Venting a little...

We were disappointed with the whole scholarship night for my son. Although he will be attending The University of North Georgia, The Ohio State University was notified by Cadet Command that they should come present my son's scholarship, because they are the closest battalion to our high school. I also notified them. Not only did they not show, they didn't respond to my email.
DS only earned one local scholarship, just as I feared when he had to list the ROTC Scholarship on the local scholarship applications. My older son earned 4 of those local scholarships, and didn't have half the resume that this son did. He didn't get any from the local military organizations, and none of the leadership awards, although he is an Eagle Scout, NHS Vice President, team captain and ROTC Scholarship Winner. I am not suggesting that those that earned the scholarships are less deserving than my son. I just truly believe that because he already had a big scholarship, he was not even considered, despite an amazing resume.
I will say that we have not had any of the comments that others have mentioned on here over the years, such as "I thought your son was smarter than that," not knowing what ROTC or Service Academies really are. DS has had nothing but support, but I realize that a lot of it is just not really understanding.
 
wisbang35 said:
We were disappointed with the whole scholarship night for my son. Although he will be attending The University of North Georgia, The Ohio State University was notified by Cadet Command that they should come present my son's scholarship, because they are the closest battalion to our high school. I also notified them. Not only did they not show, they didn't respond to my email.
DS only earned one local scholarship, just as I feared when he had to list the ROTC Scholarship on the local scholarship applications. My older son earned 4 of those local scholarships, and didn't have half the resume that this son did. He didn't get any from the local military organizations, and none of the leadership awards, although he is an Eagle Scout, NHS Vice President, team captain and ROTC Scholarship Winner. I am not suggesting that those that earned the scholarships are less deserving than my son. I just truly believe that because he already had a big scholarship, he was not even considered, despite an amazing resume.
I will say that we have not had any of the comments that others have mentioned on here over the years, such as "I thought your son was smarter than that," not knowing what ROTC or Service Academies really are. DS has had nothing but support, but I realize that a lot of it is just not really understanding.
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That is a shame. Your son earned that recognition, as well as the local scholarships.

My son was awarded three small local scholarships, and then one of the foundations called him a week later to apologize because the scholarship it awarded to my son (for $500) was restricted for use with in state schools only. We were bummed because it all helps.

I completely agree that those who decided who gets the local scholarships believe that it is unnecessary to award the ROTC and SA kids $, because they already have "full rides". I am certain that my son would have been awarded much more otherwise. A few people mentioned this to me, including a close friend of mine who I work with and who serves on the school board. I explained that my son has other expenses which he must pay, and scholarships can be applied. He laughed. My daughter, who's résumé is good but not as good as my sons, earned four times what my son did in local scholarships. Just the way it goes.

For those who are ROTC, don't forget that the colleges have separate scholarships, and departmental scholarships, that are awarded even before freshman year. My son was awarded separate scholarships from the school he would have attended had he not accepted his WP appointment. In addition to reoccurring scholarships for room and board ($3500), he received another merit award for $3000, an alumni scholarship for $1500, and then out of the blue got a $20,000 scholarship from the engineering department.

It actually kind of hurts having to turn down his 4-year ROTC scholarship, and the others by accepting the WP appointment. It was to my alma mater too. Wish he could give it to my daughter. Lol. She was awarded her own, but not nearly as good as the ROTC scholarship.

You just have to appreciate what they do receive, and mostly appreciate they they are such good and worthy kids that they are capable of putting themselves in this position. We are all blessed for sure.
 
Unlike most scholarships, a military scholarship (SA or ROTC) makes you beholden to the presenter. Some people might have second thoughts about military service and reject the scholarship.

It's nice to have other scholarships waiting for a plan B, C, etc.

I'm sure those parents can understand that concept, assuming their children won't be serving.
 
Had similar comments concerning our DS who won all three service ROTC scholarships this year. Even more annoying than the jealous comments are those that think they hand them out like candy to whoever they can get to sign up. You have to just let it roll. I have found there are some in our society that it just isnt worth expending any energy trying to explain.
 
I wish I had the strength to ignore. My wife does too. LOL. I tend too look at it as community service obligation to "educate". ....And sometimes I educate the heck out of them.
 
....Actually, I do think there are a lot of folks who simply don't understand, and frankly I do look forward to the opportunity to explain how the distinctions between enlisted and officers in the military, and the different commissioning sources. I enjoy talking about it, and I admit that it gives me a chance to brag up my son a bit too. Unless people have a military background they don't usually understand how it works, or how impressive it is to earn the ROTC scholarship, SA appointment, or become an officer.
 
