First-class Cadets Discharge, has anyone gone to serve enlisted after graduating from the academy?

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pablo

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Has anyone refused to accept a commission after graduating from the air force academy? Did that person serve as enlisted or were they forced to pay back expenses?

The webpage https://www.academyadmissions.com/apply/commitment/ says "First-class cadets who complete the entire academic program and then resign or refuse to accept a commission may be ordered to active duty for four years as enlisted Airmen."
Is this four 4 of enlisted airmen service faster than having to stay at least 5 years of active duty?
What enlisted rank would the graduate receive? Will the graduate be able to work in a job related to his major? Say maintenance equipment if engineering major?
Or is it best to accept the commission and wait 5 years to pass fast? Why is it difficult to resign from a service academy? You get pushed not to do it by company commanders and instructors.
Thanks for replying.
 
I don’t understand the point of the OP’s question???
If you are at an SA or hope to be appointed to one you take an oath to serve. One that is in trade for your education and training that the taxpayer (me!🙋‍♀️) pays for.
The way your post reads it sounds like one is trying to game the system and get a degree and owe the least.
I’m confused. And potentially disappointed.
 
pablo said:
Has anyone refused to accept a commission after graduating from the air force academy? Did that person serve as enlisted or were they forced to pay back expenses?

The webpage https://www.academyadmissions.com/apply/commitment/ says "First-class cadets who complete the entire academic program and then resign or refuse to accept a commission may be ordered to active duty for four years as enlisted Airmen."
Is this four 4 of enlisted airmen service faster than having to stay at least 5 years of active duty?
What enlisted rank would the graduate receive? Will the graduate be able to work in a job related to his major? Say maintenance equipment if engineering major?
Or is it best to accept the commission and wait 5 years to pass fast? Why is it difficult to resign from a service academy? You get pushed not to do it by company commanders and instructors.
Thanks for replying.
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This is essentially the same question you asked in a thread you started in another forum, about someone completing and then deciding they wanted out. You will likely get similar answers. Are you “asking for a friend” or is this possibly you? Rhetorical question. You do not have to answer, but clearly you are spending a lot of what-if thinking on this.

What would it happen if a commissioned officer relinquished citizenship?

If an academy graduate relinquishes US citizenship and assumes other citizenship, how will the government enforce military obligation service? After all that person could not be commissioned since will no longer be a citizen, and even more could not be enlisted because he would be outside the...
www.serviceacademyforums.com

The section you quoted - the operable word is “may be ordered.” That is not the cadet’s choice, that he or she “may” choose enlisted service, that is the service academy’s choice. The academy will decide what is best for the service, keeping the person as an enlisted member or releasing them with a requirement to repay. Four years is obviously less than 5.

Just for additional context…

Monthly base pay for an O-1 with less than 2 years service: $3477.30. BAH housing allowance rates are much higher for officers.
Monthly base pay for an E-1: $1833.30 it is an entirely different life and work environment.
 
pablo said:
Or is it best to accept the commission and wait 5 years to pass fast?
Click to expand...
Ok. First thing first, if you do not want to commission into the military, do not attend a military academy.
pablo said:
Why is it difficult to resign from a service academy? You get pushed not to do it by company commanders and instructors.
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You can leave (not sure about the exact process, but I have several friends who have left in the last year) within the first year with no penalties. After that, you are committed, which makes a lot of sense because the AF has already paid a lot of money for your education.

Not really sure what the point of these questions are. As I said, military academies are aimed to create "officers of character motivated to lead the United States Air Force in service to our Nation," so if you know that you do not want to commission into the military, academies are probably not for you. That's not to say you cant change your mind once you are here, but.. well you get the point
 
OP, I cannot imagine the scenario you're describing. At the beginning of your third year you have to stop, think about your future and then sign a big old commitment doc that says I Want To Stay In For Lots More Years, I've Seriously Considered All The Ramifications And This Is Really What I Want. At that point the student has seen over two years of everything that the school can offer plus two summers around the service and there should be no surprises. This stopping point is intended to head off situation you've described. It should not come up.

And as mentioned above, part of the training of an officer is reflection and self-awareness, so these thoughts should be dealt with along the way, not shoved aside for two or three or four years until graduation suddenly looms. There are ample opportunities and exercises to draw these thoughts out for examination well before commitment, again, to prevent this situation.

