Do Not Dismiss The Liaison Officer Interview!

When our DS interviewed with his ALO for USAFA, it was 30 minutes long, in private and when they came out she said "You have a wonderful young man and no matter where he ends up, he'll do great." and she left. It felt more like a heartfelt warning that he'd likely not get in so we were nervous.

Two weeks later, DS interviewed with our local Blue/Gold officer for USNA. It was 3 HOURS!! My DH and I were told to sit in the whole thing. The questions were certainly geared to shake our DS from his game and make him think quick. It was heavily weighted on you witnessing a fellow cadet breaking a rule vs code and how to handle it. Afterwards, the BGO was extremely impressed and complimentary. He gave some great tips on how to enjoy our time when in Annapolis.

Flash forward 3 months...received an appointment to USAFA (1st choice) and a TWE from USNA (3rd choice). Still nothing final from USMA. Interviews are very important but don't expect to be able to read the interviewer's demeanor as a gauge.
 
Things can and do vary a lot between ALOs and different circumstances. For what it's worth, my son never had an ALO interview, nor did he even meet or talk to an ALO. He was assigned three different ones during the process and never talked to any of them until the night that he was presented his appointment by our state's ALO Director at school awards night. The entirety of contact was a couple of emails and a letter.

Stealth_81
 
Stealth_81 said:
Things can and do vary a lot between ALOs and different circumstances. For what it's worth, my son never had an ALO interview, nor did he even meet or talk to an ALO. He was assigned three different ones during the process and never talked to any of them until the night that he was presented his appointment by our state's ALO Director at school awards night. The entirety of contact was a couple of emails and a letter.

Stealth_81
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This is my understanding as well; many kids don't even get interviewed, and if one ALO is scoring one kid one way, but another ALO scores his/her candidates completely different, there is no uniformity. My son was told by his ALO the academy doesn't use the interviews as an element in the evaluation process; short of something very significant, good or bad. I was surprised to hear cristcorp say that the interviews are given a specific score and used as an evaluation factor. It's strange that USAFA does that when all things aren't close to being equal.
 
brovol said:
This is my understanding as well; many kids don't even get interviewed, and if one ALO is scoring one kid one way, but another ALO scores his/her candidates completely different, there is no uniformity. My son was told by his ALO the academy doesn't use the interviews as an element in the evaluation process; short of something very significant, good or bad. I was surprised to hear cristcorp say that the interviews are given a specific score and used as an evaluation factor. It's strange that USAFA does that when all things aren't close to being equal.
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They are equal. You are under the impression, like APPOINTMENTS, that you are "Competing" against the other individuals that the ALO is representing and interviewing. That's not how it works. You are only COMPETING AGAINST YOURSELF. It's not like they compare your interview to that of another applicant.

Think about is....... if you were interviewed, or if your son/daughter told you how THEY were interviewed, you'd realize that there are no Right/Wrong answers. You aren't being scored on "How Many" you got right/wrong. Ask your child and you'll realize most of the questions relate to "How would you relate, react, handle, confront, etc. certain circumstances". The objective is to determine how the "Applicant" believes, perceives, understands, etc.

EVERYONE MUST STOP understanding the academy simply as a NUMBERS GAME. "I scored X amount of points, therefor I'm better/worse/average/etc".

Being there tends to be more PARENTS on this forum than actual applicants, let me pose you some questions.
1. Have you ever be "Interviewed" for a job?
2. Have you ever "Interviewed" someone for a job?
3. Was the interview 100% about "Job Knowledge/experience/skills"?
4. Did you ever realize that hiring someone or being hired has a lot more to consider than just "Skills/knowledge/experience"?

I interview people for work all the time. Matter of fact, I interviewed 3 people in the last week. I interviewed them for very HIGH TECHNICAL Telecommunications/Electronics type jobs. Yes, I asked them technical questions that tested their skills/experience/knowledge. But I probably asked as many; if not more; questions about human relations, teamwork, working with others, handling confrontations, and so many more. In THOSE QUESTIONS, there are no definitive RIGHT/WRONG answers. They are very situational. Yes, the technical questions are easy. Ask 10 question..... get 7 correct...... score a 70%. Next applicant gets 8 out of 10 and gets an 80%. Does that mean they AUTOMATICALLY should get the job? HELL NO!!! When we do the final scoring of an applicant, our score sheet has different scoring for the different sections. Then we add the human factor to it and the individual gets a total score.

This is so similar to the academy. Different scores for different aspects. Some of those aspects the applicant is being score on doesn't have any RIGHT/WRONG answers. Some are situational. This is were we determine if an applicant has a narrow or broad perception of those around him/her. Whether they understand teamwork, leadership, etc. Are they mature enough to handle criticism, conflicts, challenges, etc.

I could go on, but I think you get the point. The ALO interview is very equal. It's ALL ABOUT YOU; "The Applicant". You're being scored against yourself. How much more equal could it be. You've probably heard/read me many times say: "Most times, I DON'T CARE WHAT THE ANSWER IS the candidate gives........ I care HOW THEY ANSWER IT".

