alcohol question

A

ap19

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I am confused about how to answer the alcohol question on the application. The questions seem to be more about alcohol abuse as opposed to alcohol use. I am not dependent on alcohol nor have I ever been drunk or had any "misconduct or unacceptable behavior; to the impairment of work performance, physical or mental health, financial responsibility or personal relationships" because of alcohol. I did, however, have wine legally when I was with my parents at dinner when we went along with my dad on his business trip to Europe, but there was no impairment and certainly no misconduct. I don't drink otherwise. The application asks "Have you ever experimented with, used, or possessed any illegal drug or narcotic?" Alcohol is not listed in the definition as an illegal drug, but the definition also has a list that says "includes but not limited to" which could mean other things like alcohol. Does anyone know if they consider alcohol to be a drug so even one time use requires a "yes" answer? Am I over-thinking this? I would think there would be a more direct question like there is for marijuana use, but there is not.
 
Yes, you are overthinking this. Answer truthfully, according to the instructions given. Don’t try to game the system. Don’t try to shade your answer. Just be honest and move on.
 
That is exactly what I am trying to do -- answer truthfully. I am not trying to game anything. I don't abuse alcohol. The occasion with my parents was in a legal setting, but I don't know if that matters or not. There is no direct question like there is for marijuana -- ie. have you ever had an alcoholic drink. If they consider alcohol to be a drug, then any use -- even one time -- could conceivably fall under that question. I am asking how others have interpreted what is being asked because I want to be honest.
 
They honestly just want to know if you've abused alcohol to the point where you've needed treatment or gotten caught up in some misconduct. Trust me, if they wanted to know the details of individual consumption, they would ask more directly, like they do with marijuana or other substances.

You'll find that even when you are of age, your alcohol consumption really only interests the military/clearance investigators if you're known as a drunk and/or get caught up in some misconduct. Good on you for wanting to be honest, but just answer the questions they ask.
 
BlahuKahuna said:
They honestly just want to know if you've abused alcohol to the point where you've needed treatment or gotten caught up in some misconduct. Trust me, if they wanted to know the details of individual consumption, they would ask more directly, like they do with marijuana or other substances.

You'll find that even when you are of age, your alcohol consumption really only interests the military/clearance investigators if you're known as a drunk and/or get caught up in some misconduct. Good on you for wanting to be honest, but just answer the questions they ask.
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That's what I was thinking, but didn't want to get tripped up later. Trying to err on the right side of things.
 
If you drank alcohol in a legal setting, that makes it legal. Please, please don’t overthink this.
 
It asked about abuse if you never abused substances such as alcohol then put no you answered the question when you asked the forum.
"I have never been drunk or abused alcohol" they are not going to mind if you had a glass of wine with your parent. If you have abused it or done drugs then you would say yes. saying yes now will trip you up.
 
Alcohol is not considered a drug or illicit substance, from a legal perspective.
 
I have taken cough syrup that had codine in it. I don’t think they were talking about either and codine is a narcotic
 
Here is the answer I will give you as an ALO.

The form that you will fill out is AF Form 2030: "USAF DRUG AND ALCOHOL ABUSE CERTIFICATE."

Here is what the AF defines as "Alcohol Abuse."

"ALCOHOL ABUSE: NOTE: When not confirmed by medical authority, self-admitted alcohol use that leads to a person's misconduct or unacceptable behavior; to the impairment of work performance, physical or mental health, financial responsibility or personal relationships; must be reported during the medical examination for determination of alcohol abuse. Alcohol use confirmed by competent medical authority that the individual is emotionally, mentally, or physically dependent on alcohol."

Right below that it explains what "Drug Abuse" is:

"DRUG ABUSE: The illegal, wrongful, or improper use of marijuana, any narcotic substance, hallucinogens, or any illegal drug."
***added by me***
Remember, marijuana is an illegal drug per federal law; which trumps state laws that say its legal for recreational use. Also...no state allows minors to use marijuana, even those that have "legalized" it.

Now...re-read what they say. If any of that applies, then your answer is "YES." If they don't apply...don't overthink this.

