‘25 PS so far

I am excited for you parents, especially the ones who have a son or daughter being the first in the family to join "the military". It is a new extended family to which they will belong and by extension, to which you will be welcomed. You will find that the MIDNs at USNA will be strangely similar to your son or daughter and you will immediately want to have them join in on your visits to The Yard. You will be interested in their lives now, as well as your own son or daughter and you will want to add things for them when you send a care package. You will also meet other parents who are doing the same thing and are actually looking forward to seeing your MIDN. The support that you find there just makes you feel good.
It's funny you say this... I've been making homemade protein bars for my son for years. Now, whenever I ship some down to him, I have to make a separate batch for his basketball player company-mate. He expects them every time!

Whenever we take my son out for dinner, there is usually a few friends tagging along. We always bring a credit card. They eat a lot. A whole lot!
 
Come on. Cooking anything while drinking wine, helps.
Yes, it does. Apparently it’s in every recipe around here right after “Preheat oven.”
I don't do much (any ?) conventional cooking -- its all on my Big Green Egg grill. Every cook starts with light fire and open beer (or other adult beverage), even if it an all day cook starting at O'Dark Thirty in the morning.
 
You will find that the MIDNs at USNA will be strangely similar to your son or daughter and you will immediately want to have them join in on your visits to The Yard. You will be interested in their lives now, as well as your own son or daughter and you will want to add things for them when you send a care package. You will also meet other parents who are doing the same thing and are actually looking forward to seeing your MIDN. The support that you find there just makes you feel good.
Thank you. Yes I felt that sense of family during PPW. When I heard some MIDNs did not have parents visit I felt bad that they had nowhere to go.

Early during PS, DW sent a package to DS as well as to "Any MIDN." We received a thank you note about two weeks ago and then we sent follow-up notes of encourage. The MIDN texted me over PPW thanking for the notes and also exchanged information with my DS as they may meet in class. We did not meet during PPW as I did not want to interrupt his time with his family. However I plan to send notes of encouragement once in awhile and I am sure that at some point we shall meet.
 
She was also amazed by DH heating up the waffle iron and doing shredded turkey and dressing waffles with cooked bacon, with the house cranberry sauce spooned on top in his special ritual concoction. If you’ve never done that, do try. Plenty of internet guidance.
Completely unheard of til now. Will google shortly
 
I don't do much (any ?) conventional cooking -- its all on my Big Green Egg grill. Every cook starts with light fire and open beer (or other adult beverage), even if it an all day cook starting at O'Dark Thirty in the morning.
Or all night cooks. I have a great memory of going to eastern NC for my first pig-picking’ when I was in college taking some summer courses before doing a semester abroad. The men in the family were up all night, including my college BF. Jack D was definitely a part of their ritual. I was with the ladies in the family, helping to make biscuits, slaw, salads, chess pie, peach pie, etc. I couldn’t quite face the incredibly sweet home-made scuppernong wine made by the elder ladies, so I made points with my BF’s mom (who also couldn’t face the scuppernong wine) when I drove off to the nearest ABC store and returned with other selections. Haven’t thought about that for years. Best pig ever.
 
I don't do much (any ?) conventional cooking -- its all on my Big Green Egg grill. Every cook starts with light fire and open beer (or other adult beverage), even if it an all day cook starting at O'Dark Thirty in the morning.
You simply cannot drink all day unless you start in the morning.
 
One thing I did learn from the DS is that the varsity athletes are excused for a good chunk of PS. In fact the football players have been living somewhere else for the last two weeks. They also did not participate in the Parade.

I certainly understand the need for Navy to have a fully prepared D1 athlete so that the product they put forth is good. However how does play into the mission of the USNA to create future officers?
I am not posting to offend or create a hot topic as I work with USNA alum who played football and was an effective Naval officer post commission.
 
Remember that it’s more than about the plebes. It’s about leadership training. These detailers, participating in this ‘reset’, are going back to their (many new) companies. This will be part of the culture moving forward. Not that I have any insight, but plebe parents here may be focusing solely on their plebes. But plebe summer is largely about training company leaders. Those detailers last year were very restricted in how they could train. So this resets all the upperclass participating…to filter though the companies, I suspect. It’s all part of the bigger picture of the Brigade as a whole.

The leadership skills developed in a "boot camp" environment have limited value with regards to the type of leadership one is expected to display in an operational/fleet setting. That's because the objectives are completely different. In a boot camp in environment, you are trying to stress the trainee with the expectation that they will tap into to the emotional toughness they already have or to build that toughness if it's not fully developed. That is not something you would necessarily try to do in a fleet setting. There is a bit of "shock & awe" involved in Plebe Summer. Over the years, the military has found that the most rapid and efficient way to convert a civilian into a military member is this method.
 
