Advice and Switching from NROTC to ROTC

[Kanogo]

Hello. I'm a freshman and MIDN 4/C in university currently on a 4-year NROTC Scholarship. My intended major (Public Affairs and History) has absolutely nothing to do with STEM and I have zero interest in calculus and physics; when I realized that I must complete certain calculus and physics requirements to satisfy NROTC, I became really discouraged. I recently completed my first quarter of calculus 1 (which went horribly), and I concluded that doing another semester of calculus and two more semesters of physics will be detrimental to my GPA because I just can't do these classes successfully. This is a problem because I want to go to a good graduate school program.
As much as I have always wanted to serve in the navy, I don't want to commit myself to studying these STEM courses I am uninterested in with fear that I will do bad in. I've been doing my due diligence on the other branches, service communities, and ROTC programs because I still want to serve, and the army has begun to appeal to me more-- I also like the fact that I only have to satisfy military science requirements in terms of my classes which means I can focus more on my major and topics that I am interested in.

The things that hold me back from switching out of NROTC to a different ROTC program is the fear of losing scholarship money (which I really need), and the potential of not being able to secure a scholarship if I apply. Also, I have made some really strong friendships and connections at my NROTC unit which compromises the social aspect for me.

Any advice and help would be much appreciated here

 

[Capt MJ]

Figure out the long pole in your tent and reverse engineer from there. Sort must do - nice to do/have - will not/don’t want to do. You will have to make adult cost-benefit decisions to move forward; there is legwork and critical thinking to be done.

Easy stuff - you can keep up with friends you made in NROTC. Something to keep in mind over the long haul of your life: You will have friends for a reason, friends for a season, and friends for a lifetime. Think about it. You have a lifetime ahead of being social, meeting new people and making friends. You will figure out which categories people fall into.

Your STEM classes: Clearly, you did something right in HS to win a 4-year NROTCscholarship, including HS STEM classes. It is will or skill that you lack? Be honest with yourself. College courses are meant to be hard. (All questions rhetorical in this post.)

The Navy scholarship and the money. I believe you can use the 4-year Navy scholarship for 1 year, no obligation, and then withdraw with no penalty before you start sophomore year. If you chose a school you cannot afford without the scholarship, that is a high-risk strategy. If you can’t afford to attend there without it, you may have to look at other options. I am not a fan of student loans, so it’s a possible transfer.

Getting out of NROTC: If you want out of NROTC, you have a precise window to do that in. Do not procrastinate if you are going to withdraw. In the meantime, triple-down on the required courses, so you don’t find yourself in academic trouble and having your scholarship suspended. You should be taking advantage of peer tutoring, office hours, campus academic skills center. Assess your online fun time, social media use, social friend time with a cold and analytical eye and improve your prioritization and choices.

Going AROTC: First and foremost, be sure you want to serve as an Army officer and there are branches that interest you and you could see yourself serving in. Don’t do magical thinking and let your STEM-evasion tendencies cause that magical thinking.

Magical thinking: The Navy expects its leaders to be tech-savvy leaders. The required classes are laid out on the NROTC website, in the FAQ section, and on every random NROTC individual unit website I checked. You are paying the price for lacking attention to detail, but it’s a valuable life lesson. You should be reading every page, link, menu item on the Army ROTC main website and AROTC units of interest.

Army scholarship and the money: If there is an AROTC unit at the school, go talk to them with explicit questions. You won’t be the first person they have encountered to want to transfer out or in. Are there crosstown affiliates nearby which are more affordable? Or back home? How does their college programmer program work? When can you apply for local scholarships? What is the timing on transfers?

Your NROTC chain of command: I mention them last, but you should have conversations about your challenges and exploratory thinking with the appropriate member of the chain of command. They should not be surprised by any oops STEM class performance. If you want their help and understanding, you should be leaning into being a good mid and hard-working student.

Paging @GWU PNS our resident active PNS for the expert gouge.


P.S. F you had any thought of becoming a military Public Affairs Officer, the Navy gets those though direct commissioning and OCS programs.

Become a Navy Public Affairs Officer (2025)

This guide provides information that will help you with your decision to become a Navy Public Affairs Officer during Fiscal Year 2025.

navalofficerrecruiter.com

 

[GWU PNS (emeritus)]

Figure out the long pole in your tent and reverse engineer from there. Sort must do - nice to do/have - will not/don’t want to do. You will have to make adult cost-benefit decisions to move forward; there is legwork and critical thinking to be done.

