does the college choice matter?

Jcc123 said:
Vista - A small reality check - your son's stats, while good, are not likely to get him accepted at Vanderbilt. I suspect that to be true for Wash U, Penn, Princeton and UVA as well, unless there's some major hook that you've not mentioned.

Unless finances are not an issue for you, he may want to scale back his school choices to more reasonable options. There are plenty of liberal arts schools with AROTC that have acceptance rates higher than 14% (Vandy). Every spring this board is flooded with desperate posts from kids trying to transfer scholarships because they were not accepted to the school they received a scholarship to. It's sad to watch and doesn't always work out in the student's favor.
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35 Composite ACT would put him in the top 25% at Wash U., which would certainly make him competitive.
 
Agreed, EDelahanty, a 35 is just above the middle 50% at Wash U, but the 3.7 can be problematic. In no way is the school a safe choice for anyone.

Also agree that the color vision is the bigger issue.
 
Vista123 said:
He is looking at Georgetown (#1 choice), U of Illinois (in state), U of wis, U of Mich, U of Virg, Vandy, Northwestern (in state but cross town), wash u, U Penn and Princeton.
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Vista123: Since you are in Illinois, thought I might suggest Marquette, Dayton and Saint Louis. I think all 3 have Army ROTC.

From what I have heard, these schools tend to have open slots after all is said and done because applicants use them as safety schools for some of the schools you listed and others like Notre Dame. When all the jockeying takes place in late spring these schools historically end up with open slots. They are very good 2nd tier schools and probably excellent liberal arts schools.

I know they all have ROTC and think they all have AROTC.

Based on published stats, your DS may be on the upper end of the average student which might mean additional scholarships or paricipation in Honors programs that can provide a very unique educational opportunity.

Food for thought...
 
OP, I agree with some posters above about selectivity of these top 20 programs.

Your son will be right in the middle of the applicant pool for WashU, Penn, Princeton, Northwestern, etc. Right in the middle. Yet, 80-93% of those applicants are rejected. Perhaps one of those will say yes, perhaps two, perhaps none. I think he's about 50/50 for Georgetown, unless he's applying to the Walsh School of Foreign Service, in which case he's back in the 90-83% reject category for similarly statted applicants.

Suggest, as others have said, to broaden the Private School search pattern. Boston U., Tulane, Fordham, U of Miami, SMU are some that immediately come to mind with quality academics and a great college atmosphere.

I think you're OK for Michigan... I'd say 80%. Agree that IL is a safety.

If he puts Michigan as #1, and he happens to get into Georgetown and Northwestern, he could then see if either of those two have openings into which he could transfer his ROTC scholarship.

Make sure that whatever he puts as #1, though it wouldn't necessarily be his first choice, would be a college he would be proud to attend.
 
when I posted this question on this forum the answers provided were exactly the sound advice I was looking for. Thank you all!
 
Just a VA resident chiming in. Your DS's stats are good, but by law in VA, they cannot accept more than 30% from OOS....he is competing against 49 other states applicants. I believe International applicants are also in that 30% pool.

I would try to pm TPG (his DD commissioned NROTC-MO 2012) and Terp (I believe their child was accepted for 2017---NROTC?)

They can give you insight on what UVA is looking for regarding applicants.
 
dunninla said:
Suggest, as others have said, to broaden the Private School search pattern. Boston U., Tulane, Fordham, U of Miami, SMU are some that immediately come to mind with quality academics and a great college atmosphere.
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If you are considering schools in the Northeast for Army ROTC, consider Marist College.

For the last 4 years, EVERY Cadet with a 3.0 or higher has received a full tuition army ROTC Scholarship. Many with 2.7 - 3.0 have also received the scholarship. Marist College provides free room and board to scholarship winners.
 
