Any truth to the rumor?

[MohawkArmyROTC]

So every school is being affected by the shrinking scholarship budget and decreasing commissions? What happens if DS doesn't get a campus scholarship by junior year? Will he have to quit ROTC?

No, a scholarship is not required in order to commission. It is an additional benefit if awarded. The general goal is to have 80% of the commission mission on a scholarship. Realistically, going forward, that goal most likely will not be met.

 

[Anguswarrior112]

I don't have the drawdown per year, however we have recently decreased to 5900 commissions from 6000. The expectation is that we will drop down to 5300 - 5800 commission per year, over the next few years. Scholarship budget has already been decreased for FY22.

Any idea why the commission mission is decreasing?

 

[MohawkArmyROTC]

Any idea why the commission mission is decreasing?

Commission mission is based on retention rates and number of slots available/end strength of Army. I don't' have visibility of those numbers, only that they are affecting the commission mission. The number varies by year. In 2014, the commission mission was only 5300.

 

[MD dd Dad]

From this article
"Programs that decrease include the United States Naval Academy, Naval Postgraduate School, and Naval War College... Other educational funding efforts are growing. For example, the Navy wants to increase funding for the Reserve Officers Training Corps and the Naval Community College"

Navy aims to reduce end strength, cut higher education funding in new budget request

But the sea service wants to significantly boost spending on mental health programs and sexual assault prevention and response.

www.navytimes.com

 

[LookinUpMom]

So, my DD friend spoke to his ROO at his prospective college and was told that b/c of the current administration and the fact that Biden wants to defund the military, that there will be significantly Less or NO campus based ROTC scholarships.... Does anyone know if this is accurate?

My son is a 4 yr natl winner and the college he will attend in the fall reached out and said they have 3 yr campus-based ones available and to tell qualified friends.

 

[obaad5]

what school?

 

[Impulsive]

Just something to keep in mind.....ROTC of any kind can and sometimes does change. Scholarships can and may change or become very limited. ROTC used to be just that, RESERVE Officers Training Corps with all grads being issued "Reserve Commissions". It wasn't until I think the NDAA of 2005 that it became the norm for ROTC grads to get AD Commissions. Don't count on anything, plan your education based on what you can afford or what you want to take loans to pay for. Don't base your choice on ROTC Scholarships for expensive private or out of state schools unless noyour state offers what you want ot study, and even then try and find the best deal based on financial aid from the school. Unless you get Merit Based Aid or have a 529 Plan, ALWAYS have a backup plan when dealing with expensive out of state or private schools. As @Airborne1030 clearly stated things change, standing military strengths are adjusted, and a lot of good people end up RIF'd. Normally the first looked at during any reduction in force are ROTC grads, the Academy people usually get some preference.

Campus and even National Scholarships can change, as to number, funding amounts allowed, and types of Commissions depending on the needs of the country and the funding provided by the NDAA. Good advice by many here is not to find yourself in a hole over money if you don't have to, a Commission from State U is the same one as from MIT or Harvard, they both get you where you want to be. Of more importance is what you do AFTER Commissioning and during AD. JMHO..

 

[Day-Tripper]

Just something to keep in mind.....ROTC of any kind can and sometimes does change. Scholarships can and may change or become very limited. ROTC used to be just that, RESERVE Officers Training Corps with all grads being issued "Reserve Commissions". It wasn't until I think the NDAA of 2005 that it became the norm for ROTC grads to get AD Commissions. Don't count on anything, plan your education based on what you can afford or what you want to take loans to pay for. Don't base your choice on ROTC Scholarships for expensive private or out of state schools unless noyour state offers what you want ot study, and even then try and find the best deal based on financial aid from the school. Unless you get Merit Based Aid or have a 529 Plan, ALWAYS have a backup plan when dealing with expensive out of state or private schools. As @Airborne1030 clearly stated things change, standing military strengths are adjusted, and a lot of good people end up RIF'd. Normally the first looked at during any reduction in force are ROTC grads, the Academy people usually get some preference.

Campus and even National Scholarships can change, as to number, funding amounts allowed, and types of Commissions depending on the needs of the country and the funding provided by the NDAA. Good advice by many here is not to find yourself in a hole over money if you don't have to, a Commission from State U is the same one as from MIT or Harvard, they both get you where you want to be. Of more importance is what you do AFTER Commissioning and during AD. JMHO..

Don't forget that some ROTC accessions are for actual Reserve/National Guard officers, though active duty is clearly the majority & the preference of most collegiate ROTC cadets.

There's lots of scholarship opportunities in the Reserve/Guard (SMP, DEDNG, GRFD, Minuteman, other state-based programs) for those willing to commit to being a reserve officer. Often, getting a reserve scholarship is easier than an active duty one. The Reserves & Guard are always hard up in getting new officers. Being a Reserve/Guard officer offers its own challenges, of course, i.e. juggling a full time job with part-time military duties which often are more than the "one weekend a month" promised by recruiters.