Easy stuff - you can keep up with friends you made in NROTC. Something to keep in mind over the long haul of your life: You will have friends for a reason, friends for a season, and friends for a lifetime. Think about it. You have a lifetime ahead of being social, meeting new people and making friends. You will figure out which categories people fall into.

Your STEM classes: Clearly, you did something right in HS to win a 4-year NROTCscholarship, including HS STEM classes. It is will or skill that you lack? Be honest with yourself. College courses are meant to be hard. (All questions rhetorical in this post.)

The Navy scholarship and the money. I believe you can use the 4-year Navy scholarship for 1 year, no obligation, and then withdraw with no penalty before you start sophomore year. If you chose a school you cannot afford without the scholarship, that is a high-risk strategy. If you can’t afford to attend there without it, you may have to look at other options. I am not a fan of student loans, so it’s a possible transfer.

Getting out of NROTC: If you want out of NROTC, you have a precise window to do that in. Do not procrastinate if you are going to withdraw. In the meantime, triple-down on the required courses, so you don’t find yourself in academic trouble and having your scholarship suspended. You should be taking advantage of peer tutoring, office hours, campus academic skills center. Assess your online fun time, social media use, social friend time with a cold and analytical eye and improve your prioritization and choices.

Going AROTC: First and foremost, be sure you want to serve as an Army officer and there are branches that interest you and you could see yourself serving in. Don’t do magical thinking and let your STEM-evasion tendencies cause that magical thinking.

Magical thinking: The Navy expects its leaders to be tech-savvy leaders. The required classes are laid out on the NROTC website, in the FAQ section, and on every random NROTC individual unit website I checked. You are paying the price for lacking attention to detail, but it’s a valuable life lesson. You should be reading every page, link, menu item on the Army ROTC main website and AROTC units of interest.

Army scholarship and the money: If there is an AROTC unit at the school, go talk to them with explicit questions. You won’t be the first person they have encountered to want to transfer out or in. Are there crosstown affiliates nearby which are more affordable? Or back home? How does their college programmer program work? When can you apply for local scholarships? What is the timing on transfers?

Your NROTC chain of command: I mention them last, but you should have conversations about your challenges and exploratory thinking with the appropriate member of the chain of command. They should not be surprised by any oops STEM class performance. If you want their help and understanding, you should be leaning into being a good mid and hard-working student.

Paging @GWU PNS our resident active PNS for the expert gouge.


P.S. F you had any thought of becoming a military Public Affairs Officer, the Navy gets those though direct commissioning and OCS programs.

Become a Navy Public Affairs Officer (2025)

This guide provides information that will help you with your decision to become a Navy Public Affairs Officer during Fiscal Year 2025.

navalofficerrecruiter.com

To piggy back on Capt MJ's post, I am not sure how the calculus and physics requirements surprised you or caught you off guard. Perhaps you have selective memory but those requirements are spelled out clearly on unit and the NETFOCUS websites.

Most units offer tutoring at no cost and hopefully your unit does that. You say you did horribly.....does that mean you failed? If so, you were likely placed on academic probation. Generally speaking my advice to MIDN 4/C is to not take calc or physics in their first semester unless they are a Tier 1 major and they are confident in their math and physics skills. There are just a lot of transition life changing things going on in the mind of an 18 year old.

Have you spoken with senior members of your unit? How about speaking with anyone from an AROTC unit? If they think you are looking for them just because NROTC isn't working out they may not be interested.

Bottom line is you aren't happy where you are because the classes are hard. You're not sure of shifting to Army because you need the scholarship money.

Trying to be nice here but I think you need some "tough love". Navy needs technically skilled people. We make no secret about that whatsoever. Calc and physics aren't impossible classes unless you lack the maturity to focus.

You had a bad semester......got it. Go to your unit and ask for help. Find a tutor and consider taking calc I over the summer. As Capt MJ mentioned, you can do your spring semester on scholarship and then drop with no payback required. If you keep failing things then the scholarship will go away anyway. It's time to meet your issues head on and not vacillate too much or you will just get yourself into a tougher situation.

 

[Capt MJ]

To piggy back on Capt MJ's post, I am not sure how the calculus and physics requirements surprised you or caught you off guard. Perhaps you have selective memory but those requirements are spelled out clearly on unit and the NETFOCUS websites.