Vista123 said:
Thanks Jcc123 for your input. His number one choices are Georgetown, Wash U and U Mich. I am not sure what areas he is lacking to get into those. What stats should be improved or what hook would be beneficial? U Penn, Vandy, U of V are Reach schools. U of I and Wisc are fall backs and not preferred. His lowest stat is probably uw gpa of 3.7. but he has only taken honors and AP classes (7 AP the rest honors by sr yr) so that should help. he does have captain and varsity so that should also help. and honestly a 35 on ACT should be fine. Do they look at Boys state and internships? or is that only important for S.As? what other holes do you see (sorry to be a bother)

I agree a smaller school may offer more with regards to a liberal arts major. However, unfortunately (fortunately?!) I am not the one who is applying. I am just trying to help gather more information (he is doing even more information gathering than I am...I just always fall back to this trusty forum)

armydaughter, I sent you a pm. (same queston that I asked dunninla)

dunninla, well you very clearly summed up the stress level in our house. where can we find a list of schools that difficulty meeting its recruiting targets each year? Ive done an exhaustive search but am coming up empty handed.

Goalie dad (Love the name BTW and I am a goalie mom with regards to my oldest son) my second son was a defensman and likes hockey (travel and hich school) but is primarily a boxer and wrestler...Hockey without the ice...

Honestly we are getting tripped up on this part of the process. Much more complicated than older son's apps
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Vista123 said:
Sons plan in college is not to play hockey. he would love to continue to box/wrestle in some fashion.

His colorblindness may be a show stopper. we are aware that this can be a hurdle-nothing to be done about that but raise stats in ALLthe the areas so it makes it harder to say 'no thanks...'

We aren't trying to beat the system -just following the philosophy of General Hal Moore.
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I'm going to throw out a couple of LACs that have ROTC and D3 wrestling. Wheaton (IL) right up your way, and Washington and Lee (VA) (maybe others here could lend some insight here - they are in a BN with VMI).

Don't know if your son has ever considered a small college or even knows what one would be like, as it looks like his list is based on well-known (i.e.bigger) schools. Perhaps a early fall visit to Wheaton might be in order?

If the Army is his thing, they don't care about what school he got his degree from, more of how well he did there. I think finding a fit (especially not an overly competitive fit) makes for a better overall experience.

I want to say there was a member here who went to Wheaton...
 
Washington and Lee is nice, but beware: It's about 100 yards from the front gates of the Virginia Military Institute! I doubt the VMI cadets take kindly to WLU cadets who are actually allowed to leave their campus and what not :wink:
 
Marist College ROTC said:
If you are considering schools in the Northeast for Army ROTC, consider Marist College.

For the last 4 years, EVERY Cadet with a 3.0 or higher has received a full tuition army ROTC Scholarship. Many with 2.7 - 3.0 have also received the scholarship. Marist College provides free room and board to scholarship winners.
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Does Marist still have a formal overnight program for prospective cadets? It's a great opportunity to check out the school and the AROTC program.
 
Strength and Honor said:
Washington and Lee is nice, but beware: It's about 100 yards from the front gates of the Virginia Military Institute! I doubt the VMI cadets take kindly to WLU cadets who are actually allowed to leave their campus and what not :wink:
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I would imagine that the Rumbles in the street are kept to a minimum.
 
Strength and Honor said:
Washington and Lee is nice, but beware: It's about 100 yards from the front gates of the Virginia Military Institute! I doubt the VMI cadets take kindly to WLU cadets who are actually allowed to leave their campus and what not :wink:
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Haha, actually I was recently up at W&L for a camp and the students there said they were friends with a lot of VMI cadets (obviously not the Rats though, ha).
 
Jcleppe said:
I would imagine that the Rumbles in the street are kept to a minimum.
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There are now- but back in the olden days of 18 year old drinking age and no women at either school, the W&L frat houses- several of which are just outside of the gates to Post- were the scenes of pretty routine massive Animal House type parties and those turned into some really epic ugly incidents. (the combination of lots of beer and lots of women really brought home our relatively monastic state compared to those guys- it didn't take much to get into a fight:eek: And there was a near Corps sized beat down of W & L after the Iranians seized the embassy. The "minks" staged a demonstration on post targeting the Iranian cadets at VMI. The Corps went storming out enmasse to defend our Brother Rats and eradicate W &L as well- the State Cops and the entire Tac staff were out there as it quickly got way beyond the Guard team and the campus cops- they wound up locking us all down in barracks and hauled off a bunch of minks and a few guys got in serious trouble for putting a little too much emphasis into their nonverbal communications with the W &L people. But since women came to Lexington at both schools and beer mostly went south, things have been much more refined and civilized between the two schools. There still isn't a ton of socializing between the two schools, but I don't think that there is much hostility anymore.
There aren't too many ROTC cadets at W &L- they go to VMI for their classes which must be an interesting culture shock for them. W &L is a great school though - an dit is the quintessential small Liberal Arts college environment with a really strong reputation- it would be a place I would suggest looking at if you are interesed in the small college environment.
 