I think part of the problem is:
1. This experience is pretty much every parent and every applicant on this forum, FIRST TIME at this. This is NOT the ALO's "First Rodeo"; or the Academy's "First Time" doing this. ALO's have extensive formal training; refresher training, numerous updates to the process, etc. This is not something someone just comes into off the street and control's an applicant's future.
2. There are many things that ALO/BGO/MALO have to be generic/vague about to their applicants and on a forum. E.g. I/We will tell you that you WCS, CFA, Interview, Academics, Leadership, etc. are all scored. (EVERYTHING IS SCORED); but I/we WON'T/CAN'T tell you HOW it's scored.
3. Most individuals see themselves/family/kids/spouse/etc. as unique and from their personal perspective. That's understandable. But that may not be the "SAME PERSPECTIVE" as the academy. This happens many times when the subject of IC/Recruited athletes, minorities, GPA, diversity, etc. is discussed. Just because YOU don't think it's fair, doesn't mean it isn't. Most times, it simply means that you don't understand it from the academy's perspective.

Sorry; but the ALO interview most definitely equal; AND FAIR. Is it perfect? No. It can never be. Nothing can be. But it's quite equal and fair. Especially when you're only being graded and compared TO YOURSELF!!!
 
P.S. And for what it's worth.

Many ALO's; especially the great ones like Flieger; doesn't just meet and interview the applicant 1 time. Sometimes; because of distance; there may not be a lot of "Face to Face". That doesn't mean the ALO doesn't know the applicant. And many ALO's, like Flieger, myself, my son's ALO, and I know many others, contact/visit the applicant's school and speak with some of the applicant's counselors, teachers, principal, coaches, etc. Most of this is informal. In small areas/school districts, it's easy to find out a lot about a person on the internet. Online newspaper, awards, facebook, recognition, etc.

Simply pointing out that while there are some times that an applicant and their ALO don't meet much/often/or at all (Especially in the situations where the ALO changes because of reasons), that isn't generally the norm. Those who VOLUNTEER to be ALO/MALO/BGO do so because they care about the academies and the military. There is no pay for doing this. Most of us are retired from the military, so we paid our dues. This isn't something that ANYONE is forced to do. Again; the perspective of an applicant or parent will understandably be different than the perspective of the academy or an ALO. But while perception may be important....... the perspective of the academy/alo is what matters.
 
We all appreciate your passion but a few of us do not completely agree and that is probably ok. Some of us have experience and contacts outside the normal parent of an applicant as well. We have all stated that the interview is important and needs to be taken seriously but we all have different perspectives from different academies. My DD has done four of these over the last two years and I can assure you that they were not all equal. The first one at West Point was done by her squad leader at SLE. I am sure that this young cadet was learning more from this experience than he was documenting the kind of person she was. Her ALO was an individual similar to yourself that spent a good deal of time with her talking about the things you mentioned. How can we compare that interview done by a cadet with no real experience in leadership with that of an experienced ALO or FFR who has been doing this for years. They are not the same. I can also tell you that the Regional FFR for my area told DD that she did't need to re-interview as a re-applicant. Our local FFR rep did do another interview and spent more time documenting things that have changed and how she had matured through the process. She also had a different ALO who conducted a more formal interview the second time around. There are also many candidates that do not get an interview as there are not enough volunteers to go around.

So at the end of the day, I think we can all agree that candidates who read this in the future need to hear a few things:
  • The interview is important and you should prepare and do your best
  • Practice communicating with adults. This is a skill that most 16/17 y/o need to develop
  • The interview cannot get you an appointment but can significantly hurt your chances of appointment
  • Relax, there are no right answers to the questions.
  • If for some reason you do not get an interview, it is not the end of the world.
 
I am not going to say that the ALO interview is going to be equal with the MALO interview for west point. Matter of fact, there is NO WAY that a NON-ALO would do an interview for the air force academy. It's not going to happen. Especially by some squad leader at summer seminar or similar places.

But I am here to tell you that the ALO interview for the Air Force Academy is EQUAL and FAIR for the Air Force academy. And that is what THIS FORUM IS!!! The AIR FORCE ACADEMY.

As for your 5 points, I agree with the first 4 100%. As for the 5th point; at least for the air force academy, with very remote/few exceptions, there will ALWAYS BE AN INTERVIEW. Could it be done on the phone? Yes. Can it be done on Skype? Yes. Can an ALO meet with an applicant enough times to KNOW what they're looking for and not schedule an "OFFICIAL" interview; and use those meetings as an interview? Yes. But the applicant WILL be interviewed. Because the academy (Air Force) does use that interview as part of their overall scoring, it would have to be an extremely rare circumstance to not have an interview.

But again; for the Air Force Academy, the ALO interview is indeed fair and equal. For it's purpose.
 
