AROTC Scholarship vaccine religious exemption question

OP, this has been discussed and re-discussed for pages and pages. If you are interested in reading past discussion, drop some search words into the search box, grab some popcorn and have at it!

There isn’t a definitive, easy answer. But let us know if the exemption comes though, if that’s the route she goes.
 
NickHarlan said:
My daughter is a freshman at a SMC on a 3 year AROTC scholarship. She has been told she needs to be vaccinated or seek an exemption by May of this year. She is 100% opposed to getting the vaccine and is seeking a religious exemption. I have some questions/requests:
1. If anyone has any insight in seeking religious exemption (from any branch) I would be most appreciative of any guidance.
2. Given changes that might happen with mandates would she be able to “keep” her scholarship even if she does not qualify come August? How long does she have to qualify before she loses scholarship?
3. It would be a hardship but we could pay her tuition and board and forego scholarship and hope the army lifts mandate before she graduates. For someone who very much wants to serve would this be a reasonable option?

Thank you
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Quick question, has your daughter received any other vaccines? Or has she never been vaccinated at all? Either way, she should probably be told that she's going to have to get many vaccines if she wishes to serve and that exemptions are few. Since it is apparently not some health problem causing hesitation, I would encourage you to ask her to think about what means more to her.
If she loves her country deeply, then perhaps she can overcome her personal trepidations and realize that if she hopes to serve there is a strong possibility of giving up her autonomy in many ways. If she truly cannot overcome her trepidations, then it might be for the best to consider another path to service. Military service is certainly not the only way you can help your country, and there are many other paths someone might take.
 
Also, if your name is your real name, you have id’ed your daughter in your first post…and if anonymity is important (imo, it should be…or at least make sure she is ok with it), might want to change that. Especially given this is a medical/religious/controversial issue 😬
 
Well everyone has an opinion, no surprise there, but despite what I thought we’re some reasonable questions people just really like to opine. Thank you to those who provided insight and suggestions.

Yes she has spoken at length to her leadership and is handling the process on own. Yes I know enough to use a pseudonym.
 
So you believe that the Medical Services Officer and more than one registered health care providers repeatedly telling you that your information on the status of COVID vaccines are incorrect is just "opining". This post-truth fantasia in which anti-vaxxers seem to exist is just too ridiculous to expect us all to politely debate around. If your daughter is willing to throw away her military career by refusing to take a vaccine that everyone else is just going to roll up their sleeves and take then all power to her, I am sure there are many other fields in which she will excel.
 
NickHarlan said:
Well everyone has an opinion, no surprise there, but despite what I thought we’re some reasonable questions people just really like to opine. Thank you to those who provided insight and suggestions.

Yes she has spoken at length to her leadership and is handling the process on own. Yes I know enough to use a pseudonym.
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Honestly, all people CAN do is opine. This is all new, and ever changing. Just this morning a ‘potential new strain’ has ‘been identified’. So whatever that means to anything….is all opinion.

People insert their own experiences to help guide. Bc that’s all there is in this pandemic. If only there were a crystal ball 🔮!!

Good deal on the name. Many don’t think about that, yours looked like a normal name. Just trying to help, as always 😉

It’ll be interesting to see how this turns out for her. All part of adulting. This generation has been through a lot, that’s for sure! Let us know as it will potentially be helpful to future readers.
 
Small Team Bacsi said:
I may opine, and I often do, but we have actual military health care experts on this thread being told they are wrong by a non AD military parent. :)

This is the world we now live in where experts and facts can be disputed because people don’t like the facts.
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I'm with you. I know the mod rules out political discussion but it's absolutely wild that some of these basic, fundamental topics are even considered political. Weird times and what a fine line we dance on in this forum.... feels like we're SCOTUSes at the SOTU, afraid to clap for the kid in the upper deck.
 
Are any of you "King of The Hill" fans? There will always be Dale Gribbles in the World.
 
"Well then SECDEF is being lied to as there is not a single dose of a FDA approved vaccine in existence in the USA. Just because someone said or wrote something or you found it on Google does not make it a fact"

I found his quote to be particularly ironic. My credentials are null and void based off of an Infowars podcast I'm sure.
 