On the other hand, late this summer a USCGA 3C was sworn in as an E4 and headed off to a cutter to live the enlisted life. I don't know the full story, but instead of just leaving the Coast Guard entirely he turned from the academy and the officer track to serve in a way that better matched his goals. He was smiling and proud and his family and friends were there, so no shame, just a better fit. Just another example of why you should know yourself and continually review your goals to be sure you're on your best path.
 
Peter2025 said:
Ok. First thing first, if you do not want to commission into the military, do not attend a military academy.

You can leave (not sure about the exact process, but I have several friends who have left in the last year) within the first year with no penalties. After that, you are committed, which makes a lot of sense because the AF has already paid a lot of money for your education.

Not really sure what the point of these questions are. As I said, military academies are aimed to create "officers of character motivated to lead the United States Air Force in service to our Nation," so if you know that you do not want to commission into the military, academies are probably not for you. That's not to say you cant change your mind once you are here, but.. well you get the point
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You may want to go read OP’s initial post on the topic at the link I posted. Whoever it is who has this issue, it seems like they are way down the path already.
 
Based on their own comments in their original thread about their ”friend” the “friend” no longer wants to live in the US nor serve in the US military.

somehow this never seemed to be realized after the end of two academy years.

They do want to stick around long enough to get their degree though. They don’t want to serve but they still want that degree.

My advice is to have your “friend” drop out of school now. Skip the degree.They don’t want to serve as an officer in the US military anyway

They can then start their enlisted path much quicker, Then they can go back to what ever country they want to live in that is not the USA.

They would have made better decisions they claim but according to them they could not stand up to contrary advice.

Sometimes just reading a post you realize that someone has no business being a US military officer.
 
Skipper07 said:
Serve the commitment you agreed to. It is cowardly to scam your way out of it.
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I typically agree with the vast majority of what you post but I think that you're off base here. As a Dept Head, XO and CO, I would not want anyone in my command who is just marking off time FROM DAY ONE as that can be a cancer on the command. If I had to take someone like that though, I'd very much prefer them to be enlisted than an officer as the officer can have a much greater impact on the command.
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If the poster is this against serving as an officer at this point then I strongly recommend resignation and then either serving an enlisted term or shouldering the financial hit and paying for your education.
 
OldRetSWO said:
As a Dept Head, XO and CO, I would not want anyone in my command who is just marking off time FROM DAY ONE as that can be a cancer on the command.
Click to expand...

I still have a strong distaste in my mouth for someone trying to purposely dodge their contract, but I do understand your point sir. I’ve seen how a negative attitude can affect my company and can only imagine it would be worse in the actual Navy.
 
Good points already.

I would suggest talking this through, face to face, with someone that can help you work through this. It sounds like you have some challenges/difficulties acknowledging your own self, and/or others. Maybe you are scared. Maybe having doubts. Maybe there are other struggles you are having. But you will have the best outcome talking all this through with someone. Counselors, chaplains, a mentor that has actual knowledge.

The past opportunities to walk away are gone. So no sense rehashing the mistakes or lost opportunities for that. It’s time to figure out going forward, that makes sense for everyone. Which may be the path you are already on, as is. Adulting.

There is no way to game anything. I’m sure it’s all been tried before. Even if someone here says ‘hey, I heard xxx works’, there is no guarantee it would play out the same way for you. As CaptMJ (who has also probably ‘seen is all’) stated…MAY is the operative word.
 
I have seen this play out in the Army. One of my fellow LTs was a very nice and smart guy. He went to a IVY league school and wanted to go to work on wall street with his buddies as an investment banker. He was in a different unit than I was, but I knew him pretty well. Not sure why he was so dead set to get out before his commitment was done, but his solution was to go to the PX and steal something on purpose and make sure the camera caught it. That did the trick, but an unintended consequence is that it also got him a discharge that wasn't a honorable discharge. I am not sure what kind he got, but it wasn't a good scene. I am sure that discharge could impact him for the rest of his life.
 
Well, after commitment, the service gets to decide if they would be better served by having another enlisted member or sending you the bill for what they spent educating you (and you then refusing to uphold the deal.)

Personally, I think the service is usually better off sending the bill.
 
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