Christcorp said:
You'd be surprised what the interview reveals. The gpa, act/sat, and all the stuff on your application is pretty verifiable. No one is going to debate that. But for some reason, people keep wanting to COMPARE applying to the academy with applying to a traditional university. People need to realize. In pretty much all traditional schools, they don't care about you or what type of person you are. They are only in it for the money. They want students who will pass the classes and graduate; (Looks bad when your school has a low graduation rate), they want to show diversity so they can attract more CUSTOMERS and keep the politically correct off their back; and they generally want people where money isn't an issue. Either really rich who pays cash, or those that will have no problem getting a scholarship/loan/etc. Again, realize that universities are a BUSINESS. As a BUSINESS, they are in it for money. If you don't realize that, you are naive.

The academy definitely has it's own motives too. But money isn't one of them. We are looking for OFFICERS, FUTURE LEADERS, TEAM MEMBERS. This is why the ALO interview is so important. Just because you have a 4.0gpa, is ranked #1 in your class, and got a 36 on your ACT, doesn't mean anything to us as far as you being a good potential cadet, officer, leader, military member. All that means is, you shouldn't have any problem getting through the academics at the academy. In the traditional school, academics is the only thing that matters. Except for some D1-A athletics that bring in a lot of money. Once you graduate from that university, that school couldn't care less what happens to you. Laborer, CEO, homeless, in prison, dead, etc. it means nothing. The academy is the opposite. What happens after you graduate is EVERYTHING. So; back to the ALO interview.

This is where the ALO figures out who you are. Are you dedicated? Are you committed? Are you passionate? Are you sincere? Are the answers you give, YOURS and Your Beliefs, or the beliefs and values of your parents? Are you there because YOU WANT TO BE, or because your parents want you there? Do you want to serve; or are you looking just for a free education? Do you care about your community and country, or are you just "FILLING SQUARES" to look good on an application? Are you a leader and/or have the potential to be a leader, or did you simply hold leadership positions because of seniority or again, filling squares on an application? Are you and can you be part of a team? Can you be trusted with someone else's LIFE? And the list goes on.

You'd be surprised what can be learned about an applicant during the interview. Everything before that is simply NUMBERS. It's pretty much a formality with everything else. But this is why some 4.0gpa/36ACT applicants DON'T get an appointment, while a 3.75/29ACT applicant does. At the academy, we bring in cadets who quite possibly will be responsible for someone LIVING or DYING. That is important. That's what the military is all about. Life, Death, Freedom, Democracy, etc. And no matter what people want to think, the traditional universities don't care one bit about you or anything that happens with you once you leave their school. They are a business. The academy has to care. And it's really difficult to interview someone at the ALO interview and realize deep down inside, "This person doesn't belong".

Then again, you'd be surprised how many interviews have been done where the applicant said they really didn't want the academy. Their parents were pushing for it. Possibly because of the free education. I even had one applicant ask me not to let his parents know he didn't want the academy. So, he applied; he wasn't going to get an appointment; but the parents believed he was giving it 100% and really wanted it.

And yes, I've purposely interviewed many applicants in jeans and sneakers. To see the "REAL" applicant. Half the questions I ask, I don't care at all what the answer is. What I care about is HOW they answer the question. So, for all thos applicants and parents who get upset because their 4.0gpa/32+act son/daughter didn't receive an appointment........ Well....... all I can say is: It's about a LOT MORE than academics. This is the MILITARY. It's Not a JOBS PROGRAM or a SCHOLARSHIP PROGRAM. And in return for a great education, we're expecting an individual that can be a military leader. A team player. Someone who can protect and defend their country and fellow military team members. Someone is part of something much bigger than themselves. Someone we can trust with other's lives.
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Love this, thanks.
 
I think ChristCorp said it brilliantly earlier but I'll add my "short" version as well. I've been an ALO for 22 years and have been blessed to see on of my "candidates" become a squadron commander already! And I will tell you that ALO's are as different as regular people; we all have our quirks, foibles, pet-peeves, etc. Some ALO's will meet with a candidate once and that's it. Others will do a phone interview, never actually meet their candidate, and call that good.

And then there's us old-fashioned ALO that think that's just not enough. As someone said, we are the "eyes and ears" of the admission team. While we may be small, we are a vocal and feisty bunch. And USAFA hasn't done away with us and supposedly has no plans to do so; they value our inputs. And just how important is our input? Great question. Here's what I've "gleaned" in 22 years...our report may be a tie-breaker, it may simply be a square filler for many candidates, and it may be a game changer: both ways. I do know for a fact that I can end a candidates candidacy with my report; it's actually a simple statement and keystroke and that's it. Oh, trust me, USAFA/RRS will be calling me the next day for a VERY full explanation. However if I'm "on point" they will most likely go with my call. Now, is that common? No, it's not; in my opinion its probably very rare, but it does happen. I know its happened in my state while I have been an ALO.

But we can also show the board just who the candidate is; not words on paper, and numbers on a report, but WHO is the young man/woman? What makes them tick? Why are they a great choice? I tell the kids and their parents that I am the greatest artist they will ever know; Picasso, Van Gogh, Rembrandt, Michelangelo...all were good, but I'm great!! I have all the skills, all the vision, the ability, the amazing artistic talent, a canvas and brushes just ready to paint the most amazing picture of them for the admission board such that each member will have a mental picture of the candidate that's so good, it's as if they're standing in front of them. What's missing?

