Anti-Affirmative Group Sues Naval Academy

[FutureAcademyDad?]

How does anyone know where the appointees come from in each district? I'm truly curious. Is this data available by district/state searches?

Our Congressperson only posts the appointments, not the nominations.

 

[BBQ-Devil]

At the end of the day what is needed are cadets that truly want to serve something greater within our Military. My cadet in the class of 27' at USAFA, has stated well over 100 have already quit and gone home. They stated they had another last week decide to leave. SA's do account for loss and expect such %, but this many so quickly seems like a lot. Public or Private, just find the cadets that want to defend what is needed and can face the stresses of military life.

Losing 100 cadets in the first year may seem a little high but is not abnormal. Most classes will lose ~150 or so from I Day and graduate classes of ~950-975. The USAFA Class of 23' lost over 200 before graduation.

 

[Float4]

Not sure how this follows. Why do you think the tiny population of prep school grads would overpopulate the service academies? Our son graduated from one of the storied schools and was the only student in his class who even applied. In that cohort, many considered going into the military as a waste of the prep school education. More than one person joked to us when he accepted his appointment, "What happened? Did you run out of money?" We sure didn't see his choice coming.

But, I do remember clearly the speech by the headmaster during opening days his freshman year. The head looked across the new class and gravely said, "No one in this room had better dare consume over a quarter million dollars of this world's goods without considering the weight of that consumption," basically a rephrasing of how we had raised him: To him whom much has been given, much is expected. Service was a huge component of his high school education. We just didn't consider the military as the way he'd continue his commitment to his fellow man and stewardship of the planet.

Also, the profile of the classes at those schools runs the gamut of rich to poor (most have mind-blowing endowments and generous financial aid), shows a fairly even male:female ratio, and reflects all skin colors and global cultures. Our son's school had students from 44 countries. His exposure to that range of people and perspectives was quite enriching, and I believe it is important for the service academies to continue to attract and recruit future officers from all sectors of our society--including prep schools.

“To whom much is has been given, much is expected.” The quote has been on the wall of my daughter’s room since she’s 5 years old.
She is the only student in her grade looking to join SA or go NROTC

Not sure how this follows. Why do you think the tiny population of prep school grads would overpopulate the service academies? Our son graduated from one of the storied schools and was the only student in his class who even applied. In that cohort, many considered going into the military as a waste of the prep school education. More than one person joked to us when he accepted his appointment, "What happened? Did you run out of money?" We sure didn't see his choice coming.

But, I do remember clearly the speech by the headmaster during opening days his freshman year. The head looked across the new class and gravely said, "No one in this room had better dare consume over a quarter million dollars of this world's goods without considering the weight of that consumption," basically a rephrasing of how we had raised him: To him whom much has been given, much is expected. Service was a huge component of his high school education. We just didn't consider the military as the way he'd continue his commitment to his fellow man and stewardship of the planet.

Also, the profile of the classes at those schools runs the gamut of rich to poor (most have mind-blowing endowments and generous financial aid), shows a fairly even male:female ratio, and reflects all skin colors and global cultures. Our son's school had students from 44 countries. His exposure to that range of people and perspectives was quite enriching, and I believe it is important for the service academies to continue to attract and recruit future officers from all sectors of our society--including prep schools.

Not sure how this follows. Why do you think the tiny population of prep school grads would overpopulate the service academies? Our son graduated from one of the storied schools and was the only student in his class who even applied. In that cohort, many considered going into the military as a waste of the prep school education. More than one person joked to us when he accepted his appointment, "What happened? Did you run out of money?" We sure didn't see his choice coming.

But, I do remember clearly the speech by the headmaster during opening days his freshman year. The head looked across the new class and gravely said, "No one in this room had better dare consume over a quarter million dollars of this world's goods without considering the weight of that consumption," basically a rephrasing of how we had raised him: To him whom much has been given, much is expected. Service was a huge component of his high school education. We just didn't consider the military as the way he'd continue his commitment to his fellow man and stewardship of the planet.

Also, the profile of the classes at those schools runs the gamut of rich to poor (most have mind-blowing endowments and generous financial aid), shows a fairly even male:female ratio, and reflects all skin colors and global cultures. Our son's school had students from 44 countries. His exposure to that range of people and perspectives was quite enriching, and I believe it is important for the service academies to continue to attract and recruit future officers from all sectors of our society--including prep schools.

To whom much has been given, much is expected.
That quote has been hanging on the wall of my daughter’s room for over 10 years!
Prestigious (are there any other types) private Prep school that is gracious enough to give her plenty of Financial Aid. Oh, and not one of the additional 120 students in her class is looking to go SA or NROTC!
Every other kid is looking Ivy or bust!

 

[mike1979]

The best educated kids come from prep schools? Wow, such a different experience for my kids. Both always public school kids. Younger one who's applying now attends a very large public school. Took each test only once. First time was the SAT at the end of sophomore year. Scored high enough to be asked to become a certified SAT tutor on a free platform that partners with Khan Academy. Took the ACT for the free school day test given to juniors. Scored a perfect score. I never paid a dime for prep; there's plenty of free resources out there. So interesting the different experiences.

