Best major for a career on deck and eventually harbor pilot?
- Thread starter eggnog
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Most people believe ML&S is a more challenging major and provides a broader view of the maritime industry. I am not in the industry, but I am friends with several maritime leaders. They all have voiced a preference for ML&S, and see "straight deck" as the easy path. You can find a list of required classes for all five majors on the USMMA website under "Academics."
If by career on deck you mean sailing as deck officer, either will result in a 3/M license. Out of curiosity I looked at the course lists. The difference between the two programs is really minimal. M L&S just looks like what I would considered a minor within the Marine Transportation major. When you go to work on ships no one will care which you picked as long as you work hard, have a thick skin, good sense of humor, and never leave the coffee pot empty.
Ironic, have you been accepted to the academy yet? You're already shooting for the pinnacle of licensed deck officers, harbor pilots. Unless you have family relations, for the associations that you can actually get into you need 1000+ days at sea on your license, you need to draw the charts pretty precisely with almost all the features, and you need to win favor with the full pilots in the association. Each of these is a monumental task. Sandy Hook (New York) doesn't require a license OR an academy education, only a college degree. I think Virginia is the same.
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Most pilots associations do not require a college degree so any one will do.
Maybe true but
ML&S is not challenging, but it is a lot more work. Straight deck is less credits in the classroom and fewer hours working outside the classroom as well. Straight deckies some trimesters have such a light load they don't know what to do with themselves. However, the extra work is on the business and security side which is of no value to somebody who wants to be a harbor pilot. If you just want to be a harbor pilot and nothing else then take Marine Transportation.
The difference in the course list may be minimal. BUT the few extra classes in ML&S carry A LOT of work. Chartering & Brokerage, Security Seminar, and Senior Capstone, Port & Terminal Ops to name a few are not easy courses and carry heavy workloads. My senior year some in ML&S failed Chartering & Brokerage and the school dropped them down to straight deck because the only way to make up that class would be to a setback. Senior year in Marine Transportation is a breeze, senior year in ML&S is spent writing reports and projects.
ML&S is not challenging, but it is a lot more work. Straight deck is less credits in the classroom and fewer hours working outside the classroom as well. Straight deckies some trimesters have such a light load they don't know what to do with themselves. However, the extra work is on the business and security side which is of no value to somebody who wants to be a harbor pilot. If you just want to be a harbor pilot and nothing else then take Marine Transportation.
The difference in the course list may be minimal. BUT the few extra classes in ML&S carry A LOT of work. Chartering & Brokerage, Security Seminar, and Senior Capstone, Port & Terminal Ops to name a few are not easy courses and carry heavy workloads. My senior year some in ML&S failed Chartering & Brokerage and the school dropped them down to straight deck because the only way to make up that class would be to a setback. Senior year in Marine Transportation is a breeze, senior year in ML&S is spent writing reports and projects.
Working on a Jones Act tanker, 80% of the pilots I run into are academy grads. Even had a Texas A&M grad going up the river once. If your one goal in life is to be a harbor pilot going to an academy is still your best bet. Talked to one of the Aransas guys about this recently, and he said call me when you get 1000+ on your license, or 700 something in 12 hour days and theyre only considering academy grads for new deputy pilots.
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We used to refer to liberty as "Deck Ops"
OP is asking about majors to become a harbor pilot. So I was explaining the difference. How is it relevant at all that systems is harder? To become a deputy pilot in Texas or Florida you need considerable sea time on your DECK license. If he had wanted to work at ConEd or the elevator company then by all means go systems. I always thought engine was better for employment options and regret going deck myself.
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Aspiring to be a pilot is a worthy goal and either major is will work.. The test for federal First Class Pilotage is not too bad, if you're prepared.. I've written for pilotage in three different ports and in my experience the chart draw was probably the easiest part in all of those tests. Accumulating the number of trips over the pilotage grounds in order to take the Coast Guard exam might be the more challenging prerequisite. As far as seatime, many pilot associations don't even require seatime on an unlimited license. I had two classmates who started their careers on ship assist tugs. They NEVER left the confines of San Francisco Bay, never advanced their license past unlimited 3rd Mate, and both went on to become full fledged SF bay pilots. They both had no 'family relations' to get into the association; they just worked their way up from deck hands to apprentice pilots to full pilots. I have friends that are pilots in the Puget Sound and down in Los Angeles/Long Beach that have similar backgrounds.. Just like anything, if you're good, you want it bad enough and you put in the work, it's attainable.. Also piloting is not for everybody. I just had to chuckle at the characterization of piloting as 'pinnacle of licensed deck officers'.. During my career I had a few occasions to handling my own ship in harbor and alongside, and although I was comfortable with shiphandling, it wasn't something I wanted to do for a living; especially on ships I wasn't familiar with; and I have a lot of colleagues that feel the same way. After you get into Kings Point [and hopefully graduate] you'll have plenty of time to sort all that out.. Take it all in small bites..
Also, piloting does take a certain mindset.. You know the difference between God and a pilot? God knows he's not a pilot..
It doesn't matter what your experience is with federal pilotage. Everybody knows that the standards for becoming a deputy state pilot and full pilot are much higher and more stringent. Captain on my ship has 40 years at sea, 20 as master on Jones Act tankers, first class pilot on the river and had a collision on the river saving the company some money. There's a reason that federal pilotage only applies to US Flagged vessels on a domestic voyage.
Yeah, there are a fair amount of tug jockeys that end up being pilots. . . .
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indeed there are.. and some of the best pilots I saw were tugboat guys that had never worked on a deep sea ship before becoming pilots..
A couple of the Lake Charles pilots are old Crowley hands. I know a recent Houston pilot retiree that also came from ocean tugs. Moran, I believe. We hade a couple of shipmates in common.