The paint; and the candidate gives me that. So I get to know my candidates...we talk, we text, e-mail, meet...and not just once; we probably meet, on average, 10-20 times and sometimes more than that. I drop by school, text and see if they have any news, any new things to report, etc...etc... And I go meet their teachers, coaches, ministers, etc. I want to know who this person is so I can represent them to USAFA! I can't do that with a phone call or a single meeting; it's not fair to either the candidate or USAFA. And its just not me.

There's one real drawback to my method though...I get close to the candidates and when they don't get the appointment, it hurts as if it was my child. But when they DO get the offer, I walk around with this silly grin on my face...folks ask what's going on. And I keep in touch with them; probably to their bane...ask ChristCorp...he's met me at USAFA during football season and seen some of "my kids" just as I've met some of "his" kids.

The ALO is an integral part of the process...the interview? I don't tell the candidate when; I interview them every time I speak with them. Many times they say "So Colonel...when should we schedule the interview" and I'll look at them and say something like "Oh, is there something we've not gone over?" That's when they realize that I've been "taking notes" every time we've spoken, met, emailed, etc. And they normally will then smile and realize it's okay; they've done well, and we're going to put together a good package! It's the rare candidate that hasn't done well; the one that I'll not really be recommending. And they usually know it early on.

So...don't freak about meeting the ALO, don't work yourself into a tizzy, but do come ready to honestly answer questions!! And quite often the "right" answer is "I don't know."

Just my $0.37 worth.

Steve
USAFA ALO
USAFA '83
 
flieger83 said:
I think ChristCorp said it brilliantly earlier but I'll add my "short" version as well. I've been an ALO for 22 years and have been blessed to see on of my "candidates" become a squadron commander already! And I will tell you that ALO's are as different as regular people; we all have our quirks, foibles, pet-peeves, etc. Some ALO's will meet with a candidate once and that's it. Others will do a phone interview, never actually meet their candidate, and call that good.

And then there's us old-fashioned ALO that think that's just not enough. As someone said, we are the "eyes and ears" of the admission team. While we may be small, we are a vocal and feisty bunch. And USAFA hasn't done away with us and supposedly has no plans to do so; they value our inputs. And just how important is our input? Great question. Here's what I've "gleaned" in 22 years...our report may be a tie-breaker, it may simply be a square filler for many candidates, and it may be a game changer: both ways. I do know for a fact that I can end a candidates candidacy with my report; it's actually a simple statement and keystroke and that's it. Oh, trust me, USAFA/RRS will be calling me the next day for a VERY full explanation. However if I'm "on point" they will most likely go with my call. Now, is that common? No, it's not; in my opinion its probably very rare, but it does happen. I know its happened in my state while I have been an ALO.

But we can also show the board just who the candidate is; not words on paper, and numbers on a report, but WHO is the young man/woman? What makes them tick? Why are they a great choice? I tell the kids and their parents that I am the greatest artist they will ever know; Picasso, Van Gogh, Rembrandt, Michelangelo...all were good, but I'm great!! I have all the skills, all the vision, the ability, the amazing artistic talent, a canvas and brushes just ready to paint the most amazing picture of them for the admission board such that each member will have a mental picture of the candidate that's so good, it's as if they're standing in front of them. What's missing?

The paint; and the candidate gives me that. So I get to know my candidates...we talk, we text, e-mail, meet...and not just once; we probably meet, on average, 10-20 times and sometimes more than that. I drop by school, text and see if they have any news, any new things to report, etc...etc... And I go meet their teachers, coaches, ministers, etc. I want to know who this person is so I can represent them to USAFA! I can't do that with a phone call or a single meeting; it's not fair to either the candidate or USAFA. And its just not me.

There's one real drawback to my method though...I get close to the candidates and when they don't get the appointment, it hurts as if it was my child. But when they DO get the offer, I walk around with this silly grin on my face...folks ask what's going on. And I keep in touch with them; probably to their bane...ask ChristCorp...he's met me at USAFA during football season and seen some of "my kids" just as I've met some of "his" kids.

The ALO is an integral part of the process...the interview? I don't tell the candidate when; I interview them every time I speak with them. Many times they say "So Colonel...when should we schedule the interview" and I'll look at them and say something like "Oh, is there something we've not gone over?" That's when they realize that I've been "taking notes" every time we've spoken, met, emailed, etc. And they normally will then smile and realize it's okay; they've done well, and we're going to put together a good package! It's the rare candidate that hasn't done well; the one that I'll not really be recommending. And they usually know it early on.

So...don't freak about meeting the ALO, don't work yourself into a tizzy, but do come ready to honestly answer questions!! And quite often the "right" answer is "I don't know."

Just my $0.37 worth.

Steve
USAFA ALO
USAFA '83
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You'd sound like an incredible, involved, supportive ALO. My son's ALO has been great, but in a larger metro area, he is at least an hour away, so meeting in person is not easy. They have met twice, and will possibly meet again regarding the issue of tattoos, etc..., but with DS busy schedule and ALO work, there is not that bond you have with your candidates.
 