The military offers a religious exemption to those that wish to file for it. That process is authorized and being used by military members. If religious exemption claims were automatically denied, then why have the process? It’s sad that people are being judged so harshly for not wanting to take the vaccine for their personal /religious reasons.
It was quoted earlier that only 15/16000 have been approved for religious exemption. That number does not reflect how many are still pending. This vaccine debate is fluid as are the effects/efficacy of the “vaccine “.
I know some religious exemption requests were denied at company level, and others were sent all the way to the top. It is quite a process, and if one chooses to file for it be prepared to explain your case in interviews and with documents.
Those still pending will likely be shelved and no action taken one way or the other IMO .
Good luck to the op and their DD!
 
shock-n-awe said:
The military offers a religious exemption to those that wish to file for it. That process is authorized and being used by military members. If religious exemption claims were automatically denied, then why have the process? It’s sad that people are being judged so harshly for not wanting to take the vaccine for their personal /religious reasons.
It was quoted earlier that only 15/16000 have been approved for religious exemption. That number does not reflect how many are still pending. This vaccine debate is fluid as are the effects/efficacy of the “vaccine “.
I know some religious exemption requests were denied at company level, and others were sent all the way to the top. It is quite a process, and if one chooses to file for it be prepared to explain your case in interviews and with documents.
Those still pending will likely be shelved and no action taken one way or the other IMO .
Good luck to the op and their DD!
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I think the question raised earlier is, "What is the religious exemption?" Point being, is this actually a religious exemption, or is it just a personal preference trying to piggyback on the religious exemption policy. For example, Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine says no to certain blood products based off of their interpretation of scripture - which is fine. We can point to it and say, "alright, I get it." So what exactly, in this persons religious beliefs or interpretation of scripture does not allow for the COVID-19 vaccine?

I compare this with people who push legalization of marijuana based off of "medical purposes" when they themselves simply want to use it for recreational purposes and have no medical condition themselves, nor do any family members who could benefit from the use of marijuana.
 
I wonder if we now live in a world where AD or their parents would feel free to pick and choose combat deployments based on risk factors and or podcasts.

I think we just might be.

If so the good news is ——we no longer have an active selective service draft.
 
Anonymous1211 said:
I think the question raised earlier is, "What is the religious exemption?" Point being, is this actually a religious exemption, or is it just a personal preference trying to piggyback on the religious exemption policy. For example, Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine says no to certain blood products based off of their interpretation of scripture - which is fine. We can point to it and say, "alright, I get it." So what exactly, in this persons religious beliefs or interpretation of scripture does not allow for the COVID-19 vaccine?

I compare this with people who push legalization of marijuana based off of "medical purposes" when they themselves simply want to use it for recreational purposes and have no medical condition themselves, nor do any family members who could benefit from the use of marijuana.
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I'm curious about this, too
 
Anonymous1211 said:
I think the question raised earlier is, "What is the religious exemption?" Point being, is this actually a religious exemption, or is it just a personal preference trying to piggyback on the religious exemption policy. For example, Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine says no to certain blood products based off of their interpretation of scripture - which is fine. We can point to it and say, "alright, I get it." So what exactly, in this persons religious beliefs or interpretation of scripture does not allow for the COVID-19 vaccine?

I compare this with people who push legalization of marijuana based off of "medical purposes" when they themselves simply want to use it for recreational purposes and have no medical condition themselves, nor do any family members who could benefit from the use of marijuana.
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In my experience for Catholics (my faith) it has been the use of a cell line that came from aborted material. My background is 30 years in drug research and development and I can tell you I cannot remember a single product/project have I worked on that did not use that cell line. it's a standard reagent in the lab these days.

Basing it on that then if that's your reason for not choosing the vaccine then you should have issues with many other drugs, prescription and OTC.

From my faith point of view and in reading discussions from within the church community many now see it as, yes it uses a reagent that came from an abortion many years ago however we view it as being for the greater good. I see some Catholics justifying it this way.

And as pro vaccine as I am I did struggle with this decision for my kids. They wanted the vaccine, I was carrying the guilt of if there are issues down the road then I have done that to them. But I guess that's decisions we make as parents every day!
 
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NickHarlan said:
My daughter is a freshman at a SMC on a 3 year AROTC scholarship. She has been told she needs to be vaccinated or seek an exemption by May of this year. She is 100% opposed to getting the vaccine and is seeking a religious exemption. I have some questions/requests:
1. If anyone has any insight in seeking religious exemption (from any branch) I would be most appreciative of any guidance.
2. Given changes that might happen with mandates would she be able to “keep” her scholarship even if she does not qualify come August? How long does she have to qualify before she loses scholarship?
3. It would be a hardship but we could pay her tuition and board and forego scholarship and hope the army lifts mandate before she graduates. For someone who very much wants to serve would this be a reasonable option?

Thank you
Click to expand...
OP, your DD should align with her unit on options to proceed either on scholarship or as a college programmer in the unit and at the university toward commissioning next year, if she is not yet vaccinated by the stated May, 2021 deadline. DD should file her request for a waiver and ask for time until that is fully adjudicated including any appeals beyond a May deadline, if doing so on religious grounds is factual. She should be clear on consequences and the timing of her upcoming decisions.

