We had a family saying..."you can quit now! ...quit complaining!" Seemed to shut everybody up.We raised our kids the same, not quitters!
See, this is the part that I'm still trying to wrap my head around. Players cheated in Spring '20. The change in representation policy in Fall '20 allowed apparently 16 - 17 football players to remain on the roster all the way to the Liberty Bowl. Cases finally adjudicated in Spring '21, and now doing SLDP-H for four to six months. Upon completion, they are again eligible to represent USMA. They are held back one academic year, exactly matching the one additional year of athletic eligibility because of NCAA COVID rules. They all suit up for the Fall '21 football opener, having never missed a game.It is my understanding and I could be wrong but I think after their probationary period they are able to compete in sports again. I think for most that would put them back in their sports by fall. Like I said I could have misinterpreted what I read.
Have you actually known a D1 athlete? It is a huge time commitment. There is a reason many of the athletes don’t stay on the teams for four years at SAs. I know many drop sports after their plebe year.It's good to be an athlete.. I am left to wonder if ALL the 73 involved were just plain old plebes, if the result would have been the same.... The timing and additional eligibility does raise questions, it seems like athletes get "perks" everywhere, college, SA's, and just about any other type of educational institution including high school. It doesn't remove the fact that almost all of them get to continue without issue. I wonder if the "probation" is real or imagined?
I am sorry if I seem cynical, I guess it is the times we live in....
it came from a parent of a cadet who is class of 2024.I'm not quite sure where this number of 120 cadets left during the 2024 BEAST but I am almost certain it is far less than that.
This is my understanding...the players will never miss a game? Makes you wonder though how much input supe had, he is all about football.See, this is the part that I'm still trying to wrap my head around. Players cheated in Spring '20. The change in representation policy in Fall '20 allowed apparently 16 - 17 football players to remain on the roster all the way to the Liberty Bowl. Cases finally adjudicated in Spring '21, and now doing SLDP-H for four to six months. Upon completion, they are again eligible to represent USMA. They are held back one academic year, exactly matching the one additional year of athletic eligibility because of NCAA COVID rules. They all suit up for the Fall '21 football opener, having never missed a game.
Is this how it works? What am I missing?
Have you actually known a D1 athlete? It is a huge time commitment. There is a reason many of the athletes don’t stay on the teams for four years at SAs. I know many drop sports after their plebe year.
I actually was a D1 athlete in college (Tennis) so I am very much aware of the time constraints placed on athletes. I am also keenly aware of the "benefits" that being a D1 athlete carry. Extra academic help, travel (with additional academic time for assignments), coaches helping with conflicts or problems, and YES, I was aware of some athletes getting intervention on grades and infractions. And this back in the early 80's, now with the advent of athletes likely being able to make endorsement money (don't know how the SA's will handle that), getting cars, and other gifts from Graduate Organizations (again I have no idea how SA's handle this), and the perception (throughout academia) of D1 athletes being advantaged against "regular" students.Have you actually known a D1 athlete? It is a huge time commitment. There is a reason many of the athletes don’t stay on the teams for four years at SAs. I know many drop sports after their plebe year.
It doesn’t appear you are missing anything. USMA benefits from the athletes’ uninterrupted participation. Athletes benefit as well.They are held back one academic year, exactly matching the one additional year of athletic eligibility because of NCAA COVID rules. They all suit up for the Fall '21 football opener, having never missed a game.
Is this how it works? What am I missing?
The time commitment seems unrelated to the issues of honor violations and punishment. If you don’t want to discuss those things, why did you toss the grenade to begin with? I’m genuinely confused by that. With so many D1 athletes involved, how do we sidestep the issue of whether that status played a role in this mess.Have you actually known a D1 athlete? It is a huge time commitment. There is a reason many of the athletes don’t stay on the teams for four years at SAs. I know many drop sports after their plebe year.