USMA 1994 said:
We all appreciate your passion but a few of us do not completely agree and that is probably ok. Some of us have experience and contacts outside the normal parent of an applicant as well. We have all stated that the interview is important and needs to be taken seriously but we all have different perspectives from different academies. My DD has done four of these over the last two years and I can assure you that they were not all equal. The first one at West Point was done by her squad leader at SLE. I am sure that this young cadet was learning more from this experience than he was documenting the kind of person she was. Her ALO was an individual similar to yourself that spent a good deal of time with her talking about the things you mentioned. How can we compare that interview done by a cadet with no real experience in leadership with that of an experienced ALO or FFR who has been doing this for years. They are not the same. I can also tell you that the Regional FFR for my area told DD that she did't need to re-interview as a re-applicant. Our local FFR rep did do another interview and spent more time documenting things that have changed and how she had matured through the process. She also had a different ALO who conducted a more formal interview the second time around. There are also many candidates that do not get an interview as there are not enough volunteers to go around.

So at the end of the day, I think we can all agree that candidates who read this in the future need to hear a few things:
  • The interview is important and you should prepare and do your best
  • Practice communicating with adults. This is a skill that most 16/17 y/o need to develop
  • The interview cannot get you an appointment but can significantly hurt your chances of appointment
  • Relax, there are no right answers to the questions.
  • If for some reason you do not get an interview, it is not the end of the world.
Click to expand...
Christcorp said:
P.S. And for what it's worth.

Many ALO's; especially the great ones like Flieger; doesn't just meet and interview the applicant 1 time. Sometimes; because of distance; there may not be a lot of "Face to Face". That doesn't mean the ALO doesn't know the applicant. And many ALO's, like Flieger, myself, my son's ALO, and I know many others, contact/visit the applicant's school and speak with some of the applicant's counselors, teachers, principal, coaches, etc. Most of this is informal. In small areas/school districts, it's easy to find out a lot about a person on the internet. Online newspaper, awards, facebook, recognition, etc.

Simply pointing out that while there are some times that an applicant and their ALO don't meet much/often/or at all (Especially in the situations where the ALO changes because of reasons), that isn't generally the norm. Those who VOLUNTEER to be ALO/MALO/BGO do so because they care about the academies and the military. There is no pay for doing this. Most of us are retired from the military, so we paid our dues. This isn't something that ANYONE is forced to do. Again; the perspective of an applicant or parent will understandably be different than the perspective of the academy or an ALO. But while perception may be important....... the perspective of the academy/alo is what matters.
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I wasn't questioning whether an ALO scores an applicant when doing an interview. I was questioning whether USAFA uses that score and applies it to the admissions overall points for that candidate when determining the candidates whole candidate score.

I interview prospective employees in my court. It is an important part of the hiring assessment, obviously, but that is because I am the one making the hiring decision, and the interview is, like the hiring process as a whole, extremely subjective. If I put scores for how folks answered the questions I ask it would be no less subjective, as I am still deciding subjectively how many points to give for each answer.

There must be hundreds of ALO's Nationwide, and they each might score those respective applicants differently. Indeed, the ALO who interviewed my son told him that he did not score him on the interview, and that he submitted a report which gets reviewed by admissions, but was not given a score per se, but that his role was mostly informational. He did tell my son that he had a very good application, and thought he was a very strong candidate, but told him, "what I think though won't matter". This of course conflicts a bit with what is being said here.

I know USMA and USAFA are not necessarily the same, but my son's RC at West Point told us that the FFR interview was not considered at all in the admissions equasion, and emphasized that many candidates never even get an interview, or contacted by a FFR at all. It sounds like many USAFA candidates don't get interviewed either. It that is the case, how could admissions give some kids points for an interview, and other kids get nothing because they weren't interviewed at all? That certainly isn't "equal".

If you are saying ALO's score candidates on the interview, I get that, and can see value in the process. But once it is turned over to USAFA admissions, it should be the admissions team which used the report for whatever benefit they see; as opposed to simply accepting and applying the scores assessed by whichever ASO conducted the interview.
 
Christcorp said:
Simply pointing out that while there are some times that an applicant and their ALO don't meet much/often/or at all (Especially in the situations where the ALO changes because of reasons), that isn't generally the norm. Those who VOLUNTEER to be ALO/MALO/BGO do so because they care about the academies and the military. There is no pay for doing this. Most of us are retired from the military, so we paid our dues. This isn't something that ANYONE is forced to do. Again; the perspective of an applicant or parent will understandably be different than the perspective of the academy or an ALO. But while perception may be important....... the perspective of the academy/alo is what matters.
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I heard from the grapevine that ALO's get "compensation". Not in the form of direct wages, but rather related to some sort of accrual of retirement points (analogous to being in the Guard). That conversation was over 5 years ago. So I forget the details. Whatever the non direct wage compensation, passionate ALO's who pour their heart into this mentoring job are doing it for all of the right reasons and definitely under compensated. The ALO's on this forum like yourself, are obviously passionate and under-"compensated" (assuming my conversation on the topic had any merit). Who knows, I could have gotten bad info.