Most units offer tutoring at no cost and hopefully your unit does that. You say you did horribly.....does that mean you failed? If so, you were likely placed on academic probation. Generally speaking my advice to MIDN 4/C is to not take calc or physics in their first semester unless they are a Tier 1 major and they are confident in their math and physics skills. There are just a lot of transition life changing things going on in the mind of an 18 year old.

Have you spoken with senior members of your unit? How about speaking with anyone from an AROTC unit? If they think you are looking for them just because NROTC isn't working out they may not be interested.

Bottom line is you aren't happy where you are because the classes are hard. You're not sure of shifting to Army because you need the scholarship money.

Trying to be nice here but I think you need some "tough love". Navy needs technically skilled people. We make no secret about that whatsoever. Calc and physics aren't impossible classes unless you lack the maturity to focus.

You had a bad semester......got it. Go to your unit and ask for help. Find a tutor and consider taking calc I over the summer. As Capt MJ mentioned, you can do your spring semester on scholarship and then drop with no payback required. If you keep failing things then the scholarship will go away anyway. It's time to meet your issues head on and not vacillate too much or you will just get yourself into a tougher situation.

Bookmark-worthy, shipmate.

 

[Impulsive]

Hello. I'm a freshman and MIDN 4/C in university currently on a 4-year NROTC Scholarship. My intended major (Public Affairs and History) has absolutely nothing to do with STEM and I have zero interest in calculus and physics; when I realized that I must complete certain calculus and physics requirements to satisfy NROTC, I became really discouraged. I recently completed my first quarter of calculus 1 (which went horribly), and I concluded that doing another semester of calculus and two more semesters of physics will be detrimental to my GPA because I just can't do these classes successfully. This is a problem because I want to go to a good graduate school program.
As much as I have always wanted to serve in the navy, I don't want to commit myself to studying these STEM courses I am uninterested in with fear that I will do bad in. I've been doing my due diligence on the other branches, service communities, and ROTC programs because I still want to serve, and the army has begun to appeal to me more-- I also like the fact that I only have to satisfy military science requirements in terms of my classes which means I can focus more on my major and topics that I am interested in.

The things that hold me back from switching out of NROTC to a different ROTC program is the fear of losing scholarship money (which I really need), and the potential of not being able to secure a scholarship if I apply. Also, I have made some really strong friendships and connections at my NROTC unit which compromises the social aspect for me.

Any advice and help would be much appreciated here

Another option for you is (I Think) getting your degree without Military money (ie: an academic scholarship or student loans), then apply Restricted Line Direct Commission (where you may not have the STEM requirements to do Public Affairs). @Capt MJ, or @GWU PMS can probably advise better. But if you are looking for the military to pay for college, and according to your post Grad School, you need to make some tough decisions, and base those decisions on where you want to end up. In life you don't usually get something for nothing, if you use military funding, you will owe the military, and that may require working harder than you anticipate, and even doing some jobs in your quest that you really don't want to do in order to get where you eventually want. Taking the Scholarship will usually cost you five years active duty, then if you get Grad School paid for it is usually 2 for 1 meaning a Masters will cost you four more years AD, and NO Guarantee you get what or where you want for all those years.

Direct Commission is usually only three years (I think for most specialties), so if you do six years AD, you get the full GI BILL and Grad School paid for without service obligation, meaning you can do what you want much earlier.

Another option is go enlisted, get guaranteed Public Affairs School, serve your four years doing what you want and taking correspondence courses while you serve to get your BA/BS, then get out after four with full GI BILL benefits and attend Grad School wherever you want without obligation. Then you can always try and Commission as a Direct Commission or OCS if you feel you want to go back and serve.

 

[justdoit19]

Great advice already.

Here is my Mom advice: if you were mine, I would tell you to buckle down and get through this next semester. Signing up for all tutoring help available. You CAN do it, bc you are a national scholarship winner. You were selected bc you have the ability to do so.

You already KNEW that those classes are required. Bc you applied in the first place. There is absolutely no secret those classes are required. That’s on you, so don’t use it as an excuse. Buckle down and meet the challenge.