Thank you... my DS is a plebe this year (not 2023 and not involved) however I can tell you that not all D1 sports at SA are equal in their resources but ALL do require an enormous amount of time (3-4hrs a day). If you figure in those hours spent each day training that they could be studying, doing AI or even attending tutor/study groups that are encouraged and available to help cadets who might be struggling academically.Have you actually known a D1 athlete? It is a huge time commitment. There is a reason many of the athletes don’t stay on the teams for four years at SAs. I know many drop sports after their plebe year.
A D1 athlete at a regular college and at an SA are not remotely the same and I am speaking from experience. I have a DS on a D1 team at an SA currently and they have not one of the above mentioned advantages. I can not speak for all of the sports teams but only the one my DS is on.I actually was a D1 athlete in college (Tennis) so I am very much aware of the time constraints placed on athletes. I am also keenly aware of the "benefits" that being a D1 athlete carry. Extra academic help, travel (with additional academic time for assignments), coaches helping with conflicts or problems, and YES, I was aware of some athletes getting intervention on grades and infractions. And this back in the early 80's, now with the advent of athletes likely being able to make endorsement money (don't know how the SA's will handle that), getting cars, and other gifts from Graduate Organizations (again I have no idea how SA's handle this), and the perception (throughout academia) of D1 athletes being advantaged against "regular" students.
So YES, I am aware of the drawbacks of being an athlete on free time, but the advantages seem to outweigh the liabilities at the SA's, and Universities.
Have you actually known a D1 athlete? It is a huge time commitment. There is a reason many of the athletes don’t stay on the teams for four year
Have you actually known a D1 athlete? It is a huge time commitment. There is a reason many of the athletes don’t stay on the teams for four years at SAs. I know many drop sports after their plebe year.
@UHBlackhawk I think you missed the point with your response. The Football players involved seemingly suffered little or no consequences related to their sport for their actions.
I am a D1 athlete. The preferential treatment that athletes receive at USNA is astonishing for a military academy. I'm sure USMA is no different.
Agree with you! There was definitely lost confidentiality here and presumption of guilt by the steps taken. And completely agree it has affected the Class of 2023 training. The slingshot (scrambling) of the 2023's to random new companies likely another fallout of all this. I do hope they have successful training evolutions this summer and can be reenergized for the fall semester.You are correct in that the USNA that issues regarding SP211 were from last December and initially involved around 80 in the Class of 2023. There are now more than 110 associated. You are also correct in that the MIDNs involved were issued failing grades for SP211 and their enrollment in Physics 2 was withdrawn. However, it should be noted that this action was before the MIDNs involved were even formally charged. This was a public statement to the Brigade, in my opinion, that goes against the value of innocence until proven guilty and a violation of the MIDNs rights to confidentiality.
The problem that I have with all of this is that there has been a presumption of guilt. These young men and women are only now having their Honor Boards and many are being found not guilty of these charges through the established process. Yet the damage is done to their academic record and their training schedules. Because of COVID, the training for the Class of 2023 had already been marginalized.
Some will be asked to leave, appropriately so. Some will take qualified resignation. I am just sad for those that voluntarily resign after being found innocent because they come to the conclusion they will not be given the opportunity to succeed.
NCAA gave all athletes a free year of eligibility due to covid, regardless of whether their school's season was played. No idea how USMA is handling this situation.Is this confirmed? So potentially USMA has cadets who cheated and violated the cadet oath but will receive another year of eligibility before affirming to live the life? USMA espoused the entire season of how they were able to fill the schedule etc.Why would another year be available? Just wow.
Wait a second... so say 120 did quit during Beast, those spot are going to remain empty? No one who was waitlisted gets to fill their spot?If 120 did quit during Beast that is a real shame. There's a bunch of c/o '25 re-applicants in this Forum that would have loved to have been there in their place.
I'm one of the lucky ones who have parents like that.Who knows? Maybe a lot of these kids had carryover PTSD from missing their Prom and walking at their Graduation? Or maybe this is the new "normal" and more and more kids will quit whatever is in front of them when things get tough.
We told our son to think long and hard before hitting that acceptance button on the USMA Candidate Portal, because once he did, there would be NO QUITTING!
Do parents even tell their kids that anymore???