This is not unique to ROTC or the academies. We have two other children that both have "earned" athletic and academic scholarships. One essentially has a full ride the other has a great deal but not a full ride. After our oldest found out about the 3 year AD ROTC scholarship and we excitedly shared with friends and family, we found that most people were appropriately excited for the girls, and were complimentary on how they each end have worked hard for what they have earned. However we also encountered the other type of comments suggesting that it is somehow unfair that three out of three of our children have their education essentially paid for, as if we somehow "cheated" the system. I just took the high road and did my best to pretend they were complimenting them. There is a lack of understanding for sure on what all them have done to get here and what they are committing to do, in college for the athletes, and during college and beyond for ROTC. I try to remember that everyone is stressed about paying for college and all some people can see is "wouldn't that be nice" instead of "good for them."
 
I know this will come out the wrong way, so I will apologize in advance for hurting feelings which is not my intention. Once I heard LA Dodgers Manager Tommy LaSorda say something in response to a question about dealing with public pressure. I stressed it with both DS's from a very young age. 80% of the people really don't care about you or what you're doing. About 5% really care and are supportive. The rest are either consumed by hatred, envy, or have so little going on in their lives that they look for someone else's business to butt into.

College tuition is ridiculously high and virtually no one, other that the very wealthy, pays full freight. It is impossible to differentiate between a competitive scholarship and a portion of the $ that are allocated to various departments to dole out and make parents proud of their DS's and DD's "accomplishments". "Scholarships" are a dime a dozen. An SA appointment is not. An xROTC scholarship is not, but neither amount to much compared actually completing the program and commissioning. Thank goodness there was no individual recognition for scholarships at my DS' awards ceremonies. It was about celebrating their high school experience. If anyone cared about their scholarships, it was available in the program and the parents/students had unlimited space to brag.

My opinion, seconded by DS's was, "it's nobody's business". He was too busy thinking about his future to care about a high school awards ceremony. Quite frankly, I got sick of explaining the AROTC scholarship because everyone thinks it's pile of free $. The fact that folks needed it explained, illustrates the disconnect between the military and American society. I'm even more tired of the sad sack look I see when I tell folks that DS is in the Middle East at his first duty station. I have to explain that he is not in Combat Arms. I have to explain what is the Signal Corps. He is not a Marine. He is not an enlisted Infantryman. He understands that he needs to be thanking others for their service before receiving any thanks for his.

In a society like ours which craves recognition, I would advise everyone to get over it and move on. Your DS's and DD'S have no clue what awaits them.
 
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CB7893, I could not agree with your son's "its nobody's business" comment more. My brother and I both blew off our respective schools awards night for this very reason. Scholarships are earned not won. As others have pointed out, a lot of people are ignorant (definition is "not knowing") of the "commitments" that come along with SA or ROTC scholarships. Most of us here on these forums know so I wont bore you with a regurgitation of them lol. As far as "double dipping", as my parents say, we pay our taxes (more than they would like paying taxes that is, but everyone feels this way..lol) so take advantage of it. If there are excess monies available, start some type of retirement program for DS/DD or use monies to fund the trip to see your respective DS/DD during the school year.

" the disconnect between the military and American society" is SO bad now, people take everything for granted. They forget that all of these "freedoms" that they enjoy are not FREE but still being paid for with blood, guts and tears of our current military and their families. So yes, IMO, vent away!!
 
It seems to me that there are many people out there that do not really know about ROTC. When I talk to some people about it, they immediately think, "JROTC." It takes time to explain that ROTC is in fact a college level training program for Officers that is very large and intensive. But even then they have some misgivings like, "Why didn't you go to West Point? That is far superior." I even had one of my family members who served in the Army for 20 years tell me that, "Any officer who is anybody goes to West point," when he saw my certificate for ROTC. He then assured me that I would have to attend sooner or later to be successful.

I guess people have had it etched in their brain that West Point is THE source for regular Army commissions. They don't know that ROTC graduates commissioning into active duty receive regular Army commissions just like West point grads. They also don't understand that ROTC programs can be, and are, just as good as the Academies on most, if not all, levels.

I'll never forget talking to a recruiter from West Point during Academy Day in my state. When I asked him how superior West Point was to ROTC and the advantages that it would give to new officers over ROTC, he just looked at me and said both ROTC and West Point are very prestigious, and equally good "courses." He then went on to tell me that in truth, it doesn't matter if a successful Cadet goes through West Point or ROTC, and that both get the same oppurtunities (the only difference being West Pointers are guaranteed their job of choice.) Of course, he then went on to tell me how superior West Point was in terms of education, and that it would give me a huge advantage after the military when looking for civilian jobs.
 