Private schools are not about high ACT and SAT scores. Of course, just like everywhere else, there would be kids with high and lower test scores. However, there is so much more to the school than just the scores. Our school runs a little over 50k per year for each of our two children. Someone might think that the number is crazy, but it really not when kids are coming back home everyday with big smiles and are in the environment that promotes learning.

 

[severn]

... another comment here regarding prep schools. Like I said before, I'm trying to be very tactful here and if I said anything close to political incorrectness, I apologized. My family's military heritage started during the 1898 Spanish-American War. With the Global War on Terrorism (GWOT), it really took a toll on my family twice removed with several closed caskets. The prep school for us is just the means (academic excellence) to justify the ends (Academies/Serving our Country).

 

[jbm2m]

... another comment here regarding prep schools. Like I said before, I'm trying to be very tactful here and if I said anything close to political incorrectness, I apologized. My family's military heritage started during the 1898 Spanish-American War. With the Global War on Terrorism (GWOT), it really took a toll on my family twice removed with several closed caskets. The prep school for us is just the means (academic excellence) to justify the ends (Academies/Serving our Country).

For what it’s worth - and I’m probably closer to your side of whatever debate was going on here - I didn’t perceive any political incorrectness. I also don’t think you need justify the decisions you’ve made to put your child(ren) in the best possible position to achieve their goals. My DD has gone to both private and public schools. Both were the right choices at their respective times.

 

[Holden100]

Private schools are not about high ACT and SAT scores. Of course, just like everywhere else, there would be kids with high and lower test scores. However, there is so much more to the school than just the scores. Our school runs a little over 50k per year for each of our two children. Someone might think that the number is crazy, but it really not when kids are coming back home everyday with big smiles and are in the environment that promotes learning.

My son's school is also about much more than just high test scores, but I didn't feel the need to run down his entire resume. The OP referenced test scores and tutoring, and how many resources he put into them. Again, different experiences. My son is also very happy with his free public school and is very well educated and, frankly, a very nice, kind kid.

 

[Proud of DGD]

The only thing worse than politicians are special interest group lobbyists. They do not want what is best for the country. They want what is best for their version of the country and will exploit the laws and their bought politicians to make it happen. Ridiculously rich "pious" religious groups are the worst.

As for ultra-liberal people not wanting to serve? Tell us how you really feel. My son and I are pretty f---ing liberal, and I'm a war vet and the kid is doing pretty darn well at the Academy and wants to serve.

We also are very liberal: my husband and father are/were war vets. Our granddaughter is doing great at the Academy and is excited to serve. One thing I haven’t seen brought up in this discussion is how much effort do schools put into showcasing SA’s as an option for both college and a way to serve. IMO the schools that send a number of kids to SA’s probably do a better job of promoting the academies than the others. Kids have to know about this option to think about and prepare to try to go that route. Most kids do not come from military families!

 

[OldRetSWO]

One thing I haven’t seen brought up in this discussion is how much effort do schools put into showcasing SA’s as an option for both college and a way to serve. IMO the schools that send a number of kids to SA’s probably do a better job of promoting the academies than the others.

Wow! What I wouldn't give to see schools that would do that. I've never seen it at any of my BGO schools nor at the schools that my kids attended nor at my own high school. I know that in my own high school, there was a several year old copy of the USNA catalog in the giant collection of catalogs that guidance had but beyond that, there was nothing.

 

[NavyHoops]

We also are very liberal: my husband and father are/were war vets. Our granddaughter is doing great at the Academy and is excited to serve. One thing I haven’t seen brought up in this discussion is how much effort do schools put into showcasing SA’s as an option for both college and a way to serve. IMO the schools that send a number of kids to SA’s probably do a better job of promoting the academies than the others. Kids have to know about this option to think about and prepare to try to go that route. Most kids do not come from military families!

I do agree with this. Mids themselves are the best recruiting tool they have. It’s why Army Navy is a big recruiting tool. It’s also why Summer Seminar is not necessarily merit based, but used as an out reach tool to bring in kids from areas that are not or limited in representation at USNA. It is also why there are programs to bring in school leaders to USNA for exposure. It is amazing how some places in our country really do not have a clue what a SA is. I came from a very liberal part of the country who even got told ‘it’s shame I had to join the military with my resume.’ I mean, I turned down an Ivy, not the SA. It’s also why, even decades later, we are our best recruiters. As much as I want to scream at what appears to be ignorance, answering with ignorance doesn’t do any good. I still take the time to educate and explain, if warranted. SAs are a great option for the right kid.

 

[A1Janitor]

Ridiculously rich "pious" religious groups are the worst.

I can think of far worse.

 

[bethf]

We also are very liberal: my husband and father are/were war vets. Our granddaughter is doing great at the Academy and is excited to serve. One thing I haven’t seen brought up in this discussion is how much effort do schools put into showcasing SA’s as an option for both college and a way to serve. IMO the schools that send a number of kids to SA’s probably do a better job of promoting the academies than the others. Kids have to know about this option to think about and prepare to try to go that route. Most kids do not come from military families!

