Congressional vs. Senatorial Nominations

[USAFAMamaBear]

Is it easier to get a congressional nomination or a senatorial nomination? How do you find out how many slots a congress member or senator have available at each service academy?

 

[Miracle]

Congressional is easier because senatorial nomination is mainly used for candidates who are worthy of a nomination but haven't received it from their congressional representative. To be honest, it really depends on where you live too. Some districts more competitive than others. Each member of congress can nominate 10.

 

[kinnem]

Depends on where you live. Of course for a Senatorial you are competing at a state level vs your congressional district. Nevertheless, apply for all nomination sources for which you are elegible, including the VP nom.

 

[justdoit19]

Congressional is easier because senatorial nomination is mainly used for candidates who are worthy of a nomination but haven't received it from their congressional representative. To be honest, it really depends on where you live too. Some districts more competitive than others. Each member of congress can nominate 10.

Actually this isn’t necessarily true. It could be, but maybe not. Additionally, each MOC can have 5, so there are years they actually submit a total of 20 noms.

Lots of candidates have a congressional and senatorial (or 2) noms. Both of my sons did. It’s not uncommon at all.

 

[USAFAMamaBear]

We just found out from our representative's office that they only have one spot this year for the Air Force Academy. We live in Washington state, I already have one son at the Air Force Academy, but my younger son is applying this year. We are wondering if this will be a disadvantage for him. It has been their dream to be at the Academy together since they were little boys.

 

[Capt MJ]

Each Senator and Representative can choose their own internal due dates, evaluation process, interview/no interview, rank/no rank method, collaborate with other elected officials or not within the state as to dupe/no dupe of names across any slate, and other factors, allowing for hundreds of combinations and no way to generalize across the nation based anecdotal experience in one District in any one cycle. Throw in the turnover of Representatives and Senators, and the landscape can change again.

Many applicants get on slates from all 3 elected officials, and for multiple academies. Some applicants get on only 1 slate, despite having applied to multiple SAs, because the elected officials collaborate. Many staffs will ask to be told if an applicant got a nom from Sen X, because their Rep will not duplicate the nom, and vice versa.

For new readers and lurkers, read posts critically, including from long-time posters, and realize occasionally things are stated as if they are facts, when they are really anecdotal observations or hearsay or speculation or opinion. It makes for interesting discussions, but please make a distinction between these and comments from primary sources such as Mr. Mullen, Deputy Director DoDMERB, various BGO/ALO/FFR/ROTC staff when they are talking about topics they have direct and official knowledge of.

 

[You]

We just found out from our representative's office that they only have one spot this year for the Air Force Academy. We live in Washington state, I already have one son at the Air Force Academy, but my younger son is applying this year. We are wondering if this will be a disadvantage for him. It has been their dream to be at the Academy together since they were little boys.

I've talked to an old West Point grad and his daughter received an appointment this last year. He said that it was a little more difficult for her than it was for him, but he didn't know if it was because his state had gotten more competitive or if admissions was harder on her because she had a relative who had already gone through the process. Regardless, your son will probably have to give it his all to be considered, I know I am! Good luck with the application, hope he gets in!

 

[kinnem]

We just found out from our representative's office that they only have one spot this year for the Air Force Academy. We live in Washington state, I already have one son at the Air Force Academy, but my younger son is applying this year. We are wondering if this will be a disadvantage for him. It has been their dream to be at the Academy together since they were little boys.

1 opening, for which a MOC can nominate a slate of 10 applicants, is the norm. Some years they might have 2 openings. You son's chances will be the same they are in any normal year.

 

[flieger83]

A little perspective here.

It's true that a MOC can have five "credited" appointees at any of the SA's requiring their nomination. MOST, not all but most, MOC's will stagger those such that they always have at least one opening a year. Imagine...you nominate 40 kids for four openings...and you fill them. You now have five (assuming there was one already). Now you're full unless that one is graduating. If they are, you get one the next year and now you're at five again...no openings for three or more years unless someone quits!!

So you rarely see that. In my 25 years as an ALO, I have had ONE occurrence where one of my MOC's (USS) had three openings due to circumstances, and he went to fill two of them. We nominated 20 kids...two were picked. The other 18 went into the qualified alternate pool. At the end of the cycle, another 12 of those were appointed! He wrote me a nice hand-written letter of commendation/appreciation that he sent to the Superintendent. The Sup't sent it to me with another note that says "Steve, I guess ya done good! - Mike Gould" He has a great sense of humor.