Just note if she starts the scholarship but ultimately does not commission over this, she would owe all scholarship monies back. the 4 year scholarship has a free first year grace period. But this is not a 4 year scholarship.

I think you're asking a reasonable question in case the requirement changes in the future/ before commissioning etc.

Similar to the guidance I gave my kids when teaching them to drive, military can be an "I say, you do" environment. If I said "hit the brakes", the driver in training had to hit the brakes, not take it as an optional suggestion. Mr. Miagi had the same guiderails for Daniel-san. take some time to think about whether the military is a like-environment to that, or more of a democracy. if that hankles your feathers or whatever the expression is, then consider whether the Army is a good fit. In the corp world we call it "flouting authority" when someone does not follow direction - it's grounds for career derailment here too.

A lot of people are certain about this vaccine and whether to take it. I took it and the booster too but who knows maybe in 30 years those who took it will all drop like flies while those who held out go to our estate sales. in the meantime no need to negate what other people provide for your consideration - assume a positive intent that they are trying to help - OP you're coming across like a 2 year old who covers his ears and yells "you stink" loudly when he doesn't like what he hears in some of your responses.

Good luck to your DD - thanks for her willingness to serve.
 
Small Team Bacsi said:
I may opine, and I often do, but we have actual military health care experts on this thread being told they are wrong by a non AD parent. :)

This is the world we now live in where experts and facts can be disputed because people don’t like the facts.
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I wasn’t clear. I’m talking about opining on things like how courts will handle this, new strand evolving, personal rights, military protocols, etc etc.

I’m not talking about opining on the actual healthcare aspect of the virus/vax. But rather the peripheral stuff to that. IDK, but this is the most controversial global pandemic that comes to my mind 🤷‍♀️ And all its tentacles are still morphing and changing. This is all making the rules. There isn’t presently a rule book out there to follow. To know what will happen going forward.

I don’t pretend to have answers. It’s fascinating.
 
Herman_Snerd said:
OP, your DD should align with her unit on options to proceed either on scholarship or as a college programmer in the unit and at the university toward commissioning next year, if she is not yet vaccinated by the stated May, 2021 deadline. DD should file her request for a waiver and ask for time until that is fully adjudicated including any appeals beyond a May deadline, if doing so on religious grounds is factual. She should be clear on consequences and the timing of her upcoming decisions.

Just note if she starts the scholarship but ultimately does not commission over this, she would owe all scholarship monies back. the 4 year scholarship has a free first year grace period. But this is not a 4 year scholarship.

I think you're asking a reasonable question in case the requirement changes in the future/ before commissioning etc.

Similar to the guidance I gave my kids when teaching them to drive, military can be an "I say, you do" environment. If I said "hit the brakes", the driver in training had to hit the brakes, not take it as an optional suggestion. Mr. Miagi had the same guiderails for Daniel-san. take some time to think about whether the military is a like-environment to that, or more of a democracy. if that hankles your feathers or whatever the expression is, then consider whether the Army is a good fit. In the corp world we call it "flouting authority" when someone does not follow direction - it's grounds for career derailment here too.

A lot of people are certain about this vaccine and whether to take it. I took it and the booster too but who knows maybe in 30 years those who took it will all drop like flies while those who held out go to our estate sales. in the meantime no need to negate what other people provide for your consideration - assume a positive intent that they are trying to help - OP you're coming across like a 2 year old who covers his ears and yells "you stink" loudly when he doesn't like what he hears in some of your responses.

Good luck to your DD - thanks for her willingness to serve.
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Thank you for this well thought out and helpful response. As for the comment on me being a 2 year old, pretty sure my spouse would agree so you are a little late to the game on that one.
 
Anonymous1211 said:
I think the question raised earlier is, "What is the religious exemption?" Point being, is this actually a religious exemption, or is it just a personal preference trying to piggyback on the religious exemption policy. For example, Jehovah's Witnesses doctrine says no to certain blood products based off of their interpretation of scripture - which is fine. We can point to it and say, "alright, I get it." So what exactly, in this persons religious beliefs or interpretation of scripture does not allow for the COVID-19 vaccine?

I compare this with people who push legalization of marijuana based off of "medical purposes" when they themselves simply want to use it for recreational purposes and have no medical condition themselves, nor do any family members who could benefit from the use of marijuana.
Click to expand...
And if the religious exemption is based on medications that used fetal cell lines during research and development, do these people also refuse to take other medication that used the same system like acetaminophen, albuterol, aspirin, ibuprofen, Tylenol, Pepto Bismol, Tums, Lipitor, Senokot, Motrin, Maalox, Ex-Lax, Benadryl, Sudafed, Preparation H, Claritin, Prilosec, and Zoloft?
 
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