Discussion in 'Naval Academy - USNA' started by Maximus, Jul 14, 2008.
Is there a list to see where your state falls in the list?
Is Florida very competitive?
I doubt there is a list, but if there was Florida would be on the top. Florida has many bases and each branch has a high profile there. The Navy has Pensacola. The AF has MacDill and Eglin (test fighter base similiar to Edwards) The AF also trains at Pensacola. The Army has Hurlburt (ASOG) and Tampa. That means a lot of dependents. The amount of military children that become military officers is @25%. Most of them will apply for an SA.
Florida, Texas, California, NY, CO and VA are known to be highly competitive --- lots of bases. The big clue to see how competitive your area is, is to look at the nom. source guidelines, if it says something akin to if you have 1 nom source we will not nom you. The reason is to try to spread the wealth. Some MOC's also coordinate their list, it is also possible that 1 will give you a nom to AFA, 1 will give a nom to USMA and 1 will give you a nom to USNA, (only happens if you are applying to them...won't happen if you are not applying to any other SA's) It is very important that you rank your choices, and it is not held against you if you are only applying to the USNA. DS applied to AFA only and got the nom.
GENERALLY speaking, it's most likely California. Lots of people, and lots of military bases to up the interest.
That said, every year is a little different, so it may vary between California, New York, Florida, Texas, and Virginia.
Also remember what really matters is that you get 1 nom. Don't worry when you hear somebody got 3 or 4, you just need the 1. I think I read somewhere that VA had more cadets than the number they could have from their MOC...the reason that occurred is b/c the SA can also appt cadets in from Presidential, Supt. VP nom, JROTC...if they want you they will find a way.
Remember to apply for every nom source you can, including the VP...I don't recall hearing anyone being denied a VP nom. Only 1 goes out to ea SA, again if they want you then they will find a nom. The VP doesn't give that nom out the SA does. The more noms you do have the more flexability the SA has to give you an appt.
Also realize appts go out by point score. The highest score wins. Make your packet the strongest it can be. Make sure you have leadership and sports. Practice your CFA until you are within max points. i.e. 18 pull-ups, @75 push ups, 85 sit ups, the run in the 5-6 range, the bb throw @100 are the max pts. 1 pull-up, 40 push-ups, 50 sit-ups, 8 min run, and 60 bb will kill you for CFA scoring. You get 1 shot to officially submit, however you can take as many practices as you need
One more question, is there such a thing as a Nomination that is more qualified or better to have? I ask this because we're applying to all sources, both Senators, VP and the Congressman but my sons Senior Naval Science Instructor has also stated that he's nominating my son also. Do they count as much as a Senator?
Unless I am grotesquely wrong (I have been in the past on other subjects, but I don't think I am on this one), the answer is NO.
Nominations are digital: you either have one or you don't. Where it comes from is largely irrelevant once you have it.
MIGHT the fact that you have more than one nomination be a deciding factor versus smeone with only one? Maybe, but I suspect that for such a case to present itself, nearly every single other parameter would have to be equal between the two candidates. That scenario is just too rare to really make the number or source of the nomination(s) to be that big of a deal.
There are avenues to an appointment where a nomination (at least in the traditional sense) is not required, but those are so few, far between, rare, and difficult to qualify for that they are almost not worth explaining. Heck, I only know of rumours of them, although I do know they exist.
I take it your son is JROTC, thus it is another nom...this is how kids can end up with 5 noms...3 for MOC, 1 pres. 1 ROTC. However, to win the appt. you must still be the top of the list in the WCS. I do believe I recall Florida tries to spread the wealth, so for your DS the JROTC nom is a bonus. It doesn't mean that if he gets all 5 he is in it just allows the SA to get him through a different appt. Remember ROTC noms compete against ea other, just like Presidential, it is the entire pool and they can only nom so many by law. Just make the packet the strongest he can. Have every square filled that is possible, such as Eagle Scout, NHS, Student Council, Sports, a job, volunteer work, great GPA and SAT scores, max CFA points, with a glowing rec from his BGO. That should make him the guy with the highest WCS.
I have never heard someone say they got in b/c of the source...they get in b/c they have the highest WCS for that list.
It seems like it is confusing, but in the end it is just a mathematical equation...get used to it, when your son goes up for an O-4 board, everyone is scored numerically, they figure out the number available to promote and draw the line there! Above the number your promoted below, you're not.
Re: Most competitive states for nominations
I feel for you, Maximus. While my son was sweating it out, I was secretly
computing all sorts of odds (mostly based on inaccurate rumors and faulty
assumptions), preparing for his heartbreak.