That said, I am willing to bet their are some ALO duds (assuming their is some "compensation"), are volunteering for the wrong reason (basically for their small personal gains ). If so, that's life and this happens everywhere. I could be waaaaaaay off my educated guess. For the record, I hope you all get some sort of compensation out of this over and above giving back for something that you passionately believe in!

I will say back in 2011, our local West Point ALO was passionate beyond belief. Some quick background. After about a week that or DS clicked online that he was interested and started filling out the application, he got a call from the local USMA ALO for an interview. That lasted about 2 hours. The ALO reached out and talked to us on the phone and had a lot of great things to say about our son. If it maters, our DS was not a IC. Nonetheless, around early November, he got a Letter of Assurance inside of a week of his ALO interview. Evidently, the 20 year plus ALO had some pull for getting that LOA so quickly unless they give them out like candy. I can only guess. Meanwhile, the USAFA ALO (who was a very nice guy) had 1/5th the horsepower. He didn't do a bad job; but he didn't have the WP ALO's passion. USAFA waited till mid April to make an offer to our son. The ALO didn't give any warm-and-fuzzies as to if he had a shot. Not even a hint even after our son followed up with him a few times. Considering our DS's predicted score as to how he would do at USAFA (the number used to make offers for the scholars program) and his final USAFA class rank, I always wondered how much the young ALO could have influenced the (extremely busy) admissions. He crossed the stage 1st, so their predicted score was accurate. I was pushing him to wait (and he waited) but he wanted to pick USMA because of the feedback. Throughout the process, the WP ALO stayed close (offering meetings with current cadets while on break etc).

So when I hear some people post that their ALO was missing in action, I wonder how their relationships are with SA admissions. Of course, you are infinitely more knowledgeable on this topic than I. Still, I'd be shocked to learn that highly respected and the most active ALO's (who work more closely with admission) don't have some subjective "pull" when they rarely want an outcome that they believe in. Normally in life, relationships have influence. Because I was "convinced" that the WP ALO said something to admissions that he wanted and make happen. As a side note, he took it somewhat personal when our DS chose USAFA (he was passionate that WP was the right decision). Analogy: I had an interview for a engineering job at Honeywell years ago that I didn't get. The Division VP who I interviewed with evidently walked by resume down to HR and said something to the tune: "find him a slot somewhere". So I got hired for another job a couple months later. One reason; relationships. So correct me if I am wrong, don't some ALO's have more credibility and pull that others with admissions? It might be something that you don't want to discuss and I respect that. If a student impresses you, have you ever made a call into admissions and said, THIS guy is someone we really want?
 
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I think there are a lot of good points made in this thread. One common theme is that each ALO experience is unique as are the individuals who take on the ALO responsibility. My DS first reached out to his ALO in the 7th grade. They knew each other well by the time he did the interview.

I interview candidates for jobs at Fortune 1. By the time you get to the interview stage you should know that you are qualified for the position. There may be a few questions on your skill set, but much more is behavorial and all about fit and need for the open position.
 
If you are an active duty/reserve officer, and you are an ALO, then yes, you do get some points towards retirement. But a large part; probably the majority; of ALO's are already retired. There's no points, pay, compensation, etc. for volunteering. And that's how most ALO's get the job. Those who do it on active/reserve duty, I believe get some additional points, because it's duties ABOVE and BEYOND their "Regular" job.

But Flieger can verify that better. He was an ALO while still active. I only did it while retired.
 
DD’s ALO was somewhere in between. She and DD “spoke” either by email, phone or text several times through the course of things.

Her initial in-person contact was at DD’s high school one day. The ALO came to the school and “surprised” DD in the counselor’s office. The counselor, principal, and superintendent knew she would be there that day, but didn’t tell DD until they called her to the office. Imagine DD’s surprise. Her ALO spoke with the school administration for a while before meeting and talking with DD for a bit.

The two spoke a few more times and then DD invited her ALO to one of her home softball games. The ALO was thrilled to be invited. She said that none of her candidates had ever invited her to come and watch them play their sports. She came, we met, and talked for the next 1 ½ - 2 hours during the game while she had the opportunity to see DD in this setting and how she handled herself. Other than DD giving me a sideways glance from behind home plate every now and then (DD was the catcher), I’m sure she was thinking “oh, shoot, my ALO is talking with my Mom this entire time!” Also, the ALO had to put up with this crazy mom during a game since I kind of get into the games.

After the game, the ALO and DD talked for a bit as well and she mentioned that she had until February to complete and submit her report to USAFA. Within a few days, though, the ALO contacted DD and said she wanted to meet with her. She never told her it was “the formal interview”, and asked her to meet her at a library to talk. Well, just happened that the ALO’s timetable was suddenly moved up to early October, and that WAS the interview. According to DD, though, there were a few “formal” or typical questions, but for the most part, they chatted about many things. I believe DD’s ALO worked similar to Flieger83 in that she was keeping notes every time she had contact with DD or had chances to observe her.

