idea of what is expected. Is PS funny? It has its moments. But no, you will not be laughing non-stop. It is much more serious and real than SS. It’s sort of why I hate the few hours they do Plebe Summer there. They have newly promoted 3/C doing something they aren’t comfortable with yet. They are not the same, don’t compare them. PS is the start of your military career and your reputation.
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MiddyB
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Yes. Yes. No. You may ask all the questions you like.
The above are the direct answers to your questions. However, I see that you are trying to make a comparison of PS to NASS or Basic Training. You're comparing apples to oranges to pomegranates. NASS is a glorified summer camp. Basic Training is taking your average 18 year old, stripping their identity, and making them into an effective enlisted person in the Fleet. The best way PS was described to me is this: "PS does not prepare you to be an officer. PS prepares you to become a Midshipman." No other training in this US Navy or Marine Corps does that. That is why they have Firsties and 2/C as detailers (not some 3/C that was a plebes a couple of weeks before like in NASS and not Drill Instructors like in Boot). They've been around the block a time or two, therefore they know what is necessary to mold a fresh young man or woman into a capable 4/C Midshipman. The plebes sense this wisdom and expectation, and yes, there is fear...or at the very least respect. In the civilian world, there isn't a whole lot to distinguish a 22 or 21 year old from a 19 or 18 year old. At the Academy, you see Plebes looking like lost children at a wal-mart, and then you see the detailers that carry themselves in a way beyond their years. This comes with the bit of salt you get on your shoulders from spending a few winters in Bancroft. As for your fascination about asking questions. I remember during my PS, most of us caught on quick enough to not ask too many questions. Those who did ask questions were referenced to a little book called Message to Garcia. Those who continued to ask questions spent a lot of time in the front leaning rest. You rely on your classmates to figure things out. That's why if/when you turn out to be wrong, you suffer together.
I like your response. Thank you for answering my questions. If I am lucky enough to make it to plebe summer, I will keep this in mind. Thank you for answering my questions. I feel though as if plebe summer is made out to be a lot more harsh than it actually is. From my perspective, it seems though as if plebe summer is more difficult than Basic. And I feel though as if this isn’t true. Or is it?
MiddyB
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Plebe Summer sucks...at the time. But I think most Alumni will agree that in hindsight it was the easiest part of the Academy.
I've never gone through Navy or Marine Corps Boot Camp, therefore I cannot speak with complete accuracy. Again though, you're trying to compare two different things. Looking at the physical aspect only, sure, an arguably legitimate comparison can be made. There is no way to compare everything else, because, as I said, it's just different. It's like asking which SOF is better: SEALs or Green Berets? The two communities have very different mission focuses, and thus, different training and different skill sets. Or, an Academy example, Group 1 Major versus Group 3 Major. One you're basically re-designing the Death Star and the other you're plowing through 100-12o pages of dry reading a night. Not harder one way or the other, the struggle is simply different.
You can’t compare the two. PS has elements of basic training. Two different missions. Basic training is churning out a member prepared to enter the armed services. PS is teaching 1200 top dogs that they are no longer top dogs. It is teaching them to become a class, work together, to follow, be obedient, how to operate in the Brigade. They are training you to be a Midshipman who can be a member of the Brigade. Plebe Year continues for another 9 months. Plebe Year has just as many lessons as PS. For those of use who have the shrunken blue rim, most will tell you Plebe Year is harder than PS. It’s a grind. No singular event is that difficult. It’s the culmination of being pushed, tired, yelled at, hot, uncomfortable, sick, no down time, failing, stress. Throw that in for 6 weeks and it becomes difficult.
Old Navy BGO
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- The old saying "There is no such thing as a dumb question." doesn't apply during Plebe Year. You don't want to be "that guy (or girl)" that has a question for everything. (Even worse is the person who has an excuse ..). One of the first things you learn during Plebe Summer is the five basic responses "Yes Sir, No Sir, Aye Aye Sir, I'll find out Sir, and No Excuse Sir" (Curious, do they teach that with Sir/Maam now ?). There is one other basic response that serves well in the Navy..."I messed up Sir " (or saltier variations , depending who you are talking to). If you are ever in the midst of a good old fashioned a$$ chewing, and are asked why you did something , that response completely disarms the chewer ...as all they can do from there is agree with you.
-- Absolutely true....Plebe Summer is pretty straightforward, and the ratio of Detailers v. Plebes is about 1:10 (maybe a little higher,with staff etc., but for the most part the Plebe is answerable to his /her Squad Leader, Platoon Commander, and perhaps Company staff) . During Plebe Year, the ratio is 3 upperclass:1 Plebe; sure 3/C usually don't get in your face, and alot of the 1/c and 2/c attention is devoted to academics and personal lives, but they still have enough love to share with the Plebes.
MidwestDad
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USMA Dad here but I think this holds true for all SAs:
1] Do nothing to draw attention to yourself [words or actions.] You do NOT want to be the 'special.' Especially on Day 1. Its a long summer.
2] Be prepared mentally and physically, be able to keep up with runs/marches and to tolerate a bunch of BS thrown your way. Deal with it.
3] Basically keep your head down and yap shut unless told otherwise. Start practicing now to listen carefully and follow basic instructions, appears to be a dying trait everywhere.
4] The entire plebe summer experience is designed to help you succeed by learning to follow the process. Buck the system and suffer the consequences. Go with the flow, embrace the suck, watch and learn before you stick your neck out. Despite setting you up for success parts of it are designed to challenge you and throw small failures your way. Learn to cope with this and overcome.
You more or less get a fresh start after plebe summer with everyone on equal footing. Many who look real bad on day 1 learn from their mistakes and turn out to be great cadets / mids etc. You might stumble but everyone is expected to - just stay strong mentally and persevere.
Good Luck !!
P.S. if you think you might laugh when getting yelled at I suggest you [re]watch opening scene of Full Metal Jacket and learn how to properly suppress your giggles via Gunny Ermey and Private Pyle's demonstration.
1] Do nothing to draw attention to yourself [words or actions.] You do NOT want to be the 'special.' Especially on Day 1. Its a long summer.
2] Be prepared mentally and physically, be able to keep up with runs/marches and to tolerate a bunch of BS thrown your way. Deal with it.
3] Basically keep your head down and yap shut unless told otherwise. Start practicing now to listen carefully and follow basic instructions, appears to be a dying trait everywhere.
4] The entire plebe summer experience is designed to help you succeed by learning to follow the process. Buck the system and suffer the consequences. Go with the flow, embrace the suck, watch and learn before you stick your neck out. Despite setting you up for success parts of it are designed to challenge you and throw small failures your way. Learn to cope with this and overcome.
You more or less get a fresh start after plebe summer with everyone on equal footing. Many who look real bad on day 1 learn from their mistakes and turn out to be great cadets / mids etc. You might stumble but everyone is expected to - just stay strong mentally and persevere.
Good Luck !!
P.S. if you think you might laugh when getting yelled at I suggest you [re]watch opening scene of Full Metal Jacket and learn how to properly suppress your giggles via Gunny Ermey and Private Pyle's demonstration.
Very well answered! I hope that plebe summer will be something I get to experience.