But I digress. Nominations are "typically" easier to receive from your US Representative than a US Senator. Why? The sheer numbers are the real culprit. When I was on one of my Senators' selection boards, we would interview 130-150 kids in one day (multiple boards of 2-3 people). When he was a US Rep...we'd interview 18-25 in a day, a single board of three. Odds are a LOT better when there's one opening, 10 nominations available, and only 15-30 competing. Try that with 10 nominations and 150 kids...

And for USAFAMamaBear...no, it's not going to affect DS#2. The Academy doesn't look at siblings, they look at candidates. When I was a cadet (back when Dino's roamed the T-Zo) there were several sets of siblings; the worst was a firstie and a doolie. The Academy has no problem "hiring" siblings if they're the best choice!

Steve
USAFA ALO
USAFA '83

 

[USAFAMamaBear]

This is incredibly helpful insight and information! Thank you so much for taking the time to give a meaningful response!! This also gives us a little more hope!!

 

[OldRetSWO]

I've talked to an old West Point grad and his daughter received an appointment this last year. He said that it was a little more difficult for her than it was for him, but he didn't know if it was because his state had gotten more competitive or if admissions was harder on her because she had a relative who had already gone through the process. Regardless, your son will probably have to give it his all to be considered, I know I am! Good luck with the application, hope he gets in!

I am a Service Academy alum who has a child who also got in and I have a number of classmates just from my own USNA company who also had children attend, some who had two. One in particular had two sons go to USNA and one to USMA.

 

[justdoit19]

This is incredibly helpful insight and information! Thank you so much for taking the time to give a meaningful response!! This also gives us a little more hope!!

Went through this myself (USNA)! I knew from being here on the forums that there wouldn’t be consideration towards a sibling application (although there is the “soft support”, whether from a BGO, MOC, perhaps admissions if between two completely equal candidates, of a family support. Familiarity. Ability of older sib to perform.). Maybe not outwardly, but IMO it could be in the back of someone’s mind somewhere along the way.

HOWEVER, I was still surprised son #2 wasn’t appointed as he had off the charts STEM scores academics, better than his sibling (who had good ones, but #2’s were better). Instead he was placed on the NWL. Eventually that also whittled down with appointments and there were only a couple left...he had moved on. Appointment offer came late in May. My point is that it’s a whole new ball game! For real.

It’s pretty cool to have siblings together, no matter what school. They have had a really good time together. Bonded even more than I could have imagined. I’ve gotten pictures that make me cry. And you will be able to help all those “new parents” you meet having already gone through stuff. Pay it forward!!

Good luck!! Will be watching this one!

 

[USAFAMamaBear]

Went through this myself (USNA)! I knew from being here on the forums that there wouldn’t be consideration towards a sibling application (although there is the “soft support”, whether from a BGO, MOC, perhaps admissions if between two completely equal candidates, of a family support. Familiarity. Ability of older sib to perform.). Maybe not outwardly, but IMO it could be in the back of someone’s mind somewhere along the way.

HOWEVER, I was still surprised son #2 wasn’t appointed as he had off the charts STEM scores academics, better than his sibling (who had good ones, but #2’s were better). Instead he was placed on the NWL. Eventually that also whittled down with appointments and there were only a couple left...he had moved on. Appointment offer came late in May. My point is that it’s a whole new ball game! For real.

It’s pretty cool to have siblings together, no matter what school. They have had a really good time together. Bonded even more than I could have imagined. I’ve gotten pictures that make me cry. And you will be able to help all those “new parents” you meet having already gone through stuff. Pay it forward!!

Good luck!! Will be watching this one!

Did your second child originally get a nomination from your congressman number or senator?

 

[jl123]

In states with one congressional district it is easier to get a Senatorial nomination than a nomination from the district MOC - Alaska, Wyoming, Montana, North Dakota, South Dakota, Vermont, and Delaware (2 Senators, 1 Representative).

Obviously this is generally speaking and may vary by number of slates or any other factor which affects the number of applicants for each MOC.

 

[justdoit19]

Did your second child originally get a nomination from your congressman number or senator?

2nd child had both Senator and Congressional noms.