Stop imagining how awful it will be to take those classes. It’s 3 more semesters. Of the rest of your life. Big deal. We all have to do hard stuff we don’t want to. Our whole lives. Figure a plan to get through it. Don’t accept NOT doing them as an option. Also, look at how much 3 (or more??) years of schooling will cost you. Is that worth making life more comfortable for you by not having to take the classes? There is a cost/benefit to EVERY choice/decisions.

A bird in hand is worth two in the bush. Period. You may not want to pursue more schooling. My son was sure he would. Time came, and he was DONE WITH SCHOOL! And, you may not fit with the Army (and they may not want you, as a 2nd choice to get through school as already discussed).

And lastly, college is hard. It’s different than high school. A ‘C’ in college, is different than a C in high school. And as a national winner, I suspect you are used to A’s. Imo, everyone I’ve been involved with over the years, has had to adjust their GPA expectation a bit. Sometimes quite a bit.

That’s what I would say to my own kiddo. Or their friends. I’m a ‘tough love ‘ kind of parent. If you were saying that the military wasn’t ‘for you’, I would Mom advise differently. But you are talking about throwing something amazing away, for 3 more semesters of classes.

Freshman year is a huge culture/academic/growth shock to the system. When you are a senior, looking back, don’t regret a choice you made, that you wish you hadn’t.

That’s my Mom advice.

 

[Kanogo]

Figure out the long pole in your tent and reverse engineer from there. Sort must do - nice to do/have - will not/don’t want to do. You will have to make adult cost-benefit decisions to move forward; there is legwork and critical thinking to be done.

Easy stuff - you can keep up with friends you made in NROTC. Something to keep in mind over the long haul of your life: You will have friends for a reason, friends for a season, and friends for a lifetime. Think about it. You have a lifetime ahead of being social, meeting new people and making friends. You will figure out which categories people fall into.

Your STEM classes: Clearly, you did something right in HS to win a 4-year NROTCscholarship, including HS STEM classes. It is will or skill that you lack? Be honest with yourself. College courses are meant to be hard. (All questions rhetorical in this post.)

The Navy scholarship and the money. I believe you can use the 4-year Navy scholarship for 1 year, no obligation, and then withdraw with no penalty before you start sophomore year. If you chose a school you cannot afford without the scholarship, that is a high-risk strategy. If you can’t afford to attend there without it, you may have to look at other options. I am not a fan of student loans, so it’s a possible transfer.

Getting out of NROTC: If you want out of NROTC, you have a precise window to do that in. Do not procrastinate if you are going to withdraw. In the meantime, triple-down on the required courses, so you don’t find yourself in academic trouble and having your scholarship suspended. You should be taking advantage of peer tutoring, office hours, campus academic skills center. Assess your online fun time, social media use, social friend time with a cold and analytical eye and improve your prioritization and choices.

Going AROTC: First and foremost, be sure you want to serve as an Army officer and there are branches that interest you and you could see yourself serving in. Don’t do magical thinking and let your STEM-evasion tendencies cause that magical thinking.

Magical thinking: The Navy expects its leaders to be tech-savvy leaders. The required classes are laid out on the NROTC website, in the FAQ section, and on every random NROTC individual unit website I checked. You are paying the price for lacking attention to detail, but it’s a valuable life lesson. You should be reading every page, link, menu item on the Army ROTC main website and AROTC units of interest.

Army scholarship and the money: If there is an AROTC unit at the school, go talk to them with explicit questions. You won’t be the first person they have encountered to want to transfer out or in. Are there crosstown affiliates nearby which are more affordable? Or back home? How does their college programmer program work? When can you apply for local scholarships? What is the timing on transfers?

Your NROTC chain of command: I mention them last, but you should have conversations about your challenges and exploratory thinking with the appropriate member of the chain of command. They should not be surprised by any oops STEM class performance. If you want their help and understanding, you should be leaning into being a good mid and hard-working student.

Paging @GWU PNS our resident active PNS for the expert gouge.


P.S. F you had any thought of becoming a military Public Affairs Officer, the Navy gets those though direct commissioning and OCS programs.

Become a Navy Public Affairs Officer (2025)

This guide provides information that will help you with your decision to become a Navy Public Affairs Officer during Fiscal Year 2025.

navalofficerrecruiter.com

Thank you for your in-depth response. Just to clarify, is it possible to get a three-year Army ROTC Scholarship for people like me looking to potentially switch into Army ROTC from a current ROTC program?

