January 4, 2011 AROTC Board

[leapyear]

Specific major required??

NewCollegeParent, your son received an Army ROTC letter stating that the scholarship was only good if he remained an engineering major? That's surprising to me. I thought that Army did not require a particular major like Navy and Air Force...

 

[gojack]

A large number of scholarship offerees simply drop from the program because ROTC is not for them. In some cases they were pressured into it by mom or dad. It is difficult for a board to evaluate motivation. It is much easier to evaluate motivation when awarding the on campus scholarships.

Not very surprising that many kids drop out/are dropped from ROTC, considering that only about half of college students actually complete their degree (in 6 years), and a more than a third drop out before their 2nd year even starts. Requiring that a cadet be on course to completing a degree in 4 years, with the addition work load of ROTC is going to clear out the less motivated. (as it should) And that is before you weed out the ones that think the military life is like an X-box game.

 

[Ohio2015Parent]

March 4

I think it's time we start the March board don't ya think!?

Hey, jlar316 - personally, I'd start it on March 8, I started the Jan one on the 4th...just a suggestion. That and this thread is going to hit 99,999 soon-I never thought about the counter not going into 100Ks so it should be amusing to see what happens(sorry moderators, but I need a laugh, this waiting is stressful)

Sounds like some of these letters are also odd for AROTC. Would like to hear more about the "engineering only" requirement in some of these letters. We never could get CC to change DS's original major from Civil Engineering to International Affairs/Undecided or anything else. He tried thru the application portal, contacting his POC etc...ROO told us it is still civil eng., he has no interest in this major now. So keep the info coming. Luckily his #1 school offers the program, so will have to see what you all come up with.

Have a good morning all. My oldest DD is coming home later today from college for spring break, so excited to see her

 

[Pima]

I agree with go jack.

I think it isn't just Xbox, but movies too. They have this illusion of what they "think" it is and when the 1st semester doesn't match they pull the "I am outta here" lever.

I also agree about the folks issue, especially in today's economy.

One thing I think the SA's do a better job at is weeding these applicants out. Believe it or not most AF ALO's are harder on military kids, because they have that fear it is the folks pushing. Sometimes they are the problem.

In today's society of keeping up with the Jones's you can see that the motivation is more about bragging rights.

Nobody flame me. I am not only a proud AFROTC Mom, but also was a military wife for 20 yrs of AD. I am not saying that every parent is that way, but that is life and there are those parents that do exist. It exists everywhere.

I am also with leap year re: the engineering, BUT, with the economic times and fewer scholarships available, yet the Army needing engineers, they may have decided this yr to follow the NROTC/AFROTC train of thought and state that the scholarship is for an intended major.

FWIW, the AFROTC also does state that, but they have also been known to allow a recipient to change majors. Again, in this economy, that happens very, very infrequently, so don't think you can say you are going to go engineering and spring semester at college change it over to govt and politics without jeopardizing that scholarship. Want to change it from engineering to another technical field that is one thing....change it from tech to non-tech is different.

 

[AlabamaMom]

One thing I noticed about DS letter is that it was for "Engineering" and the rules state that the scholarship is only availble at an accreditted engineering school, including if it is transfered. AlabamaMom, not sure if your son put GT becuse he is considering engineering, but if he did, it sounds like you need to plan on other Engineering schools. Hopefully Auburn won't give you heartburn. Good Luck

Engineering is his major of choice and Auburn is one of his choice schools. From what we have learned though Auburn's AROTC scholarships have been greatly decreased in the past few years. As a parent Auburn would be a great choice for him....it is not too far away plus he has a merit scholarship. DS's eyes are more on the SMC's. He would be happy at Auburn though

 

[Ohio2015Parent]

I am also with leap year re: the engineering, BUT, with the economic times and fewer scholarships available, yet the Army needing engineers, they may have decided this yr to follow the NROTC/AFROTC train of thought and state that the scholarship is for an intended major.

FWIW, the AFROTC also does state that, but they have also been known to allow a recipient to change majors. Again, in this economy, that happens very, very infrequently, so don't think you can say you are going to go engineering and spring semester at college change it over to govt and politics without jeopardizing that scholarship. Want to change it from engineering to another technical field that is one thing....change it from tech to non-tech is different.

