When To Take First SAT

NJROTC-CC

NJROTC-CC

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DS is a rising junior in a COVID-ravaged southern state. E-learning has left a lot to be desired.

DS has been doing a lot of SAT practice and self prep and even working with a tutor on SAT math to be prepared to give the SAT his best shot. Right now he is registered to take the SAT for the first time this December 5, which be during his Junior year. Is that about right? I figure he will still have time to take it a couple more times before his applications go in. I don’t think he will be fully ready to take the SAT until at least December. Of course, he will be doing practice tests.
 
Take PSAT in October and 2 or 3 SATs after. Get the test schedule and work backwards. SAT earlier than OCT is OK, but be sure to take PSAT for National Merit Scholarships which use this test.
 
Son took his initial tests fall of Junior year to get scores and design plan to improve. He took them again twice in the spring of his junior year and improved each iteration. Locked in his final scores before summer of his senior year, which set the stage for his ROTC and Academy applications.
 
NJROTC-CC said:
DS is a rising junior in a COVID-ravaged southern state. E-learning has left a lot to be desired.

DS has been doing a lot of SAT practice and self prep and even working with a tutor on SAT math to be prepared to give the SAT his best shot. Right now he is registered to take the SAT for the first time this December 5, which be during his Junior year. Is that about right? I figure he will still have time to take it a couple more times before his applications go in. I don’t think he will be fully ready to take the SAT until at least December. Of course, he will be doing practice tests.
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My DD took her first ACT in early Dec of junior year too. She used the scores in her NASS and SLE apps.

Last ACT was in Apr of junior year. Got the score she wanted and was done!
 
NJROTC-CC said:
DS is a rising junior in a COVID-ravaged southern state. E-learning has left a lot to be desired.

DS has been doing a lot of SAT practice and self prep and even working with a tutor on SAT math to be prepared to give the SAT his best shot. Right now he is registered to take the SAT for the first time this December 5, which be during his Junior year. Is that about right? I figure he will still have time to take it a couple more times before his applications go in. I don’t think he will be fully ready to take the SAT until at least December. Of course, he will be doing practice tests.
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yes I think you have a good plan - my DD took SAT and ACT in December of Junior year - had been prepping for ACT only but realized that the SAT was a better fit for her - she switched gears and started prepping for SAT to take in March and June - but those got canceled - she is now signed up to take in August and October but my guess the august will get canceled for sure...covid has made these tests difficult!!!
 
Take them early and often.....or is that voting in Chicago ?

Seriously, with my daughters, I encouraged them to take it three times, with the following thoughts --
1) First one is kind of a throw away -- go in without pressures or expectations, see how you do. If you do well --great ! If not, that sets the baseline and learn from it.
2) Round 2 is the chance to make the big move --you've been through the routine once so you the newness is past, and you can focus on doing your best.
3) Round 3 is optional - if satisfied with Round 2, or their is no significant improvement between Round 1 & 2, it may not be worthwhile. Realistically, the SAT/ACT are intended to measure academic aptitude, not just what you have learned to date ...and someone may not have the ability to keep improving no matter how many courses and practice tests they take. If 1 & 2 are close, and there is no other reason to take it again (ie.. you didn't feel well on # 2) , it may not be worth the time or money to take it again. It's like the old saying ..the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over, and expecting different results.

Finally, I always encourage people to take the ACT's at least once..there are differences in the structure and method of testing, and some people do better on one than the other.

Finally, all of this is kind of moot in the COVID environment ... hopefully things will get better, but right now, you should consider each opportunity to take the SAT/ACT as the only chance you will have. Of course, this adds to the pressure, and I suspect that Colleges are going to have to adapt and admit students who never had the chance to take the SAT/ACT this year ..but it's also probably safe to say that a good strong SAT/ACT score is going to better than no score regardless of the circumstances.
 
My take: Take it as soon as possible and sign up for the next test as well - get a couple under the belt as soon as possible. Go for additionals as needed to get scores where they need to be.
 
Old Navy BGO said:
Realistically, the SAT/ACT are intended to measure academic aptitude, not just what you have learned to date ...and someone may not have the ability to keep improving no matter how many courses and practice tests they take.
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This pretty much sums it up. I've posted several times in the past... Learning HOW to take the SAT is most likely more important to your score than having knowledge of the material on the test. What I mean by that is, you spend your entire life learning math and reading. You pretty much know what you know at a certain age. Learning a few more vocab words may increase your score, but knowing how to take the test as efficiently as possible is the most sure-fired way to increase your score.
 
