Withdrawing a class vs failing

B

Birdsnest

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I am a college rotc midshipman and I have recently accepted my appointment to KP. I am struggling in my trig class and I am close to failing. Will withdrawing out of the class be better or should I try to see it through and pass with a c? The withdrawal date is next Friday.
 
Birdsnest said:
I am a college rotc midshipman and I have recently accepted my appointment to KP. I am struggling in my trig class and I am close to failing. Will withdrawing out of the class be better or should I try to see it through and pass with a c? The withdrawal date is next Friday.
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Id finish. But I have to tell you Calculus, physics and chemistry were the killers that got my classmates dismissed at the Zoo. Its important to develop good study habits to get you through Plebe year since its the year to establish your GPA. The classes only get harder especially if you're an engineer.
 
Birdsnest said:
I am a college rotc midshipman and I have recently accepted my appointment to KP. I am struggling in my trig class and I am close to failing. Will withdrawing out of the class be better or should I try to see it through and pass with a c? The withdrawal date is next Friday.
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Wow, talk about being between the rock and the hardplace! Did you have trig in high school? Could your present situation be a result of the instructor as opposed to your abilities. I know that when I did graduate work after KP, I had a major issue with Indian professors. I just found it difficult to get attuned to the accent and it impacted my studies.

Look at it from the KP side of things as opposed to the current school. If you are going to opt for one of the transportation options (deck) a very strong knowledge of trig is essential. It is the very basis by which precise distances will be measured. It also goes beyond navigation, it will impact things like vessel cargo operations, stability and trim. In the engineering side, as KPEngnr90 pointed out, “the classes only get harder.” There will be course in physics and dynamics, all very dependent on a strong math foundation, including trig.
 
Birdsnest said:
I am a college rotc midshipman and I have recently accepted my appointment to KP. I am struggling in my trig class and I am close to failing. Will withdrawing out of the class be better or should I try to see it through and pass with a c? The withdrawal date is next Friday.
Click to expand...
Hire a tutor for calculus before you leave because if you are having a difficult time in trig now.
You’ll most likely have issues with calculus at Kings Point.
 
JohnPAKP65 said:
Wow, talk about being between the rock and the hardplace! Did you have trig in high school? Could your present situation be a result of the instructor as opposed to your abilities. I know that when I did graduate work after KP, I had a major issue with Indian professors. I just found it difficult to get attuned to the accent and it impacted my studies.

Look at it from the KP side of things as opposed to the current school. If you are going to opt for one of the transportation options (deck) a very strong knowledge of trig is essential. It is the very basis by which precise distances will be measured. It also goes beyond navigation, it will impact things like vessel cargo operations, stability and trim. In the engineering side, as KPEngnr90 pointed out, “the classes only get harder.” There will be course in physics and dynamics, all very dependent on a strong math foundation, including trig.
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Thank you for the advice. After my last test i am now failing the class. I am not looking to do transportation or engineering. I want to study logistics and security. I am still not sure how having a withdrawal will impact my appointment status.
 
Just so you know, maritime logistics and security is one of the two deck or transportation majors, the other being marine transportation or "straight deck." The two are very similar and both will require math proficiency as described above. Maritime logistics and security is considered the more difficult of the two. Either way, as a deck officer, you will be expected to be able to use math for navigation and cargo operations. Get help now and good luck.
 
This is too important to get anything less than direct information. I would contact USMMA Admissions and ask them if withdrawing from a course will mean your appt is at risk. Are you taking enough credits such that dropping this course, you'll still be a full time student, or will dropping this take you below 12 credits (which you need to be if you're on a ROTC scholarship)? From my perspective if you are now failing, switch this to a withdrawal or if possible to an A- Audit (which I doubt you can, but). and ace your other courses/ move on with your life. Your new focuses for the next several weeks outside of fitness should be getting tutored at the math lab building a foundation in the math courses needed, and acing your other courses, in advance of your arrival at KP. Good luck to you.
 
And, for anyone else reading this thread consider the online courses via Khan Academy before you go. DS is taking a DC applied calc now & doing well, but will also spend 6 weeks taking this Khan Academy class after he’s done w/ HS. Just about an hour a day - as part of his prep for I-Day. You exercise your mind and body in preparation. Period - not open for discussion. And, if I can find something similar for physics, he’ll do that too…. USMMA was not our first choice as p’s because of how crammed the academics are. But it’s his first choice so we support him. But… you better believe that you’re gonna do everything possible to be as ready as you can.
 