So true. There is NO presence from SA's at my DS's school. (large midwestern, public school) They have had a grad enter a SA about every 2-3 years. Those kids are talked about with respect, but that's it. NO outreach from MOC in our area at all (we traveled to a neighboring state for an Academy Day). However, the ROTC programs reps do visit the high school and are very helpful. One told my son NOT to go to a SA... He's applying to both paths, but it's interesting that he outright discouraged him from the SA path. Luckily, my boy can't be swayed from his goal.

 

[AF6872]

My Mid was appointed from a Saint Grottelsex school. A surprise to all when applied and was accepted but a very very very very few with some military family were not. One student applied from the class behind and was also accepted. Before and since none. Prep Schools are not the pipeline for Sevice Acadmies.

 

[A1Janitor]

My son thought he was the first grad to go to USNA. Until he graduated and was congratulated by a high school grad that graduated in 72. Just missed the 50 year anniversary.

In our school - they don’t push it. They don’t push Boy’s State either - which I think is as big a sin. In my school they offer it by class rank. Never heard of it before he was offered it. And they did not submit info timely - luckily the head of Boy’s State at AL was a former client and friend, and was a seabee.

Many of the admins and teachers at our school are anti-military.

 

[Capt MJ]

My Mid was appointed from a Saint Grottelsex school. A surprise to all when applied and was accepted but a very very very very few with some military family were not. One student applied from the class behind and was also accepted. Before and since none. Prep Schools are not the pipeline for Sevice Acadmies.

I think I have mentioned Germantown Friends School in Philadelphia refused to send transcripts to USNA for DH back in the 20th C., which I will respect as they were consistent with their religious tenets. His parents had to get a court order and also got plenty of snark from other parents. Excellent education, superb music program (DH also got into Curtis Institute of Music, but that’s a story for another day, plus 3 Ivies and Northwestern) - most definitely not a SA pipeline.

 

[A1Janitor]

Curtis Institute of Music on Locust!

I picked up a young black student from there and brought him two blocks. He thanked me for picking him up. I laughed and said that’s my job. He said he waited for over half an hour carrying his cello in case - no cabbie would pick him up (even the black ones). It was a culture shock to me.

Wonderful kid. Gave me a huge tip, which I tried to give back.

 

[MidCakePa]

We live in a purple-but-soon-blue state, in a city/county whose name is often preceded by “People’s Republic of….” (And yes, it’s home to our flagship state university.) DD and DS attended a small, independent school known for its academic rigor and intimate community (average size of graduating class: 60). A fellow parent makes this joke about our two families: “We’re in the 1%. The bottom 1%.” We’re fortunate that we were able to afford such an experience for our kids.)

Again, about 60 grads per year: The class ahead of DD’s produced an SA attendee. DD’s class had her as an SA attendee, plus two who won ROTC scholarships. (One of those has three older siblings, all of whom attended an SA or won an ROTC scholarship.) Another — #2 in the class — attended civilian college and then commissioned via OCS. DS’s class produced an SA attendee, plus DS as an ROTC scholarship winner.

Every one of these students received broad praise and admiration from the school community. They were lauded for their choices and accomplishments. They got full support and attention from the college guidance counselor. A B&G officer comes to campus a couple times a year. And the academy cadets/mids/alum return to make presentations.

For those who know little or nothing about these options: It’s all about education and exposure. I too get miffed and amused when less-knowing people show their ignorance about the military in general, and officer-accession paths in particular. Rather than roll my eyes and tsk-tsk, I’ve learned to use it as an opportunity to explain things. They’re usually appreciative, often surprised, but hopefully always a bit wiser about it all.

Aside: Before moving here from another liberal hotbed, DS attended a Catholic all-girls school known for its top-notch academics, athletics and arts. I once mentioned to a top administrator DD’s blossoming desire to attend an SA, and asked if anything about the school’s philosophy or mission would serve to discourage her. “Oh, heavens no,” the administrator replied. “If that’s what she wants, we’ll do all we can to help her.”

 

[severn]

... Philly? Cool place.
I was stationed there as a recruiting officer. My office is located by 2nd & Chestnut next to Penn's Landing. My DS was born in Pennsylvania Hospital by 800 Spruce Street and attended Germantown Academy K-6. 4th of July celebration is a big deal over there. The descendants (young children ) of the signers of the Declaration of Independence would ring the Liberty Bell. When DS was young, we often visit the Philadelphia Museum of Art (Rocky on top of the steps) and South Street for Philly cheesesteaks.

 

[Kentucky9]

Racism, too profitable of a scourge to let die ! Another prime example as to where the will of the people is light years ahead of “explicit laws.”

 

[severn]

... not sure if this is interesting to some folks. The sacred remains of Saint Katherine Drexel was transferred from the Bensalem's Shrine to the Cathedral Basilica of Saints Peter and Paul (1 mile from museum). Whenever we're in Philly, we visit St. Katherine.