 

[FutureAFDad]

I know this conversation is older and quiet now however seeing it for the first time. Seems pretty inexcusable that someone connected to an ROTC detachment would claim a president 'wants to defund the military.' As stated earlier in the thread, even with flat budgets or increases the allocation to each branch can shift from one to the other. Standing up Space Force under Air Force meant/means Army, and Navy, are very likely losing some funds. Where Army and Navy had personal under their branch working part of the mission the Space Force now does, those 'people' and the budget for those 'people', is now the Space Force's. There are likely other reasons the Army looks to be readjusting budget and taking from ROTC scholarship program and it's far from defunding the overall military. Yikes.

 

[kinnem]

You're correct that Space Force is under the Air Force. However it is a combined force. I know people in Army and Navy who are in Space Force.

 

[Capt MJ]

You're correct that Space Force is under the Air Force. However it is a combined force. I know people in Army and Navy who are in Space Force.

Similar to other joint commands, I believe you can be assigned to Space Force but still be in your own service.

Or, you can request an actual inter-service transfer.

USSF Transfer

 

[ders_dad]

My wife (the Uber-Trekker) was disappointed that Space Force didn’t adopt Navy ranks.

 

[ghostwritergirl]

An interesting article I saw on another post:

https://www.sacbee.com/news/news-services/article251872413.html

 

[franknd]

It is hard to do in some areas! If we had stayed in our old state then tuition at a school with AF ROTC could be covered by a summer job and a pell grant. In our current state it seems like most of the schools are private colleges or they don't accept transfers from a community college. Ds doesn't have a scholarship but even just funding one semester at a private school or out of state tuition in hopes of getting one would leave him with crazy high loans.

Just learned of another military-related tuition discount. Michigan State offers in-state tuition to dependents of honorably discharged veterans.

Students who meet any of the following standards will receive in-state tuition:

A student who, or whose spouse, or parent in the case of a dependent student:
(1) is serving on active duty in the United States Uniformed Services;
(2) is serving in the guard or reserves in one of those reserve components; or
(3) has received an honorable discharge from one of those Services or reserve components.

MSU RO: Regulations for Qualifying for In-State Tuition

 

[NorincoHater]

We can only hope that defense, something that is budgetarily allocated by Congress decades in advance, continues to hold fast against the tidal waves of anti-militaristic and anti-American sentiments...hopefully ROTC holds strong, I cannot honestly see how in such short time its budget may be substantially reduced.

 

[glen]

We can only hope that defense, something that is budgetarily allocated by Congress decades in advance, continues to hold fast against the tidal waves of anti-militaristic and anti-American sentiments...hopefully ROTC holds strong, I cannot honestly see how in such short time its budget may be substantially reduced.

“waves of anti-militaristic and anti-American sentiments.” perhaps you have been watching too much cable news or reading QAnon conspiracies…? The only anti-American sentiments I have seen have been those of the rioters on Jan 6, who took over the Capital. The reduction in ROTC scholarships and commission numbers reflects the fact there are too many officers remaining on active duty due to the Pandemic. It also reflects the changing nature of our military missions around the world.

 

[NorincoHater]

“waves of anti-militaristic and anti-American sentiments.” perhaps you have been watching too much cable news or reading QAnon conspiracies…? The only anti-American sentiments I have seen have been those of the rioters on Jan 6, who took over the Capital. The reduction in ROTC scholarships and commission numbers reflects the fact there are too many officers remaining on active duty due to the Pandemic. It also reflects the changing nature of our military missions around the world.

Fair point, and I hope that's so.

No need for any targeted insinuations or politicized commentary there, I don't get my news from any cable source at all for that matter, and I merely asserted that on the basis of history building itself since the countercultural revolution that began in the 1960s.

 

[Day-Tripper]

We can only hope that defense, something that is budgetarily allocated by Congress decades in advance, continues to hold fast against the tidal waves of anti-militaristic and anti-American sentiments...hopefully ROTC holds strong, I cannot honestly see how in such short time its budget may be substantially reduced.

Well I certainly hope the United States remains an anti-militaristic society.

Militaristic - Definition, Meaning & Synonyms

Militaristic means emphasizing readiness to wage war. A militaristic government is focused on building up its armed forces, and often acts aggressively toward other countries.

www.vocabulary.com

"Militaristic means emphasizing readiness to wage war. A militaristic government is focused on building up its armed forces, and often acts aggressively toward other countries."

"When members of an army are regularly seen marching through city streets, you can describe that city as militaristic. And a government's militaristic administration will use strong rhetoric to threaten other countries and place a high importance on funding and preparing arms and soldiers in case of war. Through history, militaristic states have typically been interested in expanding in size or power."

The Kaiser's Germany & Imperial Japan are excellent examples of militaristic societies. I don't want to ever see a democratic republic like the US being likened to those examples.

As for any decline in US defense spending (which is 40% of defense spending of all nations on earth), I don't see it. $753 billion for FY2022. A massive figure. Continues to increase every year.

