Dropping NROTC scholarship for advanced standing?

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paragoncats

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Like the title says, is it possible to drop the Navy scholarship and switch to advanced standing?
 
What class year are you? What do you think this buys you? I don't know if it's allowed as I've never heard this question before. I'm just trying to make sense of it because on the surface it doesn't make much sense to me.
 
I must agree with @kinnem — Why would you want to switch to AS? Do you suddenly have a pile of cash to spend? if you do, I could use a new pair of sunglasses!:wiggle:
 
Agreed. I can't see any logic in this path and have never heard of it. The only thing I can think of is that Advanced Standing commissionees have a shorter ADSO, so is that your angle? Since Advanced Standing is only offered to rising 2/c (or in rare cases 1/c), you would have been on scholarship for two years before you could even apply for Advanced Standing, which is past the drop date without repayment. I wouldn't think you could even apply for Advanced Standing while on scholarship. That said, I suppose you could drop a scholarship after your first year, pay your own way for at least one year and apply for Advanced Standing going into your 2/c year. But, why would you do that. And I can't imagine that would look good to your unit and may affect their evaluation and recommendation.
 
OP, trying like others to understand the ask. Can you please clarify? Are you in your first year? Are you on the Navy option (NO) scholarship in year one, and you're looking to switch to Marine Option (MO) and attend OCS on advanced standing in the next two summers, and go active duty? Are you looking to get out of ROTC? Meaning, Basically do you have your tuition / room/ board covered by other scholarships or ultimately you don't care whether you pick up the MO sideload after giving up the NO scholarship and want to know if it's possible to do so? What are your goals /here - please explain so we can try to help. What advantage are you hoping this change will give you?

Yes, you can give up your NO scholarship in year 1 and not owe money back. You can compete for a MO sideload if your goal is to switch. HYour unit may allow you to continue under NO while this is explored - talk to them. You can give up your scholarship and ROTC and go AS to OCS this summer, - well depending on what year you are in.

In case it's not clear OP please clarify your ask so we can try to help. I'm just trying to piece this together on what your ask might be.
 
My guess is that OP does not want to take the Calculus and Physics. If they deem those classes too hard and feel they can not pass the class or get a bad grade and effect the GPA.
 
Good guess, but it seems quite a sacrifice to avoid them. If that's the issue I would try to transfer to Marine Option to avoid them that way.
 
Does AS get a shorter access or path to the GI Bill?
 
Last edited:
USA1962 said:
My guess is that OP does not want to take the Calculus and Physics. If they deem those classes too hard and feel they can not pass the class or get a bad grade and effect the GPA.
Click to expand...
Are college programmers who apply for advanced standing exempt from the physics and calculus requirement?
 
USA1962 said:
Yes. AS do not have to take Physics or Calculus.
Click to expand...
I know this is all speculation as we wait for the poster to respond, but I hope this is not all to avoid taking those two classes.

As a tier 3 major I know it's absolutely terrible taking those classes and sympathize with not wanting to struggle or lower GPA, but it's a grind everyone just has to get through... not worth giving up XYZ dollars in tuition for a few hard classes that will only last a few months out of a 4 year ROTC career.
 
Regardless of reason, I don't understand why anyone would want to give up the scholarship they were awarded and go for AS. Tuition isn't cheap and if you're going to waste a scholarship like that, it should have gone to someone else. If your reasoning is to skip the calc and physics requirements, then I would re-examine your reasons for even being in the program. You're going to encounter much harder things than just two years of calc and physics, especially if you're an engineering major (in which case, the requirements will probably be part of your major). Remember, those classes are just one more wicket you have to hit in order to commission. Not worth giving up a scholarship.
 
Couple of points as food for thought.

Agree with path to explore MO for those who on a NO wish to potentially stay on scholarship but who wish to avoid the Calc/ Physics requirements and can handle the physical / mental aspects of being a Marine leader. You can reapply for the MO scholarship or to pick up a MO sideload. DS' roommate is working through this not due to a problem passing courses - he like his brother now wants to be a Marine.

Posts on this board point out repeatedly that not everyone who wins the Navy (NO) National scholarship reaches commission.

Passing Calc I, Calc II, Physics I, Physics II does thin out the group.
So does NSI (more than 100 dropped at NSI's 2 sessions 2 summers ago) , mechanical injuries, discipline issues, law enforcement issues (underage drinking, mischief et al.), fighting, failed drug tests, failed fitness test, life/ money issues at home for those who pay room/ board or need to go get a job and help put food on the table, GPA, having a baby and again needing to put diapers/ formula/ food on the table, failure to show up at 4:30AM, poor attitude, banned relationship with another specific midshipman from the "wrong" class year.

Of the 1000 scholarships (roughly), how many will make it to commission and serve? I'll bet less than 2/3rds on average - curious if anyone has a report on the overall number of NROTC NO/ MO scholarship recipients who actually commission in the program? Just attended a commissioning virtual ceremony last week - Scholarship or not, look at the pics from day 1 participants to commission day - in some programs it's well over 100 starting and less than 20 finishing. I'll just say that not everyone has the mind to pass Calc II/ Physics II. Great people, talented, athletic, sincere - but the equations look like another language. Water rises to it's own level. I do agree and am a living example that hard work can help overcome a lack of natural talents in some areas, but it's not all hard work sometimes - this is the sobering reality. Also some colleges have a 3 strike rule - you get 3 attempts to pass the course and then strike-3, you're out to try again.