Sadly, DD was this ALO’s final candidate. She was moving onto another position since she was in the AF Reserves and needed more points for retirement. She said each time she worked with or traveled to interact with an Academy applicant/candidate, she earned a few points, but not many.

Also, like Christcorp and Flieger83 stated, DD’s ALO mentioned that she alone could not ensure an appointment was received, but based on her report, she could almost ensure someone would not get an appointment. So, the ALO’s input does have bearing on the potential for appointment.
 
MN-Dad-2016 said:
Christcorp said:
Simply pointing out that while there are some times that an applicant and their ALO don't meet much/often/or at all (Especially in the situations where the ALO changes because of reasons), that isn't generally the norm. Those who VOLUNTEER to be ALO/MALO/BGO do so because they care about the academies and the military. There is no pay for doing this. Most of us are retired from the military, so we paid our dues. This isn't something that ANYONE is forced to do. Again; the perspective of an applicant or parent will understandably be different than the perspective of the academy or an ALO. But while perception may be important....... the perspective of the academy/alo is what matters.
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I heard from the grapevine that ALO's get "compensation". Not in the form of direct wages, but rather related to some sort of accrual of retirement points (analogous to being in the Guard). That conversation was over 5 years ago. So I forget the details. Whatever the non direct wage compensation, passionate ALO's who pour their heart into this mentoring job are doing it for all of the right reasons and definitely under compensated. The ALO's on this forum like yourself, are obviously passionate and under-"compensated" (assuming my conversation on the topic had any merit). Who knows, I could have gotten bad info.

That said, I am willing to bet their are some ALO duds (assuming their is some "compensation"), are volunteering for the wrong reason (basically for their small personal gains ). If so, that's life and this happens everywhere. I could be waaaaaaay off my educated guess. For the record, I hope you all get some sort of compensation out of this over and above giving back for something that you passionately believe in!

I will say back in 2011, our local West Point ALO was passionate beyond belief. Some quick background. After about a week that or DS clicked online that he was interested and started filling out the application, he got a call from the local USMA ALO for an interview. That lasted about 2 hours. The ALO reached out and talked to us on the phone and had a lot of great things to say about our son. If it maters, our DS was not a IC. Nonetheless, around early November, he got a Letter of Assurance inside of a week of his ALO interview. Evidently, the 20 year plus ALO had some pull for getting that LOA so quickly unless they give them out like candy. I can only guess. Meanwhile, the USAFA ALO (who was a very nice guy) had 1/5th the horsepower. He didn't do a bad job; but he didn't have the WP ALO's passion. USAFA waited till mid April to make an offer to our son. The ALO didn't give any warm-and-fuzzies as to if he had a shot. Not even a hint even after our son followed up with him a few times. Considering our DS's predicted score as to how he would do at USAFA (the number used to make offers for the scholars program) and his final USAFA class rank, I always wondered how much the young ALO could have influenced the (extremely busy) admissions. He crossed the stage 1st, so their predicted score was accurate. I was pushing him to wait (and he waited) but he wanted to pick USMA because of the feedback. Throughout the process, the WP ALO stayed close (offering meetings with current cadets while on break etc).

So when I hear some people post that their ALO was missing in action, I wonder how their relationships are with SA admissions. Of course, you are infinitely more knowledgeable on this topic than I. Still, I'd be shocked to learn that highly respected and the most active ALO's (who work more closely with admission) don't have some subjective "pull" when they rarely want an outcome that they believe in. Normally in life, relationships have influence. Because I was "convinced" that the WP ALO said something to admissions that he wanted and make happen. As a side note, he took it somewhat personal when our DS chose USAFA (he was passionate that WP was the right decision). Analogy: I had an interview for a engineering job at Honeywell years ago that I didn't get. The Division VP who I interviewed with evidently walked by resume down to HR and said something to the tune: "find him a slot somewhere". So I got hired for another job a couple months later. One reason; relationships. So correct me if I am wrong, don't some ALO's have more credibility and pull that others with admissions? It might be something that you don't want to discuss and I respect that. If a student impresses you, have you ever made a call into admissions and said, THIS guy is someone we really want?
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Actually, no need to get this through the grapevine.. It's online and explains how ALO's volunteer their time, but they do get a form of compensation through accrual of days that may help them in retirement. But, many of these spend much more time of their own away from family and friends to do this. Although not technically volunteer, it really is..
 
The responses by both Christcorp and Flieger83 are solid and on-point. They are so good, in fact, that I plan to share these with my teenage daughters as general life advice on how to represent themselves to adults. Thank you Christcorp and Flieger83 for your service as ALO's and also for your input to this forum.
 
mommahedg said:
When our DS interviewed with his ALO for USAFA, it was 30 minutes long, in private and when they came out she said "You have a wonderful young man and no matter where he ends up, he'll do great." and she left. It felt more like a heartfelt warning that he'd likely not get in so we were nervous.

Two weeks later, DS interviewed with our local Blue/Gold officer for USNA. It was 3 HOURS!! My DH and I were told to sit in the whole thing. The questions were certainly geared to shake our DS from his game and make him think quick. It was heavily weighted on you witnessing a fellow cadet breaking a rule vs code and how to handle it. Afterwards, the BGO was extremely impressed and complimentary. He gave some great tips on how to enjoy our time when in Annapolis.