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Marist College ROTC said:
If you are considering schools in the Northeast for Army ROTC, consider Marist College.

For the last 4 years, EVERY Cadet with a 3.0 or higher has received a full tuition army ROTC Scholarship. Many with 2.7 - 3.0 have also received the scholarship. Marist College provides free room and board to scholarship winners.
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Marist does seem to offer a compelling proposition -- aside from an excellent cadre, Tuition/fees + Subsistence + books + ROOM & BOARD pretty much makes Marist a profitable endeavor.
 
Thought On DS Choice Of Schools

Not sure what it all means at this point but my DS package will be sent on Monday. He has the following as his school choices.

1. University of South Carolina
2. University of North Carolina
3. Penn St.
4. BU
5. Fordham University

Checked off that he would attend any if awarded the scholarship.

ACT:
Comp - 29
Math - 32
English 31

Major - Electrical Engineering

HS Stats - Basic
NHS
Varsity Club
3.85 GPA (unweighted)
Top 20% of the class
Academic Science Award
Followed engineering program
Captain of one team
Lettered in two sports (expected total of 8 letters at the end of Sr. year)
AP's and Honor classes
4 on AP exam
200+ hours of school and community service

Looking at the schools of choice and his baseline of achievements where does he stand. We do not have an instate choice. He really would like his first two options and had a tough time one over the other.

After looking at the top three they "appear" to all be safety schools for him. I for one don't like the "safety school" tag these are all good schools and better qualified kids have been turned away I'm sure.

So are these schools / NROTC units too competative for my DS on his application? Should he be thinking of some other options? Just when you think you have a good idea where your child stand it all gets crazy again, I'm miffed!
 
He looks to be a strong NROTC applicant to me.

He will 90% get into every school on your list except possibly UNC. UNC is very, very tough on out of state applicants.... so is UVA, not that that is relevant to your post :)

Your list looks rational, and well thought out.
 
OOPS...

Now there is a mistake... Yip, UNC is just about 100% all instate kids.

It was North Carolina State University not UNC sorry about that. Thank you for picking up on that.

Redirect, so how does North Carolina State University fit the picture?

I think the top 20% of his class may hurt a little. It is a very smart class!!
 
Whew, I was about to go into the "UNC has a 15% acceptance rate for out of state applicants" speech hahaha.

I do not live in NC but the majority of my extended family does and I have relatives that have attended both schools (mostly UNC though)

From what I know about NC State I think your son will be fine for admission, the have a much higher acceptance rate than UNC.

NCST is a fantastic choice for engineering, the Research Triangle Park is just minutes from campus and there are all sorts of technology companies that have facilities there.
 
Based on the experience of a number of very highly qualified applicants who have posted on this forum in the past couple of years, it appears to be the case that it is difficult to get a NROTC scholarship to an out-of-state public school. There is a definite logic to this. The Navy is under budget pressure, and you should expect it to make choices that maximize available resources. The Navy can always find a qualified in-state candidate to award a scholarship to, and because of the tuition cost differential he or she will have a definite advantage over an OOS candidate with equal or even superior qualifications. Every scholarship awarded to an OOS student at a public school reduces the total amount of funds available for other scholarships.

To optimize his chances, your DS may want to consider placing BU and Fordham at or near the top of the list, and perhaps swapping in some other private school choices in place of a couple of the OOS public choices. He is a strong candidate for admission at these schools, and because there is no tuition differential he will be competing on an equal footing for a scholarship.
 
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