Exactly what I'm afraid of the Army doing. ROO who saw DS's major not updated(he started the application last Feburary, when he truly was interested in Civil Engineering)said not to worry, the Army doesn't restrict major changes as long as you stay on 4 years to graduate and get PMS permission. They were actually pleased that DS talked about coming undeclared and being honest that he really wasn't 100% sure about any major. Apparently they talked quite a bit during the interview about this. Anyway, think I'm sending an email to ROO asking for clarification and guidance on this one. Will offer his feedback to go with whatever else current families are hearing too. Yet another twist and turn in the road

 

[jmbm]

I agree with go jack.

I think it isn't just Xbox, but movies too. They have this illusion of what they "think" it is and when the 1st semester doesn't match they pull the "I am outta here" lever.

I also agree about the folks issue, especially in today's economy.

One thing I think the SA's do a better job at is weeding these applicants out. Believe it or not most AF ALO's are harder on military kids, because they have that fear it is the folks pushing. Sometimes they are the problem.

In today's society of keeping up with the Jones's you can see that the motivation is more about bragging rights.

Nobody flame me. I am not only a proud AFROTC Mom, but also was a military wife for 20 yrs of AD. I am not saying that every parent is that way, but that is life and there are those parents that do exist. It exists everywhere.

I am also with leap year re: the engineering, BUT, with the economic times and fewer scholarships available, yet the Army needing engineers, they may have decided this yr to follow the NROTC/AFROTC train of thought and state that the scholarship is for an intended major.

FWIW, the AFROTC also does state that, but they have also been known to allow a recipient to change majors. Again, in this economy, that happens very, very infrequently, so don't think you can say you are going to go engineering and spring semester at college change it over to govt and politics without jeopardizing that scholarship. Want to change it from engineering to another technical field that is one thing....change it from tech to non-tech is different.

I agree with "parent push" idea. In my DS's case, ROTC is totally his idea. He has been fortunate enough to participate and thrive in his HS JROTC program which consists of over 90% of the students at his school. He has not received a scholarship so we will wait with the others. I am beginning to wonder if you preferred choice of HS sports (precision air rifle) has lessened his chances since this is not your typical "jock" sport. The discipline involved in the sport is tremendous and he has excelled and he and his team will represent the AJROTC at the All Service National Championships. Wish there were more we could do, but......

 

[olddave]

He may be the lucky recipient of a campus-based scholarship. Congratulations.

Please explain what the difference is with a campus based scholarship. Are
campus based scholarships not reflected on the AROTC scholarship status website?

Thanks

 

[CandidateInSD]

I agree with "parent push" idea. In my DS's case, ROTC is totally his idea. He has been fortunate enough to participate and thrive in his HS JROTC program which consists of over 90% of the students at his school. He has not received a scholarship so we will wait with the others. I am beginning to wonder if you preferred choice of HS sports (precision air rifle) has lessened his chances since this is not your typical "jock" sport. The discipline involved in the sport is tremendous and he has excelled and he and his team will represent the AJROTC at the All Service National Championships. Wish there were more we could do, but......

Congratulations on making Nationals, we shall see you there at the end of the month!!

 

[Ohio2015Parent]

Please explain what the difference is with a campus based scholarship. Are
campus based scholarships not reflected on the AROTC scholarship status website?

Thanks

I'll try and explain this, hopefully one of the "experts" will be along shortly. Anyhow, the board awards AROTC scholarships out of CC - this process you've been aware of, obviously. IF there are funds available, the funds are alloted to individual schools for various reasons to select a few(ie 1-3, not many)applicants/cadets for school specific scholarship awards. These tend to be 3 year, rather than 4 year awards and cannot be transferred to another school. Hope this gives you some idea of what it is.

 

[The OC Josh]

There are two other reasons freshmen drop out ROTC that haven't been mentioned yet. The first is enlisting. Sometimes, ROTC is just not enough Hoo-ah for them and they want to enlist. ROTC isn't for everyone. Second is DODMERB. We've had freshman a couple people drop out because they just can't get medically cleared for a scholarship.

But I do agree that parental pressure is a big deal for a good amount of cadets.

 

[Pima]

DodMERB is always an issue. The thing is back in the good old days it was easier to get a waiver, that is not the case now.

If you have a DodMERB issue it is important to be proactive. You can't just say well, they played sports and were clear or never had a "medical" issue.

Waiver is a waiver. It means they can choose to say yea or nay one by one. Just because last yr it was given, doesn't mean this yr it will be.

People never see the military like a business, this is wrong. The military has a fiscal budget, they live within their constraints.

I am going to show my age, but let's use a Fortune 500 company as an example. Microsoft in the late 90's was known to use permanent temps. Not everyone was offered the bennies of permanent Microsoft employee. That is ROTC. You enter as a permanent temp, and it is up to them, using their system to decide who gets to be in the Microsoft world. It was a supply and demand...had too many demanding to be permanent to fill their need(supply), they got to pick and choose who got that option.

