West Point Cheating Scandal

dddad said:
I think it is appropriate for members to post their views on how cheating should be handled. In the end, none of what we say matters. But, a public discussion on how this incident, which has been reported on most of the major networks and in more than one national publication, impacts WP, Cadets, Army, and public trust is certainly a proper topic for a SA forum.

I agree with this 100%. Allegations on this anonymous forum about particular individuals having cheated seem highly improper - so much so that those posts may best be deleted.

Unfortunately, a "scandal" involving widespread Honor Code violations at WP is of public interest. All WP "families,” perhaps all SA families are negatively impacted by this situation (to some extent) even if no one they know is directly “involved.”

Once so many Cadets admittedly cheated, a public scandal was sure to follow. Everyone is entitled to their views about punishment. I do not like the idea of rehabilitation for cheating (at WP).

The discussion about D1 sports and whether this is an issue in which predominantly D1 athletes were involved is important if that is the case. If WP leadership adjusted policy to protect D1 athletes, that is of public interest. If not, it is incumbent on WP leadership to clear up that issue. Saying that because we don’t know the discussion is improper seems wrong for many reasons, not the least of which is that it is not the way public institutions should handle “crisis management.
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Just to clarify. I did not say “we” should avoid but “I” have avoided. It’s a valid discussion, just a rabbit hole I would rather not to go down. I don’t think anyone would be swayed either way.
Second, I don’t know of anything that has been publicly released on demographics of the cheating scandal. So again, such discussions about a particular team are based upon Cadet rumors. If it comes out that this is true it’s fair game. I just find it unseemly to pass on rumors on social media.
Finally, as far as I know the procedures were not altered. It’s the same ones that have been there for some time. It’s a valid debate to have on the subject, but for some time the “one strike and your out” policy has been modified. There were issues with it in the past and it wasn’t always perceived to be fair or impartial, such as the expulsion of Anthony Ketron in the 1980’s for “quibbling” about his Rhodes scholarship application. Or Cadets who stepped forward and admitted sometimes minor violations such as forgetting to cite a source on a paper yet were treated the same as someone who lied about cheating. Again, I’m not going to step into the argument for or against these changes. Just that they are there.
I will point out that the system is run by Cadets. The Supe can overturn their recommendation, but that initial board and recommendation is made by fellow Cadets.
And just a final emphasis. All of this happened some time ago. I’m not sure why it is only now hitting the news. Perhaps Cadets going hone and discussing this? Nothing wrong with that, just pointing out that this didn’t happen just prior to the Air Force game.
 
It reflects badly on all rhe cadets.
A slap on the wrist isn't going to help west point's image.
 
Cookiemom said:
It reflects badly on all rhe cadets.
A slap on the wrist isn't going to help west point's image.
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Justice should be blind. It should not change based on how much media play the offense gets. To the best of my knowledge, the Cadets involved are getting the same justice as anyone else involved in such an incident and each case is being judged on its own merits and particulars.
Now what that punishment should be is an argument I'm not touching right now.
 
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Does he mean that punishing the athletes that cheated by taking away games is inequitable because there are non-athletes that cheated that don’t have games taken away?
 
@A1Janitor I messed up your quote. Here it is. Does he mean that punishing the athletes that cheated by taking away games is inequitable because there are non-athletes that cheated that don’t have games taken away?
I think it runs deeper than that. These equity policies are today's social justice maneuvers designed to level the playing field for disadvantaged people. It is fully in play in the school district in which I teach. I have no problem with equity, as the majority of my students benefit from it. My students though will never be admitted to an elite college.
 
I'm also disappointed in Lieutenant General Williams. I often times here mention the general is a graduate of the high school where my two kids graduated and where I taught and coached football and baseball. He was a football star there and won a state title in basketball.

He says he owns the cheating scandal but is only making it worse.
 
I heard about the letter sent out to Cadets but have not yet read it. Just to clarify. Cadets are NOT suspended from representing the academy once accused of an honor violation but upon final adjudication. The process does take time and won’t be completed until January, probably due to the number of Cadets involved. We shall see if sports did indeed have an impact on this timing. If so I’m sure there will be “fallout”. But after some of the initial news reports I’ve seen over the last few years that have caused controversies and then been “walked back” I try to hold off on judgement until all the facts come out.
 
UHBlackhawk said:
I heard about the letter sent out to Cadets but have not yet read it. Just to clarify. Cadets are NOT suspended from representing the academy once accused of an honor violation but upon final adjudication. The process does take time and won’t be completed until January, probably due to the number of Cadets involved. We shall see if sports did indeed have an impact on this timing. If so I’m sure there will be “fallout”. But after some of the initial news reports I’ve seen over the last few years that have caused controversies and then been “walked back” I try to hold off on judgement until all the facts come out.
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I thought (at least) one of the football players admitted to cheating and was still allowed to play. Do they wait for all cases to be adjudicated?
 
Per this article, looks like 72 of 73 were 1st year cadets and 58 admitted to cheating.
bleacherreport.com

24 Army Football Players Involved in West Point Academic Cheating Scandal

Twenty-four members of the Army football team were involved in an academic cheating scandal at West Point. Per USA Today 's Tom Vanden Brook , a total of 73 cadets were accused of cheating on a calculus exam in May...
bleacherreport.com bleacherreport.com
Wow!
 
They came to West Point signing an oath to the honor code. The superintendent said that he “owns” this incident. He does not. The cadets broke the honor code and that is entirely on them. The saddest part is that they took the spots of other candidates that would’ve help up their honor
 
A1Janitor said:
I thought (at least) one of the football players admitted to cheating and was still allowed to play. Do they wait for all cases to be adjudicated?
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Good question about this case with so many involved. I could see how they might feel that would be unfair to start the punishment for those who admitted wrongdoing but delay it for those who didn’t while it went through “the process”. Or perhaps some worked through the system before others. Again, do you start the punishments right away as they finish or wait until all cases have been adjudicated? Instead start all the punishments together. Not sure I would agree with that, but I can see how that might have been the issue. I really doubt this was just a “football is king” issue, though I could be wrong.
But I’m speculating. Don’t know the facts.
 
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I write 12-20ish recommendation letters for college admissions and scholarships every year. None are for the academies as my students are mostly English Learners, recent immigrants, and kids from the wrong side of the highway. Plus, I’m not a core subjects teacher. Every student though who I agree to write a letter for must meet all the criteria I write about. The most important one is character.

Assuming this large number of WP cheaters also had a teacher write about their impeccable character not too many months ago, I can only conclude they weren’t academically qualified to engage in a rigorous curriculum.

Lack of character? Lack of academic qualifications? Or maybe just plain lazy.
 
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