CSU Cadet said:
It seems to me that there are many people out there that do not really know about ROTC. When I talk to some people about it, they immediately think, "JROTC." It takes time to explain that ROTC is in fact a college level training program for Officers that is very large and intensive. But even then they have some misgivings like, "Why didn't you go to West Point? That is far superior." I even had one of my family members who served in the Army for 20 years tell me that, "Any officer who is anybody goes to West point," when he saw my certificate for ROTC. He then assured me that I would have to attend sooner or later to be successful.

I guess people have had it etched in their brain that West Point is THE source for regular Army commissions. They don't know that ROTC graduates commissioning into active duty receive regular Army commissions just like West point grads. They also don't understand that ROTC programs can be, and are, just as good as the Academies on most, if not all, levels.

I'll never forget talking to a recruiter from West Point during Academy Day in my state. When I asked him how superior West Point was to ROTC and the advantages that it would give to new officers over ROTC, he just looked at me and said both ROTC and West Point are very prestigious, and equally good "courses." He then went on to tell me that in truth, it doesn't matter if a successful Cadet goes through West Point or ROTC, and that both get the same oppurtunities (the only difference being West Pointers are guaranteed their job of choice.) Of course, he then went on to tell me how superior West Point was in terms of education, and that it would give me a huge advantage after the military when looking for civilian jobs.
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My daughter has gotten some weird reactions, she has friends enlisting, and we have friends that have served as enlisted tell her she will never be respected as an officer going through ROTC. My best friend's mother-in-law is a retired Colonel and served 30 years. My daughter had the opportunity to talk to her over the phone (we live on opposite coasts), and after having that conversation with her and her experience of going through ROTC in the 1970's, and having such a long and successful career, even graduating from the Army War college during her career, my daughter is totally over all the negative comments and she just smiles and nods with no need to correct people anymore. Some people truly don't get it, which is okay, or they have different experiences, and maybe we are the ones that don't get it, I have no idea and it simply doesn't matter. The important thing is that you get what you are doing and why, and my daughter gets it, and having this program is such a great opportunity for each of you to follow your dream career path at a civilian school. It is nice to have a place to talk about the experience and excitement without having to explain what "it" is!

And just a side note, I have mentioned my other two daughters will play college soccer next year, and they get all sorts of opinions about their school choice, conference choice, and in some people's mind, they made bad choices, in other's they made good choices. And they get a lot of opinions from people who have never played college sports, so the smile and nod approach works in that case too! Again, it only matters if the choice is a good choice specifically for them.
 
Dckc88 said:
My daughter has gotten some weird reactions, she has friends enlisting, and we have friends that have served as enlisted tell her she will never be respected as an officer going through ROTC. My best friend's mother-in-law is a retired Colonel and served 30 years. My daughter had the opportunity to talk to her over the phone (we live on opposite coasts), and after having that conversation with her and her experience of going through ROTC in the 1970's, and having such a long and successful career, even graduating from the Army War college during her career, my daughter is totally over all the negative comments and she just smiles and nods with no need to correct people anymore. Some people truly don't get it, which is okay, or they have different experiences, and maybe we are the ones that don't get it, I have no idea and it simply doesn't matter. The important thing is that you get what you are doing and why, and my daughter gets it, and having this program is such a great opportunity for each of you to follow your dream career path at a civilian school. It is nice to have a place to talk about the experience and excitement without having to explain what "it" is!
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Yeah, thanks for the saying that. I still get excited thinking about what college and ROTC have in store for me. It is weird that some enlisted have told her she wouldn't be respected. I go to Future Soldier Training, and the Sergeants that I talk to there have all told me that they prefer 2nd lieutenants (butter bars) from ROTC. Surfing the web, I have also seen the same conclusion from many other enlisted.

In the end I have always been told that it is the cadet who makes their military career, not the school.
 
CSU Cadet said:
the only difference being West Pointers are guaranteed their job of choice.
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West Point cadets are not guaranteed their branch of choice, they have an OML within West Point similar to ROTC and make out a similar wish list. The main difference is that WP cadets are guaranteed Active Duty and there is a higher fixed percentage for Combat Arms branches (I know that is not the correct term anymore but it get's the point across).
 
