attrition

Does anyone know how many NC's in the class of 2021 decided to resign or were separated from USMA? What's the normal as far as numbers? This is not meant to be a slight towards anyone. only asking out of curiosity.
 

mom3boys

10-Year Member
It changes daily. On A day, the number of cadets will be announced. Do some math and you'll know for sure.
 

USMAROTCFamily

5-Year Member
I'll be interested to hear the number, too. It just seems there are more comments on other groups about New Cadets leaving this summer during beast than in the most recent years. I suppose it could be very similar to other years, but perhaps more parents or cadets are commenting about the ones who are leaving for various reasons, which include injuries, too.
 

another13mom

10-Year Member
I think new cadet parents are just more aware of kids leaving because of the community created on the class parent pages, and the comfort level to share that your child is leaving and so you are/will be leaving the class page. Each year we see the same concern (i.e., seems like a higher number), but most likely it's because you're hearing it and paying attention. This news doesn't make it to the larger pages unless the parents are asking for advice/prayers from all classes.
 

SMP

Member
For comparison purposes, 1,290 were admitted for the Class of 2020 and by Parent Plebe Weekend in March the class was down to 1,218.
 

jl123

Member
For comparison purposes, 1,290 were admitted for the Class of 2020 and by Parent Plebe Weekend in March the class was down to 1,218.
Now with turn-backs it's up to 1,275 (as of mid-June)
 
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LongAgoPlebe

5-Year Member
Pardon my ignorance, but what are turn backs?
Turnbacks are individuals who become sick or injured during BCT and cannot complete the rest of training with that class. They're discharged, but offered either guaranteed re-admission or an expedited re-admission process for the next year to begin BCT again with the next class.
 

jl123

Member
For comparison purposes, 1,290 were admitted for the Class of 2020 and by Parent Plebe Weekend in March the class was down to 1,218.
Now with turn-backs it's up to 1,275 (as of mid-June)
Pardon my ignorance, but what are turn backs?
In addition to those that did not complete beast, turn-backs include those from from the next higher class (in this case last year's yearlings, 2019) that did not move on with their class due to a variety of reasons - disciplinary, academic, medical, etc
 

SMP

Member
For comparison purposes, 1,290 were admitted for the Class of 2020 and by Parent Plebe Weekend in March the class was down to 1,218.
Now with turn-backs it's up to 1,275 (as of mid-June)
Pardon my ignorance, but what are turn backs?
In addition to those that did not complete beast, turn-backs include those from from the next higher class (in this case last year's yearlings, 2019) that did not move on with their class due to a variety of reasons - disciplinary, academic, medical, etc
Ahh, that makes sense. Thanks. Quite a few of them joined up with the Class of 2020.
 

MidwestDad

Member
USAFA '21 is back from Jack's Valley; if forum reports are accurate 1186 completed basic vs 1198 scheduled to report on I-day.
On our April appointee tour they stressed how they were striving to limit the attrition rate during basic; 12 cadets is only 1%.

Not saying its soft out there . . . but sounds low.
 

Cerberi

Member
USAFA '21 is back from Jack's Valley; if forum reports are accurate 1186 completed basic vs 1198 scheduled to report on I-day.
On our April appointee tour they stressed how they were striving to limit the attrition rate during basic; 12 cadets is only 1%.

Not saying its soft out there . . . but sounds low.
USAFA was concerned a few years ago that their BCT attrition was higher than other SA's (probably because it is simply more demanding : ) ) . There was a time that if you said you wanted to leave - you could be on a flight home that night or PDF. (1) Screening to get appointed is much better for all SAs - one of the first questions to a candidate - subtly or directly - is this for you or your parents. (2) All the SA's have pretty extensive counseling and they have made a commitment to lowering attrition i.e. - it's harder to quit (There are good reasons for this).

It wasn't all that long ago (or maybe is was a long time ago and I refuse to admit it) that USAFA in particular admitted 1500 to yield 1000. Now attrition overall is 10-12% for the 4 years - this includes academics, medical/physical, discipline etc.
 

jl123

Member
It wasn't all that long ago (or maybe is was a long time ago and I refuse to admit it) that USAFA in particular admitted 1500 to yield 1000. Now attrition overall is 10-12% for the 4 years - this includes academics, medical/physical, discipline etc.
It was a long, long time ago ;)

My USMA class entered with 1,400+ and graduated 900+. I think the internet, YouTube, etc gives applicants a much better sense of what they are getting into - essentially the largest source of attrition today comes from those who don't even apply once they realize what lies ahead. We dinosaurs often walked in blindly.
 

candor

Member
Sorry to go a bit off topic here, but I was at an USAFA appointee tour in April, and during a briefing, they told us that starting this year at BCT, NCs would not be able to leave/quit unless there were medical issues or special circumstances. They also noted that on the candidate manual in the application portal.
 

jl123

Member
Sorry to go a bit off topic here, but I was at an USAFA appointee tour in April, and during a briefing, they told us that starting this year at BCT, NCs would not be able to leave/quit unless there were medical issues or special circumstances. They also noted that on the candidate manual in the application portal.
I don't think they can keep a new cadet from quitting, but they can stretch the out-processing quite a long time and make it more painful than just finishing the summer.:hammer:

Not sure about the details of this, but I was told by a USNA midshipman that tried to quit that he was required to continue with training for about two weeks while paperwork was being "processed". During that time he changed his mind.

One goal at all the academies is to prevent shortsighted decisions while under stress.
 

another13mom

10-Year Member
Class of 2017 started with just over 1200. By the Supe's brief at 3PM, it was down to 1193 because of R-day screening fails (weight/injury)(one new cadet wouldn't get out the car)(the mom posted asking for assistance). 936 graduated.
 
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