Steve
USAFA ALO
USAFA '83
 
I am right now completing this part of the application. I have had a few sips of alcohol before at prom and homecoming parties… I have never abused alcohol before even closely. Should I not be signing this form then because I have technically had some alcohol before? Please I need insight
 
There is a long tradition of drinking and abusing alcohol in the military.

So much so that somebody was motivated enough to create this patch:

IMG_2048.jpeg



To resemble the Air Mobility Command patch.

A classmate / squadron-mate of mine won one of our much coveted 225 pilot slots.

He pissed it away by going into Mexico twice and getting plastered off his butt and then trying to cross back into the US. Both times, his commanding officer had to retrieve him from the Mexican police.

The answer you seek is a “NO!”

A very hard and stern “NO!” at this stage of your game.

Jut be advised that if you do get accepted to USAFA and do become a cadet, there are AOC’s ( or whatever they are calling them now) who having nothing better to do than to hide, yes, literally hide in the bushes at the base of Vandy or Sijan, and catch 2 degrees and 3 degrees coming back from a night of drinking.
 
ZoomieFrom1994 said:
There is a long tradition of drinking and abusing alcohol in the military.

So much so that somebody was motivated enough to create this patch:

View attachment 19400



To resemble the Air Mobility Command patch.

A classmate / squadron-mate of mine won one of our much coveted 225 pilot slots.

He pissed it away by going into Mexico twice and getting plastered off his butt and then trying to cross back into the US. Both times, his commanding officer had to retrieve him from the Mexican police.

The answer you seek is a “NO!”

A very hard and stern “NO!” at this stage of your game.

Jut be advised that if you do get accepted to USAFA and do become a cadet, there are AOC’s ( or whatever they are calling them now) who having nothing better to do than to hide, yes, literally hide in the bushes at the base of Vandy or Sijan, and catch 2 degrees and 3 degrees coming back from a night of drinking.
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So to be clear. I should sign the form right. I haven’t ever abused alcohol before which I think the form is asking. I’ve had a bit before under circumstances like prom but never addiction…
 
🤦

Btw, does anyone ask their parents first for their thoughts before asking questions in this forum? I get there are military specific questions people may not know, but many things could be answered by parents.
 
AirFHopeful2030 said:
I have had a few sips of alcohol before at prom and homecoming parties…
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A few sips.....? If you've done it, own it. This reminds me of a past President who claimed to have tried Marijuana but didn't inhale.

I know times have changed, but nobody is going to hold experimenting with social drinking against you--even if underage. It's only a problem when it becomes a problem, ie. once you get to Service Academy and their are regulations against underage drinking, or once legal, you make stupid decisions while drinking. Solely my opinion, and probably not popular in the current military culture, but I'd rather that Cadets and Midshipmen be permitted to drink (and learn from their mistakes) in a controlled environment before they are let loose to the Fleet.
 
AirFHopeful2030 said:
So to be clear. I should sign the form right. I haven’t ever abused alcohol before which I think the form is asking. I’ve had a bit before under circumstances like prom but never addiction…
Click to expand...
To answer your question, the answer is “NO!”

I think I might still have a copy of the DSM IV around here somewhere.

The underlying premise for just about all the conditions listed in the DSM is:

“Does it affect your daily living?”

Or

“Does it affect your day to day life?”

And I think that is what the Academy related questions are alluding to.

The other way I like to put it is:

“Do you control your drinking….or does your drinking control you?”

Let’s say that you do make it to USAFA, graduate /commission, and so on and so forth, just in general as a part of life, you will cross paths with alcoholics, recovering alcoholics, and addicts of other substances. That’s life.

As a side note, the classmate / squadron-mate I mentioned above who flushed his UPT slot down the drain….well, he had a roommate our 2 degree year who got caught with a fake ID. His dad was a 1960 something USAFA grad, He was also the wing commander at Eglin (F-15’s), and was friends with the Commandant of Cadets. This roommate was a soaring IP, and just an all around stud. He looked like a shoe-in for one of our 225 pilot slots and/or a Euro-NATO slot. But he liked drinking so much, he just had to get a fake ID and use it. He resigned before any Honor proceedings took place. He wanted to save his “wing king” father the embarrassment.

So, there are two very anecdotal experiences of cadets / junior officers who pissed away very promising careers over booze.

:-/
 
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