One thing I did learn from the DS is that the varsity athletes are excused for a good chunk of PS. In fact the football players have been living somewhere else for the last two weeks. They also did not participate in the Parade.
Therein lies the reason for many mids resenting the football team and having a love/hate relationship with football games. Game attendance is mandatory for mids, but participation in many mid activities is not mandatory for football players. Yes, football players (all varsity athletes, in fact) face different and additional pressures and responsibilities. But to many regular mids, it’s inequitable and unfair.

I’m not picking sides. I see both positives and negatives of the system. But I do hear from DD and some of her shipmates about their dissatisfaction with this divide.

Full disclosure: DD has been a club-sport athlete since day one. Her responsibilities to the team are not as heavy as those faced by varsity athletes. At the same time, other than being away for road games, she’s not exempt from regular mid responsibilities.
 
One thing I did learn from the DS is that the varsity athletes are excused for a good chunk of PS. In fact the football players have been living somewhere else for the last two weeks. They also did not participate in the Parade.

I certainly understand the need for Navy to have a fully prepared D1 athlete so that the product they put forth is good. However how does play into the mission of the USNA to create future officers?
I am not posting to offend or create a hot topic as I work with USNA alum who played football and was an effective Naval officer post commission.
Any athletes in season (very precisely defined) will be on the excusal list for parades and some other military evolutions, because they are in the in-season grind of heavy practices, weight room training, team training, etc. They will spend exhausting hours doing this, many days in a row, weeks at a time, Saturday practices too, missing class and having to make up work, and returning to the Hall long after their non-varsity classmates have hit the books - that’s what Div I takes, and in its own way, builds stamina, grit, time-management skills, followership, leadership, esprit de corps, and physical-mental boundary-pushing in pursuit of a goal.

I’ll leave the discussions on whether the evolution of the DOD SAs into Div I schools with everything that brings is a good or bad thing, as there are several threads on that. It is clear to me though, from what I observed, the lessons learned and time spent playing a varsity sport at USNA usually supported the development of some critical officer skills, such as performance under pressure and the ability to compartmentalize and focus on execution of the task at hand. Instead of detailers pushing them, they have coaches riding them. All 4 years.

It does breed an us v. them, sadly. I know what I observed in my years as Officer Rep with the women’s basketball team, how exhausted they would be on the bus coming back from a game on a school night, trying to do homework on the bus, knowing they had quizzes the next day on just a few hours sleep, and practice again in the afternoon. They weren’t doing it because they thought they had a pro future, they did it for the love of the game, for wearing the Navy uniform, to push themselves their hardest mentally and physically, because they had a drive to excel in this way - knowing some of their classmates would sit back and talk snark about their privileged lives. And they could simply walk away, ditch the whole thing, without any loss of their ability to gain a college degree and commission - but most don’t. I would cheerfully serve with someone with those qualities.

As I said, I’ll leave it to the grads to discuss pros and cons of how varsity sports has evolved over the last several decades. DH played baseball, back in the 20th C., and they played the Ivies, Army, Air Force, some nearby smaller schools. No league.
 
Last edited:
The leadership skills developed in a "boot camp" environment have limited value with regards to the type of leadership one is expected to display in an operational/fleet setting. That's because the objectives are completely different. In a boot camp in environment, you are trying to stress the trainee with the expectation that they will tap into to the emotional toughness they already have or to build that toughness if it's not fully developed. That is not something you would necessarily try to do in a fleet setting. There is a bit of "shock & awe" involved in Plebe Summer. Over the years, the military has found that the most rapid and efficient way to convert a civilian into a military member is this method.
Totally agree. My comment was a directed at the brigade getting out of sorts a bit (I have two there, and even my plebe who knew nothing could see the lack of discipline last year) during last year. Due to the situations from covid. The laziness that crept in. So I speaking about resetting the brigade and how that is also occurring during this plebe summer for upperclass/leadership/detailers. Shaking things up a bit.
 
One thing I did learn from the DS is that the varsity athletes are excused for a good chunk of PS. In fact the football players have been living somewhere else for the last two weeks. They also did not participate in the Parade.

I certainly understand the need for Navy to have a fully prepared D1 athlete so that the product they put forth is good. However how does play into the mission of the USNA to create future officers?
I am not posting to offend or create a hot topic as I work with USNA alum who played football and was an effective Naval officer post commission.
I'm not sure about the athletic funding at USNA, but if it is like other NCAA schools then the majority of the funding is derived from football and men's basketball. In regards to development of future officers, I will opine that Varsity athletics doesn't have any benefit per se over the other athletic/sports programs at USNA. Also, 'fair', IMO isn't in the military vocab, but special treatment doesn't go unnoticed by peers.
 