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Jcleppe said:
West Point cadets are not guaranteed their branch of choice, they have an OML within West Point similar to ROTC and make out a similar wish list. The main difference is that WP cadets are guaranteed Active Duty and there is a higher fixed percentage for Combat Arms branches (I know that is not the correct term anymore but it get's the point across.
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Yeah, I confused it a bit. Thanks for making it clear.
 
cb7893 said:
virtually no one, other that the very wealthy, pays full freight.
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We are middle class, not the very wealthy, but we make more then the cutoff for any FASFA or Grant money. Kids were good high school students and could have received maybe some small dollar figure scholarships, but nothing that would make much of a dent in our State college tuition. Now I agree that most private high priced schools offer scholarship more often to bring the cost of tuition down. For state school students with average grades from a middle class family, they often pay the full rack rate tuition.

cb7893 said:
I'm even more tired of the sad sack look I see when I tell folks that DS is in the Middle East at his first duty station. I have to explain that he is not in Combat Arms. I have to explain what is the Signal Corps. He is not a Marine. He is not an enlisted Infantryman. He understands that he needs to be thanking others for their service before receiving any thanks for his.
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I liked your post, it was right on target regarding how to deal with folks regarding the military and scholarships. I did just want to comment on the above quote. I understand what your saying although I think that placing different branches within the Army as more deserving than others might be a bit off. My nephew was a Quartermaster Officer, deployed twice to Iraq over 10 years ago, he now has one artificial leg thanks to an IED. IEDs, Suicide Bombers, and Mortar attacks don't distinguish between branches. Granted that an enlisted infantryman, Armor, Aviator, and others are higher risk as well as an infantry Marine, but that does not lessen the risk for every Soldier, Marine, Airman, Sailor, and Coast Guardsmen (Yes they are there as well) that are deployed in harms way. As recent events have shown, the risks are not exclusive to being deployed.

Please don't take this the wrong way, just wanted to add another perspective, I did enjoy reading your post and respect your views.
 
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My mom's technique for boorish, rude, impertinent or snide comments:

Huge, sincere, warm smile. "You are SO kind to comment. Thank you. Can you believe the great turnout/great weather/awful rain/other complete topic change." (with relentless smile and implacable resistance to returning to the original topic)

My other favorite, watching her in action, though not as useful for this situation was, presented with a bit of gossip: "I am SO glad you hate gossip as much as I do. We will have to make sure no one else spreads this any further. That's the kindest thing we can do, since we don't know the real truth."
 
Capt MJ said:
My mom's technique for boorish, rude, impertinent or snide comments:

Huge, sincere, warm smile. "You are SO kind to comment. Thank you. Can you believe the great turnout/great weather/awful rain/other complete topic change." (with relentless smile and implacable resistance to returning to the original topic)

My other favorite, watching her in action, though not as useful for this situation was, presented with a bit of gossip: "I am SO glad you hate gossip as much as I do. We will have to make sure no one else spreads this any further. That's the kindest thing we can do, since we don't know the real truth."
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The classic Southern lady's take down just popped to mind - "Why bless your heart!" - lol! Your mom sounds awesome!
 
Dadof2 said:
Perhaps this isn't the correct forum for this, but I'd like to vent a little.

A couple of nights ago we had awards night for our DS's graduating class. DS was presented with the big check for his NROTC Marine Option scholarship at the beginning of the ceremony - the only ROTC scholarship this year at his school. Later, students were recognized one by one in alphabetical order for all other awards. When it came to his turn, DS was recognized for NHS, several academic, leadership and athletic awards, several small local scholarships and his ROTC scholarship. Very proud moment for his parents.

The next day someone approached DW and asked, "can I ask you why (DS) received the other scholarships if he has full ROTC scholarship?" DW, who is more civilized than I am, calmly replied that ROTC doesn't cover room and board and he will have other expenses for books and supplies. The person went on to ask "doesn't he get a stipend for that stuff?". The whole tone of the questions was "why is your son taking away scholarships from other kids if he already has a "free" ride? This person also knows that our DD is at USNA on her "free" ride. I found the line of questioning to be pretty bold, rude and insulting and probably wouldn't have handled it as well as DW did. We've heard other less rude, but similar comments from well meaning people who either don't understand or fully appreciate what these kids have signed up for. Is it nice, and do we appreciate, that our kids will have minimal college debt? Absolutely. But this "free" ride isn't free for them. This is what they want to do, and no one is forcing them to choose the path they have chosen, but it would be nice to hear more congratulations for what they have achieved and appreciation for their service commitment and less of the rude and insensitive comments.

OK, I'm done now...
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Like the old saying, you can laugh all the way to the bank!
 
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