That is where we are with today's military re: scholarships.

 

[mariner116]

March 8. There will be a new thread started soon devoted to that experience. The budget problems in Congress will be much more stressful, I expect.

I don't see how they can do a new board on March 8th. They have to wait until March 31 to get the "January" offers back so they know how many spots each school has open.

March 8th may have been the original date (before the January board was delayed almost 2 months), but the Janury board delays will certainly ripple downstream. It seems much more likely the next Board will meet in early April.

 

[Ohio2015Parent]

I don't see how they can do a new board on March 8th. They have to wait until March 31 to get the "January" offers back so they know how many spots each school has open.

March 8th may have been the original date (before the January board was delayed almost 2 months), but the Janury board delays will certainly ripple downstream. It seems much more likely the next Board will meet in early April.

Agree and disagree. The board will meet 3/8. The results will not be posted before 4/15 is my SWAG. Here's how I'm thinking... Previous years had a lot of overlap(one reason given for having only 3 this year was to avoid overlap)and the boards met, but the results waited until the previous scholarship winners gave their final answers(30 days from their letter date). January was not supposed to take 2 months, it has thrown off their best intentions, so I'm thinking they know CC needs 2 weeks from 3/31 to process the March offers - since January offers typically only gave one/two choices(anyone get more than that?) the answers are pretty predictable compared to other boards where 4,5,6,even 7 choices were allowed. So, CC can possibly move faster than 2 weeks, but we have the budget issues and potential 3/18 government shut down in the works....SWAGing is fun, it kills time fills up a lot of post/views on a thread but please know, this is just my honest opinion/SWAG --

 

[Jcleppe]

I don't see how they can do a new board on March 8th. They have to wait until March 31 to get the "January" offers back so they know how many spots each school has open.

March 8th may have been the original date (before the January board was delayed almost 2 months), but the Janury board delays will certainly ripple downstream. It seems much more likely the next Board will meet in early April.

The next board is March 8th, no word has been given to the contrary.

 

[Jcleppe]

NewCollegeParent, your son received an Army ROTC letter stating that the scholarship was only good if he remained an engineering major? That's surprising to me. I thought that Army did not require a particular major like Navy and Air Force...

You are correct, the Army does not require a specific major. What NewCollegeParent was referring to is that if you list your major as engineering you are required to select approved engineering schools. Once you start school you can request to change your major, as long as you can still graduate in prescribed amount of time for the new major and it is on the Army's approved list you have a good chance to have it switched.

My son started school as a Civil Engineering major, after his first year he switched to History/Pre Law. At the time the only requirement was that he still graduate in 4 years. That was 2 years ago, things can always change.

 

[Ohio2015Parent]

You are correct, the Army does not require a specific major. What NewCollegeParent was referring to is that if you list your major as engineering you are required to select approved engineering schools. Once you start school you can request to change your major, as long as you can still graduate in prescribed amount of time for the new major and it is on the Army's approved list you have a good chance to have it switched.

My son started school as a Civil Engineering major, after his first year he switched to History/Pre Law. At the time the only requirement was that he still graduate in 4 years. That was 2 years ago, things can always change.

The ROO I mentioned earlier has responded in line with Jcleppe. This ROO has received no information on any changes made with these offers. As Jcleppe mentioned, an engineering major always has had to select an engineering approved school - and always had to get permission from PMS for any major changes and file a plan showing graduation on time. So, as of now, it appears the Army is still not restricting majors. Good news for all, but do make sure to read any and all small print on any offer your kiddos receive, housing contracts etc...because you are responsible for understanding your side of the obligations.

 

[Jcleppe]

Ohio2015Parent,

I just had a terrible thought, since it does not look like the "Views" counter goes past 99,999, I hope it does not just revert back to 0 and start over. This poor thread could get lost at the bottom of the list forever. Maybe you should ask the Moderator to close the thread before it passes that number.

 

[patentesq]

Ohio2015Parent,

I just had a terrible thought, since it does not look like the "Views" counter goes past 99,999, I hope it does not just revert back to 0 and start over. This poor thread could get lost at the bottom of the list forever. Maybe you should ask the Moderator to close the thread before it passes that number.

Or maybe, Ohio, you can ask if they can add another digit. This likely won't be the last thread to enter outer-orbit.

And don't forget to ask them for the free SAF coffee mug!

 

[leapyear]

Thanks for the "engineering" clarification. That makes sense.