Herman_Snerd said:
This is too important to get anything less than direct information. I would contact USMMA Admissions and ask them if withdrawing from a course will mean your appt is at risk. Are you taking enough credits such that dropping this course, you'll still be a full time student, or will dropping this take you below 12 credits (which you need to be if you're on a ROTC scholarship)? From my perspective if you are now failing, switch this to a withdrawal or if possible to an A- Audit (which I doubt you can, but). and ace your other courses/ move on with your life. Your new focuses for the next several weeks outside of fitness should be getting tutored at the math lab building a foundation in the math courses needed, and acing your other courses, in advance of your arrival at KP. Good luck to you.
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If the poster is unable to pass trig at a regular college, he’s never going to pass calculus at Kings Point.
 
Birdsnest said:
I am a college rotc midshipman and I have recently accepted my appointment to KP. I am struggling in my trig class and I am close to failing. Will withdrawing out of the class be better or should I try to see it through and pass with a c? The withdrawal date is next Friday.
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Free advice, stay in college continue with ROTC.
You’re going to have issues at Kings Point.
 
tankercaptain said:
If the poster is unable to pass trig at a regular college, he’s never going to pass calculus at Kings Point.
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Respectfully can't join you in reaching that conclusion yet. people struggle, overcome challenges, and move forward. Sometimes past struggle is an indicator of future struggle to come - for sure. But not always. I would not fatalistically condemn him or her as doomed to fail at KP.

My son took on too much his sophomore year in HS and somehow got away with it - flying lessons, 3 varsity sports, scouts, other clubs, working 20 hour a week, AP/honors courses - all succeeded across the board.
Tried that insane schedule again his junior year - got overloaded, did poorly academically on a test for the first time - got help, adjusted the ridiculous schedule - aced the final, moved on. Failure or disconnects need to be learned from and where possible corrected - but it doesn't need to define any of us.

Almost every great leader has failed at something but persevered. Edison, Bill Gates, Bill Cos- errr, well you get the point. if we wrote them all off, that would be regrettable.
 
Birdsnest said:
Thank you for the advice. After my last test i am now failing the class. I am not looking to do transportation or engineering. I want to study logistics and security. I am still not sure how having a withdrawal will impact my appointment status.
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Go to the link Logistics and Security program and scroll down to the section titled "Maritime Logistics and Security Program Curriculum" Fourth Class Year". I think you will find much of the content dependent on trigonometry. Things like the following:
  • NAUT 120 LEC Terrestrial Navigation 1
  • NAUT 125 LEC Terrestrial Navigation 2
  • NAUT 160 LEC Ship Construction and Stability
  • NAUT210 LEC Integrated Navigation 1
  • PHYS 110 LEC Physics 1
  • PHYS 120 LEC Physics 2
And more to follow in subsequent years.
 
Herman_Snerd said:
Respectfully can't join you in reaching that conclusion yet. people struggle, overcome challenges, and move forward. Sometimes past struggle is an indicator of future struggle to come - for sure. But not always. I would not fatalistically condemn him or her as doomed to fail at KP.

My son took on too much his sophomore year in HS and somehow got away with it - flying lessons, 3 varsity sports, scouts, other clubs, working 20 hour a week, AP/honors courses - all succeeded across the board.
Tried that insane schedule again his junior year - got overloaded, did poorly academically on a test for the first time - got help, adjusted the ridiculous schedule - aced the final, moved on. Failure or disconnects need to be learned from and where possible corrected - but it doesn't need to define any of us.

Almost every great leader has failed at something but persevered. Edison, Bill Gates, Bill Cos- errr, well you get the point. if we wrote them all off, that would be regrettable.
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Not to argue but having seen enough students goto Kings Point with weak math skills and not taking calculus he’s going to have a difficult time.

Your story is anecdotal and meaningless.
 
As I look through this thread, I have to wonder what courses did the OP take in high school. Typically that sequence includes Algebra I and II, plane geometry, and trigonometry. In some of the STEM schools in our area, pre-calculus and calculus may also be available. So, to the OP, did you take those courses and if so, do your high school grades indicate a good level of proficiency?
 
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tankercaptain said:
Not to argue but having seen enough students goto Kings Point with weak math skills and not taking calculus he’s going to have a difficult time.