 

[FastFood44]

I was tier three, political science. absolutely HATED the physics and calc, and got terrible grades (close to failing for physics 1 and 2, decimated my GPA for the first 1.5 years). I was in a cross town unit, where I was the *only* Tier 3 major out of ~100 MIDN. I felt like a failure as everyone around me easily excelled in their Calc and physics classes.

With that said... I buckled down. I had aspirations to go to flight school and I had a 4 year ROTC scholarships to one of the most expensive schools in the country that offered ROTC. In my head, I was NOT going to let 4 classes, over the 40+ classes I would take over my four years in college, stop me from achieving my dream. I laser focused on these classes, went to the free tutoring provided by ROTC for the maximum 10 hours a week they hired the tutor for, and dropped 2 clubs temporarily so I could focus on my STEM classes.

I know commissioning may seem far off, but keep your eyes on the prize. Grind through the second calc class, and future 2 physics class, you are capable of achieving more than you believe. In my case, I had a low GPA my first two years due to these classes (I think I was number 14 rank out of 16 MIDN in my class), but then achieved a perfect 4.0 during my last two years of school, and got the flight school slot I wanted, while being awarded the CNO's Distinguished Midshipman Graduate Award and getting to go to grad school for the Navy.

Especially because you mentioned finances is a concern, dropping NROTC would seem like the extremely unwise decision. You will see that when service selection comes around, GPA is not NEARLY the end all be all, as you will be looking at SWO/NFO/Pilot most likely.

I have talked to countless of MIDN about this over the past 5 years on this thread, about this very same issue, being Tier 3 and taking STEM classes. You got this. Buckle up and power through, the classes will be over before you know it.

 

[Capt MJ]

I was tier three, political science. absolutely HATED the physics and calc, and got terrible grades (close to failing for physics 1 and 2, decimated my GPA for the first 1.5 years). I was in a cross town unit, where I was the *only* Tier 3 major out of ~100 MIDN. I felt like a failure as everyone around me easily excelled in their Calc and physics classes.

With that said... I buckled down. I had aspirations to go to flight school and I had a 4 year ROTC scholarships to one of the most expensive schools in the country that offered ROTC. In my head, I was NOT going to let 4 classes, over the 40+ classes I would take over my four years in college, stop me from achieving my dream. I laser focused on these classes, went to the free tutoring provided by ROTC for the maximum 10 hours a week they hired the tutor for, and dropped 2 clubs temporarily so I could focus on my STEM classes.

I know commissioning may seem far off, but keep your eyes on the prize. Grind through the second calc class, and future 2 physics class, you are capable of achieving more than you believe. In my case, I had a low GPA my first two years due to these classes (I think I was number 14 rank out of 16 MIDN in my class), but then achieved a perfect 4.0 during my last two years of school, and got the flight school slot I wanted, while being awarded the CNO's Distinguished Midshipman Graduate Award and getting to go to grad school for the Navy.

Especially because you mentioned finances is a concern, dropping NROTC would seem like the extremely unwise decision. You will see that when service selection comes around, GPA is not NEARLY the end all be all, as you will be looking at SWO/NFO/Pilot most likely.

I have talked to countless of MIDN about this over the past 5 years on this thread, about this very same issue, being Tier 3 and taking STEM classes. You got this. Buckle up and power through, the classes will be over before you know it.

Superb peer coaching and advice.

 

[JohnMcLane]

You can power through calc and physics if you put in the effort and round up and utilize the resources available. Your big question is what would you like to picture yourself doing 5 years from now?

I was a mech engineering major (Army ROTC scholarship). I hit a wall with a class called Engineering Physics Taught by a USAFA F-4 driver. Busted my hump and struggled to get a "C". When I talked to my professor about dropping the class and changing majors he told me that he, the professor now teaching the course, had also struggled and barely passed this very same class in college. I found that encouraging in a weird way.

That said, the only reason I was an engineering major was that my big brother had been an engineering major. I never had any intent to use an engineering degree for anything, ever. Especially as I just wanted to be an infantry officer. I ultimately changed majors and was happier and don't regret it. I was able to do this because I saw myself happier being waist-deep in a Georgia swamp at 0200 in the morning being eaten alive by mosquitoes than fiddling with a calculator. You have to decide who you are and what you want to be. No matter what you do you'll have to suffer through pain and hardship to get there. That is part of your personal development.