One thing I've concluded since: Your congressional district seems to matter
as much as (more than?) your state. At the risk of inviting anti-San Francisco
chatter, I suspect nom's are more accessible in my part of CA than, say,
San Diego or other areas w/ a large military presence. My son got a nom
out of high school when USNA selected him for NAPS -- if there'd been a
long list of stellar direct-admit candidates ahead of him, wouldn't they have
used up his MOC's nom's?
All anyone can do is give this his/her best shot. All my USNA math came
up w/ a "no" (though it did keep me out of son's hair and off the streets).
Navy saw it differently. Son excelled @ NAPS, and after plebe year, his
OOM puts him in the top 15% of the class. And his own mother couldn't
imagine how he'd get in.
Some of this seems to be known only to USNA and/or written in the stars.
Yes, NJROTC member and we are trying our best to present the best packet possible.
Maximus, is the NJROTC unit your son's in a Distinguished Unit with Academic Honors? It needs to be one of those units in order to get one of these nominations.
how competitive are Georgia nominations?
Impossible to answer as asked.
Please remember that the competition during the entire application process (both for nominations as well as for appointments) is wildly variable from year to year, and simply cannot be predicted other than to say that it will be extremely competitive, no matter what.
Each year, the pool of candidates (including the number, their composition, their level of academic achievements, their physical fitness, their ECA's, and everything else) and the number of available nominations to each Academy from each source (An MOC can only have X number of Mids at USNA, for example. Depending on how many graduated this year, he may have more or fewer slots to offer), can and DO change. Throw in the extra Kentucky Windage that allows a MOC to either rank his nominees or else just throw a list at USxA to choose for themselves, and you will see that answering your question is the same as answering the famous "What are my chances?" question: It will depend in large part on factors that are totally beyond your ability to control or even guess at.
Your best bet in determining how competitive your particular state/district/sources are is to actually apply and see what happens. Same with your chances for an appointment. While one will definitely be able to argue that, for example, New York is more competitive than Georgia, the fact is that if you are in Georgia it makes little difference how competitive New York is because once the nominations are awarded, all the nominees get poured into a common bucket and the appointment process begins.
It may be the case that USxA will choose one candidate over another because the former is from a state that is under-represented at the Academy. I doubt that happens to any significant extent, but even if it does, again, it's completely out of your control.
The only thing you should worry about right now is putting together the very best package you can, and doing the best job you can selling it, first to your nominating sources, and then (hopefully) to your desired Academy. That's ALL you can do. So concentrate on THAT and the rest will follow.
If you get in, GREAT!! If not, then there's always next year. I knew a guy who was a junior at Purdue when he finally (after 3 previous tries) got an appointment to USNA. Now THAT is what I call being DETERMINED!
Sorry I missed this somehow yesterday NCal...but...ain't it the truth....talk about sweating it out and my son takes it all in without a care lol
We (our family) do have occasional discussions for the back up plans and he's actually happy with them and said he'll just apply the next year.
No, the NJROTC unit he attends is not a distinguished unit this year but, it has been in the past. Last year the SNSI nominated a gal and she's a plebe this summer with class of 2012. and the Unit was definitely not a Distinguished unit. We were made a Battalion this year and
I think what you are talking about is for the D.U.'s host schools Principal:
"Senior Naval Science Instructor is authorized to nominate a maximum of three eligible cadets each year to compete for U.S. Naval Academy appointments.
Administrators of host schools that are designated as Distinguished Units with Academic Honors may nominate three eligible NJROTC cadets as candidates for appointment to the U.S. Naval Academy, U.S. Military Academy, and U.S. Air Force Academy in addition to the three nominations above to the U.S. Naval Academy.
Ah ok I see then. I'll just be shoving off now..
Whether or not a state or district is "competitive" depends on the number of applications received. A state being competitive is important with Senator noms; a district with Rep noms. Also, a state may be competitive but an individual district within a state may not be; conversely, certain districts are competitive when the state as a whole may not be.
Competitive states include: PA, MD, VA, CA, FL, and TX. There may be others. Competitive districts vary but include those in the Washington DC area and around Annapolis, as well as districts that contain large military bases. But the above is only a generalization. I've heard of the odd competitive district in states like Indiana or Illinois. And, things can vary by year.
It should also be noted that highly competitive states and districts tend to send very large numbers of students to USNA. Thus, living in a competitive district or state is not as terrible as some think it is. Also, for 99% of the population, there is nothing you can do about where you live, so fretting about your situation gets you nowhere.
As for whether one nom is better than another . . . yes and no. Presidential noms are non-competitive. If you are eligible for one, you get one. For many people a Pres nom is enough to get an appointment. But USNA wants to see you apply for MOC (and VP) noms. They are competitive. And, as a GENERAL rule (i.e., not always true), having multiple noms only helps you obtain an appointment. Do NOT rely on a Pres nom w/o applying for the others.
Why the big grin, did I miss something?
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