Your story is anecdotal and meaningless.
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No issue with stating he'll have a difficult time - that's good info to share that may help the OP and community.

tankercaptain said:
If the poster is unable to pass trig at a regular college, he’s never going to pass calculus at Kings Point.

However, It's not your role to tell someone struggling that they will "never" be able to do something. I know some crappy parents who impact their kids with this type of condemnation/ doubt. It's not constructive, not in the spirit of helping people like the OP who asked for help.

Also, in general, the use of absolutes "always, never, meaningless" with judgments tends to be divisive, not help a conversation along - did someone important in your life teach you to communicate in this way? I have empathy for you, if so.

@Birdsnest please go ahead and shore-up your challenge areas/ prepare for KP, and thrive there. When you do, be sure to update the board as you continue on your journey. @tankercaptain be sure to follow their journey, thank them for their service, and venmo the new officer a commissioning gift and an apology for writing them off too soon.
 
Herman_Snerd said:
Respectfully can't join you in reaching that conclusion yet. people struggle, overcome challenges, and move forward. Sometimes past struggle is an indicator of future struggle to come - for sure. But not always. I would not fatalistically condemn him or her as doomed to fail at KP.

My son took on too much his sophomore year in HS and somehow got away with it - flying lessons, 3 varsity sports, scouts, other clubs, working 20 hour a week, AP/honors courses - all succeeded across the board.
Tried that insane schedule again his junior year - got overloaded, did poorly academically on a test for the first time - got help, adjusted the ridiculous schedule - aced the final, moved on. Failure or disconnects need to be learned from and where possible corrected - but it doesn't need to define any of us.

Almost every great leader has failed at something but persevered. Edison, Bill Gates, Bill Cos- errr, well you get the point. if we wrote them all off, that would be regrettable.
Click to expand...
This is so true! My DS had a bad grade in 2nd semester of Chemistry. Was it online school, COVID impact, bad study habits, lack of trying? I have no idea. But…. He’s retaking that semester now - currently has a 98%. Did he want to re-take if? Nope. Was he embarrassed we were making him re-take it? Yep. He was mortified. “Dude - we can’t send you to a STEM school wondering if you understand Chemistry. This is an opportunity to own a mistake and gain valuable experience for being a leader, while also developing empathy for those who may be struggling. You can say to them: I’ve been in your shoes & this is my advice.” His teacher loves him - wrote a note to admissions about how well he’s doing. It’s a good lesson for him: your actions, or in this case, your inactions, have consequences but…. don’t give up an opportunity to try again. Sometimes you have to embrace the suck to see the light at the end of the tunnel.
 
Herman_Snerd said:
No issue with stating he'll have a difficult time - that's good info to share that may help the OP and community.

tankercaptain said:
If the poster is unable to pass trig at a regular college, he’s never going to pass calculus at Kings Point.

However, It's not your role to tell someone struggling that they will "never" be able to do something. I know some crappy parents who impact their kids with this type of condemnation/ doubt. It's not constructive, not in the spirit of helping people like the OP who asked for help.

Also, in general, the use of absolutes "always, never, meaningless" with judgments tends to be divisive, not help a conversation along - did someone important in your life teach you to communicate in this way? I have empathy for you, if so.

@Birdsnest please go ahead and shore-up your challenge areas/ prepare for KP, and thrive there. When you do, be sure to update the board as you continue on your journey. @tankercaptain be sure to follow their journey, thank them for their service, and venmo the new officer a commissioning gift and an apology for writing them off too so
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Thanks to everyone who offered me advice. I spoke with an admissions officer and they told me a withdrawal will not have an impact on my appointment. I have started seeing a math tutor and doing the online Khan academy class.
JohnPAKP65 said:
As I look through this thread, I have to wonder what courses did the OP take in high school. Typically that sequence includes Algebra I and II, plane geometry, and trigonometry. In some of the STEM schools in our area, pre-calculus and calculus may also be available. So, to the OP, did you take those courses and if so, do your high school grades indicate a good level of proficiency?
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The highest level of high school math i took was Pre-Calc. i did pretty well getting high 80s and 90s in those classes.
 
Birdsnest said:
The highest level of high school math i took was Pre-Calc. i did pretty well getting high 80s and 90s in those classes.
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I think in most high schools trig is taken prior to pre-calc. Was that your case? If so, how did you fare at the high school level trig?
 
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