On a quasi-related note did y'all see the scandal with more than 50 West Pointers that were just caught or caught up in a Calc cheating scandal? Look these are top talent young women and men who are "phoning a friend" when that's not allowed.
 
Herman_Snerd said:
On a quasi-related note did y'all see the scandal with more than 50 West Pointers that were just caught or caught up in a Calc cheating scandal? Look these are top talent young women and men who are "phoning a friend" when that's not allowed.
Click to expand...
I posted this in another thread:

Remote learning has proliferated this kind of cheating by making it very easy to do. A NROTC mid at our local state u, who graduated my DS’ high school and who DS knows from NJROTC is currently implicated in what sounds like almost the same thing as that which happened at West Point. The individual involved is a math genius and did not cheat himself but, from what I understand, is accused of helping his fellow Mids cheat in Calculus. From what I am hearing, he may not get a second chance and may lose his 4 yr NROTC scholarship AND get kicked out of school. It’s happening in on-line study in high schools too. A warning to all. Don’t do it!
 
4-35 Change of Option, Scholarship to College Program

As an alternative to disenrollment, Scholarship midshipmen who fail to satisfactorily complete calculus, calculus-based physics, or other program requirements, may contact NSTC OD and request transfer to the College Program following the results of a PRB. This alternative is the only option change available to Nurse Scholarship students who are disenrolled from their Nursing Program. Once the PNS has reviewed and endorsed the PRB, the PNS may favorably endorse the midshipman's request for this change. If the PNS endorses the change request, the PNS must provide NSTC OD4 with the following information and items:

a. The specific reason for the change request (e.g., failure of calculus course and/or physics at least twice);

b. The number of times the student was placed on probation or LOA for academics;
c. The student’s aptitude for Naval Service;
d. The extent of the student’s involvement in unit activities (e.g., battalion commander, squad leader); e. A current transcript;
f. The student’s DCP; and
g. A copy of the most recent PRB with all endorsements.

If the request to change option to the College Program is approved by CNSTC, NSTC OD4 will prepare an Appointment Termination Disenrollment Authorization (NSTC 1533/124) stating the

obligation and enter the appropriate changes into OPMIS. The unit shall ensure the midshipman signs and acknowledges the following Page 13 entry:

“Scholarship students approved for transfer to the College Program who have received more than one year of subsidized education (two semesters/three quarters of tuition and ten months of subsistence), or accepted their scholarship at the beginning of the second or later year of Naval Science and receiving benefits, shall be required to repay the educational benefits they received while enrolled in the NROTC Program if they fail to commission unless otherwise waived.”

Upon receipt of the Appointment Termination, NSTC OD4 will enter the appropriate OPMIS code to change the midshipman's status from Scholarship student to College Program student.

Prior to the start of the junior year, approved students will be transitioned to College Program Basic. If not selected for Advanced Standing, students will be disenrolled. If the student was obligated by their previous scholarship contract, a complete disenrollment package will be sent to OD for processing.

--From the Regulations for Officer Development NSTC M-1533.2C
 
I see this thread is a bit old but I just wanted to make a statement/ask a question about my current situation.

I am a rising 2/C, I was just awarded a 2 year side load. I am a communications major that already has 3 years of school behind me. Being awarded the scholarship has forced me to take additional classes (calc 1 and 2 and calc based physics). These classes would extend me past my original graduation date which would've been 2024 spring (now spring 2025). If you're asking how this is possible, I had an exception made for me to join during my junior year but as a 3/C. With how the previous year went with scholarships and advance standing, we thought I had decent chances for advance standing and not a scholarship. I am trying to see if I can swap to advance standing to finish my degree in time and not have to spend extra unnecessary time in college. I have college paid for with the GI bill so that's not an issue.

Sorry if this has grammar mistakes everywhere, I am stressed out and can't think properly haha.
 
You likely won't read this before going in. And if anyone is wondering what in the world I am doing up at nearly 1AM it's the wonderful world of helping manage Navy shipyards and I was "lucky" enough to have "Duty Dry Dock Officer" during the Hawaii fire mess.

Anyways, you've been awarded a 2 year scholarship but you have the option to decline in lieu of advanced standing. That takes approval by the NSTC Commander. It has been done but there will be questions. First question for your PNS will be whether or not anyone discussed this with you prior to submitting you for the scholarship. If no, your PNS gets the fun follow up question of "Why not?" And that question comes because it is very hard (read that as next to impossible) to reallocate the scholarship monies to another candidate once you shift to advanced standing. And that means there was a former Midshipman somewhere who was told they were not selected and to turn in their uniforms because they can't be part of NROTC anymore.

Not sure if you knew that but it's something to think about. As a former PNS, I always do an interview before sending in a recommendation for that reason.....people's desires change.

Good luck in your discussion.
 
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