I’ll also adding way to look at it is USNA brings in a diverse class and develops them in diverse ways. Those same lessons are being learned in club rugby, long hours with an ECA or other ways, not just in varsity sports.
 
Discovered this little nugget in the plebe book…I hope this not new math at work 1F809212-1911-4440-BAC4-6C4E07AD9FE7.jpeg
 
I’ll also adding way to look at it is USNA brings in a diverse class and develops them in diverse ways. Those same lessons are being learned in club rugby, long hours with an ECA or other ways, not just in varsity sports.
Yes. My OP was not to provoke a long debate. I was just surprised that they were excused. However completely agree that athletes have to balance sport and academics. As far as a divide or fairness, I have found that life in general can be unfair and learning how to adequately behave an unfair world is a key skill. Also I am sure the divide is quickly forgotten once the gold bars are pinned at commissioning.
 
Our experience from PPW and meeting our DD.

- Had a good time with another family with us visiting USNA as their daughter is a prospective CO2026.
- The first meeting was tooooooo emotional for all of us and as someone who seldom cried, I was surprised. Every time I see that video, it just gets moisty around the eyes.
- Had good 3 days, lot of relaxation, food, saloons and some exciting time. One one occasion while driving her back to USNA before the reporting time, I selected the wrong Sofi Crepes. It came down to the wire and we were sweating and nervous on being late.
- DD's language has changed, lot of abbreviations such as SIQ, ESL, ISO etc etc..
- There is a lot of confidence, lot of alertness and the feeling that a lot can be accomplished in a day during the ACK year. We'll see to that.
- DD has matured and her detailers were right in identifying her weakness and exploiting it to the max. She thinks that she has a target written on her back. She thinks that for some mistakes while others were let go, she is not. Again it is her opinion, so not sure if it is a fact.
- One thing she was certain of was that if one is tough and wont back down, more is thrown at them. One of her roommates had been talking of going to Tango company from day 1 and she was dealt with a silk hand.
- DD realized that the letters she was writing to us were like a therapy for her but I guess not too much for us.
- She loved the evolutions and hated to miss few of them while on SIQ and ISO.
- One think she was mad the whole time was that in certain cases, she was not dealt fairly while others were given a lot of leeway. She is adamant to deal with it after reform and speak to the detailer and get it out. I guess one can voice disagreement in a right way by adding "Respectfully sir/madam' at the end of the sentence.
- Met the wonderful sponsor family over lunch. Really thankful, she will be in good hands.

As someone said in this forum that PS is not like Plebe year and that Plebe year is not like rest of the 3 years. Cannot wait for her to thrive where her strengths lie and improve upon other areas.
 
Our experience from PPW and meeting our DD.

- DD's language has changed, lot of abbreviations such as SIQ, ESL, ISO etc etc..
My DS did as well but included more "colorful" language not suitable in mixed company. I reminded him not to use those "new" found words in front of DW and Mid Sib.

- She loved the evolutions and hated to miss few of them while on SIQ and ISO.

My DS missed his one chance at the C-Course due to ISO and was upset he missed it.
- One think she was mad the whole time was that in certain cases, she was not dealt fairly while others were given a lot of leeway. She is adamant to deal with it after reform and speak to the detailer and get it out. I guess one can voice disagreement in a right way by adding "Respectfully sir/madam' at the end of the sentence.

My DS mentioned that they did a daily log and he rated one day as 1 (lowest). His detailer quickly followed up. I did not ask what provoked the hi low rating of the day nor about the solution as my DS had moved on. Lots of ups and downs but forward progress was made.

Glad you had a great experience as well.
 
from what I observed, the lessons learned and time spent playing a varsity sport at USNA usually supported the development of some critical officer skills, such as performance under pressure and the ability to compartmentalize and focus on execution of the task at hand. Instead of detailers pushing them, they have coaches riding them. All 4 years.
Gotta second this... I will admit that that I was one who resented some of the privileges that athletes received from time to time, but I had a daughter who did crew at a civilian school for 3 years and recognize the commitment it takes. I also look back at some of the recruited athletes that I perceived had an easier path to admission and were simply doing their time, and see some really outstanding Naval and Marine Corps careers. Years later, I did recruiting for my law firm, and recognized those that participated in varsity athletics (at both D1 and D3) levels were more mature and carried themselves better. Varsity athletics certainly adds something to the program, and missing a couple weeks of Plebe Summer and a few (all?) Prades (I recall some football players whose first and last prades is during Commissioning Week !) doesn't hurt their career progression.
 
Back
Top