If you don't score as well as you'd like on the first try -- and the overwhelming majority don't -- it's important to understand what held you back and work on those things. For example, did you finish -- you were able to get to each question and try to answer? If not, it may be a time management issue. I knew someone who was very focused on answering every question correctly. As a result, she didn't get to some of the (easier) questions at the end.

Is there a particular type of question/math problem with which you struggle? Do you get tired midway through (in which case practicing in real test conditions will help). Etc.

Simply retaking the test without more will probably raise your score somewhat. However, if you need to -- and want to -- see a real upward trend, it's about identifying and working on your weak areas.
 
Thanks to all. DS is doing a lot of practice questions and practice tests. He is also working with a math tutor to bone-up on some of the algebra word problems that give him trouble. Part of his problem is that in his school they had him take “Algebra 1” in 9th Grade, Geometry in 10th, and he is scheduled to take “Algebra II” in 11th. I don’t know why the school district does it that way. However some of the Algebra II concepts that he has not had yet, are tested on the SAT. That is why I have him working with a tutor. That is also why I think taking that SAT no earlier than December of his Junior year will be to his advantage.

Other than Math, he is taking 4 more AP classes as Junior, then more as a senior. He may end up with as many as10 AP classes.
 
NJROTC-CC said:
Thanks to all. DS is doing a lot of practice questions and practice tests. He is also working with a math tutor to bone-up on some of the algebra word problems that give him trouble. Part of his problem is that in his school they had him take “Algebra 1” in 9th Grade, Geometry in 10th, and he is scheduled to take “Algebra II” in 11th. I don’t know why the school district does it that way. However some of the Algebra II concepts that he has not had yet, are tested on the SAT. That is why I have him working with a tutor. That is also why I think taking that SAT no earlier than December of his Junior year will be to his advantage.

Other than Math, he is taking 4 more AP classes as Junior, then more as a senior. He may end up with as many as10 AP classes.
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yes the fact he has not had algebra 2 will hold him up a bit - he might do much better on the test in the spring. my DD was taking honors precal during her junior year so she had at least seen all the math - good idea for the tutor to help bridge the gap
 
Lots of older threads on the topic of standardized tests. Some do better on one vs the other (SAT vs ACT) so probably not a bad idea to take them both. Taking these tests too early in your h.s. career is not the best approach if you have only had algebra instead of more of the advanced h.s. math courses, since you wont have the background for some of the questions. No amount of tips/trips/studying/tutoring will magically enable you to get a perfect English or Math score if you are generally a mediocre student in those subjects. Practice tests are good to become familiar with the format of the various sections or to become more comfortable with the process, but no guarantee of getting better scores. You won't always get better scores taking the tests lots of times.
 
Start early, test often worked for my kid; gained 8 points on the ACT. I think brewmiest and I have agreed on this before, most DD's/DS's will gain most (in terms of score) from studying the tests rather than the subjects the tests cover. He should test enough to gain confidence in his "Test Taking Skills/Tools", and his ability to apply them.

Be prepared to lace in escalating tutoring if his progress stalls along the way. You are on the right track with this. We had great results with a kid that needed a boost. I have a sister who taught SAT Prep.for the Princeton Review who swears by the results/score increases the program achieved, (teaches law at UConn now and pushes for LSAT test prep courses when asked).

One qualification to Brew's comment. We did find that these tests can be a great way to target subject matter weaknesses. My own DD took several tests that were scored on-site with immediate tutoring on problem areas discovered by the test. This helped a ton.

I sound like a broken record on this, but this stuff pays off for kids and is IMO a sound investment for them.

Best of luck to your son, he is lucky to have engaged parents.
 
NJROTC-CC said:
Thanks to all. DS is doing a lot of practice questions and practice tests. He is also working with a math tutor to bone-up on some of the algebra word problems that give him trouble. Part of his problem is that in his school they had him take “Algebra 1” in 9th Grade, Geometry in 10th, and he is scheduled to take “Algebra II” in 11th. I don’t know why the school district does it that way. However some of the Algebra II concepts that he has not had yet, are tested on the SAT. That is why I have him working with a tutor. That is also why I think taking that SAT no earlier than December of his Junior year will be to his advantage.

Other than Math, he is taking 4 more AP classes as Junior, then more as a senior. He may end up with as many as10 AP classes.
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That course continuum of Alg I, Geometry and then Alg II was standard in many high schools for a very long time.
The math on the SAT is not really difficult. My oldest son took the regular SAT in 7th grade to get into a gifted and talented program
and didn't have trouble with the math before he'd had ANY Algebra or SAT prep AT ALL.