Flash forward 3 months...received an appointment to USAFA (1st choice) and a TWE from USNA (3rd choice). Still nothing final from USMA. Interviews are very important but don't expect to be able to read the interviewer's demeanor as a gauge.
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My DS (Class of 2020) interviewed with both an ALO and BGO for USAFA and USNA, respectively. His interview sessions were completely the opposite as those described by mommahedg. The formal interview with the ALO was conducted at our home. After introductions concluded, the ALO asked everyone but DS to leave for the interview (thankfully it was in the fall and I could watch NFL games while the interview was conducted). If i recall correctly the interview lasted approximately 1-1/2 to 2 hours. Following the interview, there was very little feedback from either DS or the ALO. I will also add that the ALO showed up at the interview in full dress uniform.

The interview with the BGO was completely different. He asked mom and dad to stay during the interview. Most of the time was spent listening to the BGO brag about the USNA, his family and the Navy. There was very little time left for my son to actually talk what with all of the BGO's talking. The BGO was attired in a Navy golf shirt and khaki trousers.

I think this just illustrates that the interview process varies from person-to-person and academy-to-academy. The bottom line is that the interview IS important no matter the circumstances surrounding it.
 
Christcorp said:
You'd be surprised what the interview reveals. The gpa, act/sat, and all the stuff on your application is pretty verifiable. No one is going to debate that. But for some reason, people keep wanting to COMPARE applying to the academy with applying to a traditional university. People need to realize. In pretty much all traditional schools, they don't care about you or what type of person you are. They are only in it for the money. They want students who will pass the classes and graduate; (Looks bad when your school has a low graduation rate), they want to show diversity so they can attract more CUSTOMERS and keep the politically correct off their back; and they generally want people where money isn't an issue. Either really rich who pays cash, or those that will have no problem getting a scholarship/loan/etc. Again, realize that universities are a BUSINESS. As a BUSINESS, they are in it for money. If you don't realize that, you are naive.

The academy definitely has it's own motives too. But money isn't one of them. We are looking for OFFICERS, FUTURE LEADERS, TEAM MEMBERS. This is why the ALO interview is so important. Just because you have a 4.0gpa, is ranked #1 in your class, and got a 36 on your ACT, doesn't mean anything to us as far as you being a good potential cadet, officer, leader, military member. All that means is, you shouldn't have any problem getting through the academics at the academy. In the traditional school, academics is the only thing that matters. Except for some D1-A athletics that bring in a lot of money. Once you graduate from that university, that school couldn't care less what happens to you. Laborer, CEO, homeless, in prison, dead, etc. it means nothing. The academy is the opposite. What happens after you graduate is EVERYTHING. So; back to the ALO interview.

This is where the ALO figures out who you are. Are you dedicated? Are you committed? Are you passionate? Are you sincere? Are the answers you give, YOURS and Your Beliefs, or the beliefs and values of your parents? Are you there because YOU WANT TO BE, or because your parents want you there? Do you want to serve; or are you looking just for a free education? Do you care about your community and country, or are you just "FILLING SQUARES" to look good on an application? Are you a leader and/or have the potential to be a leader, or did you simply hold leadership positions because of seniority or again, filling squares on an application? Are you and can you be part of a team? Can you be trusted with someone else's LIFE? And the list goes on.

You'd be surprised what can be learned about an applicant during the interview. Everything before that is simply NUMBERS. It's pretty much a formality with everything else. But this is why some 4.0gpa/36ACT applicants DON'T get an appointment, while a 3.75/29ACT applicant does. At the academy, we bring in cadets who quite possibly will be responsible for someone LIVING or DYING. That is important. That's what the military is all about. Life, Death, Freedom, Democracy, etc. And no matter what people want to think, the traditional universities don't care one bit about you or anything that happens with you once you leave their school. They are a business. The academy has to care. And it's really difficult to interview someone at the ALO interview and realize deep down inside, "This person doesn't belong".

Then again, you'd be surprised how many interviews have been done where the applicant said they really didn't want the academy. Their parents were pushing for it. Possibly because of the free education. I even had one applicant ask me not to let his parents know he didn't want the academy. So, he applied; he wasn't going to get an appointment; but the parents believed he was giving it 100% and really wanted it.

And yes, I've purposely interviewed many applicants in jeans and sneakers. To see the "REAL" applicant. Half the questions I ask, I don't care at all what the answer is. What I care about is HOW they answer the question. So, for all thos applicants and parents who get upset because their 4.0gpa/32+act son/daughter didn't receive an appointment........ Well....... all I can say is: It's about a LOT MORE than academics. This is the MILITARY. It's Not a JOBS PROGRAM or a SCHOLARSHIP PROGRAM. And in return for a great education, we're expecting an individual that can be a military leader. A team player. Someone who can protect and defend their country and fellow military team members. Someone is part of something much bigger than themselves. Someone we can trust with other's lives.
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Your point is PERFECTLY stated. Thank you!!!!
 
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