The Department of Defense Releases the President’s Fiscal Year 2022 Defense Budget

The Department of Defense released the president’s Fiscal Year 2022 defense budget.

www.defense.gov

Office of the Under Secretary of Defense (Comptroller)

We're still building Apache helicopters? First introduced in 1980?

We're still building M-1 Abrams tanks? Also something like 40 years in production?

Honestly, the $10 billion for cyber security might be an underinvestment. Especially when the DOD spends $50 billion annually on health care (more than most nations do for their entire populations).

The only periods of substantial decreases in US defense spending over the 80 years have been in the immediate aftermath of World War Two & the first few years after the collapse of the Soviet Union, i.e end of the Cold War in the early-mid 1990s. Both times the decreases were approved by Congress on a bipartisan manner. Subsequent increases in defense spending were also always approved on a bipartisan basis.

The last US president to leave office with a smaller defense budget than when he entered office was probably Herbert Hoover.

 

[NorincoHater]

Well I certainly hope the United States remains an anti-militaristic society.

Militaristic - Definition, Meaning & Synonyms

Militaristic means emphasizing readiness to wage war. A militaristic government is focused on building up its armed forces, and often acts aggressively toward other countries.

www.vocabulary.com

"Militaristic means emphasizing readiness to wage war. A militaristic government is focused on building up its armed forces, and often acts aggressively toward other countries."

"When members of an army are regularly seen marching through city streets, you can describe that city as militaristic. And a government's militaristic administration will use strong rhetoric to threaten other countries and place a high importance on funding and preparing arms and soldiers in case of war. Through history, militaristic states have typically been interested in expanding in size or power."

The Kaiser's Germany & Imperial Japan are excellent examples of militaristic societies. I don't want to ever see a democratic republic like the US being likened to those examples.

I misused the word militaristic. Meant to say "opposed towards military activities", beginning principally with the calls to demobilize, reduce size of active-duty personnel, and denuclearize.

As a side note though...you can still find conflicting definitions of that word, especially from the Webster's Dictionary itself, a far more reputable source than vocabulary.com. Perhaps a malapropism, but other definitions of 'militaristic' are not as far-reaching and historically rooted as the context you provide. All valid points though, we cannot afford to become something bearing semblances of a military junta, of course I and hopefully all Americans would agree, goes without saying.

We're still building Apache helicopters? First introduced in 1980?

We're still building M-1 Abrams tanks? Also something like 40 years in production?

Honestly, the $10 billion for cyber security might be an underinvestment. Especially when the DOD spends $50 billion annually on health care (more than most nations do for their entire populations).

The only periods of substantial decreases in US defense spending over the 80 years have been in the immediate aftermath of World War Two & the first few years after the collapse of the Soviet Union, i.e end of the Cold War in the early-mid 1990s. Both times the decreases were approved by Congress on a bipartisan manner. Subsequent increases in defense spending were also always approved on a bipartisan basis.

The last US president to leave office with a smaller defense budget than when he entered office was probably Herbert Hoover.

Total numbers invested in DoD spending alone does not tell the full story. You can be a far more efficient country with these same, or less resources and achieve a force that is still equally as potent. Take a look at Russia, where its Ministry of Defence total budget is 1/16 the size of ours, and they have still managed to serially produce hypersonic ballistic missiles whereas our design, intended to be more cutting-edge, still seems to be held-up in silent development a decade later. Sure, they cannot serially produce T-14 Armadas at the same pace as our Abrams...but you have to give credit where credit is due in the importance of weapons of deterrence these days over tools of conventional warfare.

How about our M2 Bradley fighting vehicle's development, whose road to ultimate adoption was among the most expensive and drawn-out in all of Congressionally overseen military affairs, and led to an internal fiasco within the branches of the armed forces? Military projects used to proceed more smoothly, without as extended timelines or hyperinflated proposal budgets as they do now, albeit lesser levels of technological complexion pervaded across these projects. Nevertheless, they still achieved state-of-the-art goals for their time with these smaller budgets or timescales to military grade service adoption.

Spending more alone is not a panacea to our situation. While you can't stop spending more, efficiency is the clear key.

 

[glen]

Sorry if I was quick to react….I spend a good bit of time volunteering to recruit cadets for a military college, and I am acutely aware of the severe drop off in ROTC scholarships due to the current manpower issue. It is depressing, but I don’t sense any anti-military purpose. I served 1970-79, during a period of extreme anti-military sentiment due to the VN War and draft. Most people today - if they have any connection to the military at all - are very supportive. I think we are going to experience a period of draw down in certain branches as we adjust to holdover personnel due to the Pandemic, and changes in mission. This is unfortunate for many young men and women who wish to serve as officers, but were relying on ROTC scholarships to get through college. But experience tells us that as usual, the military will be slow to anticipate need, and in another few years will be scrambling to fill junior officer slots….history repeats.