By the way, huge number of AP don't necessarily impress Admissions or the nomination boards and seeing huge numbers of AP
coupled with average or below average SATs (below average for competitive Service Academy applicants) can be a red flag
that points to potential weakness.
I won't discuss APs in the medieval era when I attended High School and USNA but for my son, he had a few APs but finished just
out of the top hundred in his USNA class while majoring in Aeronautical Eng (hard major) and being a Varsity Athlete. As
an applicant to USNA, he had very good grades and high class standing with very good SATs as well as multiple sport and academic
captaincies such as Academic Decathlon and Debate while also working a few hours per week.
 
OldRetSWO said:
By the way, huge number of AP don't necessarily impress Admissions or the nomination boards
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Whether or not that is true, I do not know. I have no inside knowledge. However, I always encourage my DS to take the most challenging courses available and AP courses are the most challenging available at his school. I expect that does count for something. Of course, he is doing his best to prepare for the SAT's as well as working on his ECA's and leadership (which are not part of this thread.) Great grades and poor SAT's is red flag, just as great SAT's and poor grades. Not sure which is worse; don't want to be in either category.
 
NJROTC-CC said:
Whether or not that is true, I do not know. I have no inside knowledge.
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Someone who has been involved with Service Academy Admissions for thirty years and served on literally dozens of interview panels that
interviewed many hundreds of candidates just gave you some info.
 
OldRetSWO said:
Someone who has been involved with Service Academy Admissions for thirty years and served on literally dozens of interview panels that
interviewed many hundreds of candidates just gave you some info.
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Please explain why taking AP courses is not preferable to taking easier courses. I don’t understand what you mean?
 
NJROTC-CC said:
Please explain why taking AP courses is not preferable to taking easier courses. I don’t understand what you mean?
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From what I have seen at many many boards, we look at how well a candidate did and doing well with high class rank is very important. A high number of APs certainly does not hurt but class standing should not be overlooked.

All else being equal if I see:

Candidate A has 12 APs and stands 99 out of 400 in their class and
Candidate B has 4 APs and stands 4th out of 400 in their class

As I said, all else being equal (sports, leadership, etc I would expect B to get ranked higher because of their competitive performance.

Additionally, face it, the Academies are primarily STEM schools. I can assure you that I personally look at the transcript to see if their APs
include Calc, Chem and Physics. The next tier in applicability includes Stats and Bio. AP USH, Languages, AP Comp, AP Lit, etc come in below that.

Interview boards have been discussed in other threads but I'll just restate that on Congressional Boards, I've served with a lot of other
interviewers and in every case, we make out our own score sheets prior to comparing notes but it is truly remarkable how congruent
our scores end up. I may sound different from what you've heard but the end results of the scoring seems to be very similar between
me and the multitude of other board members over the years.
 
OldRetSWO said:
From what I have seen at many many boards, we look at how well a candidate did and doing well with high class rank is very important. A high number of APs certainly does not hurt but class standing should not be overlooked.

All else being equal if I see:

Candidate A has 12 APs and stands 99 out of 400 in their class and
Candidate B has 4 APs and stands 4th out of 400 in their class

As I said, all else being equal (sports, leadership, etc I would expect B to get ranked higher because of their competitive performance.

Additionally, face it, the Academies are primarily STEM schools. I can assure you that I personally look at the transcript to see if their APs
include Calc, Chem and Physics. The next tier in applicability includes Stats and Bio. AP USH, Languages, AP Comp, AP Lit, etc come in below that.

Interview boards have been discussed in other threads but I'll just restate that on Congressional Boards, I've served with a lot of other
interviewers and in every case, we make out our own score sheets prior to comparing notes but it is truly remarkable how congruent
our scores end up. I may sound different from what you've heard but the end results of the scoring seems to be very similar between
me and the multitude of other board members over the years.
Click to expand...

Then there is weighted class rank versus un-weighted class rank. A “B” in AP Physics is a hell of a lot more significant than an “A” in home economics.

I recommend taking vigorous classes in high school to prepare for success in college regardless of what a review board may or may not think. That’s my advice and I am sticking to it. Anyway, in DS’s school they put you in the classes that your performance and ability warrants. You don’t just choose AP classes yourself. If you rate AP, that’s where they put you. You could opt for easier classes, but to do that to “game” your class rank seems plain wrong.
 
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