No More Public AirShows

First, cadets don't care.
At the end of the day, I recognize that the world will still spin. That doesn't mean that air force cadets don't care. Certainly some do and some don't. Of course there are more important things in life than a flyover.

So why not save even more and cancel the ceremonies all together? There's even more savings! Cancel the Christmas tree at the White House (I'm agnostic so I don't care), and stop p_issing away $$'s on fireworks for the 4th of July. Heck, we are sending money to China for fireworks. They are not American made! :rolleyes:

Maybe parents do, but cadets and midshipmen just want to graduate.

Your right. Some cadets "just" want to graduate while others value traditions. Some aim high while other aim just get by.


There are MUCH more important, higher impact things you could put your money to.

I get why the Thunderbirds might not be "needed" for a graduation ceremony. I'm going to sleep like a baby either way. So I said those who what the flyover can pay for it. My check book is out and ready to contribute. Yet you think I should spend my money to have a "higher impact". Really? Did I read your point of view correctly?
 
Yes, but is that my real name? Hmmmmm. No one but me (and maybe a few others on the forum) will ever know.

I certainly agree with you on the tactics of it. We do have to cut from the federal budget, but we're cutting from the wrong places in a ham handed way in my opinion. But I also think these cuts are better than no cuts... and I think politically cuts from DoD had to come first before we could ever hit mandatory spending... and rightly so.

Don't worry, Coach K., your true identity is safe with us
 
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Well then, I'll take a "lite" version of the flyover versus the "deluxe" flyover package. $200K in fuel costs!?..... GULP!:eek: I'm willing to shell out $200 for our entire family in 2016.

I have a winter home in Surprise AZ (where I am typing). Luke AFB is down the block. I wonder what they go though in fuel a day? By the way, if any family of Luke pilots need a spot to stay while they visit, PM me. :)

My 2011 USAFA grad son just bought a house in Surprise and will be reporting to Luke AFB in July. I am sure their fuel usage is huge.

For those thinking they can finance a Thunderbird show, remember that the $200,000 tab for fuel (if accurate) is just the beginnning of the costs involved. The Thunderbirds arrive several days before the show for practice flights and map out landmarks they will use for the show. They come with a C-130 that flies in their maintainers and show staff (a couple dozen people in addition to the pilots) along with spare parts and electronics for the show. Add up all of their time and lodging costs in the COS area for the time that they are all there. Then you have the maintanace and repair costs on the jets for the flight time involved. Going off the team's budget numbers of $112 million to support the team for 60 show a year, the cost per show is more like $1.866 million.

I will add this, too: The Thunderbird show was nice at our son's gradaution, but I honestly don't remember much about it. A lot of people were already making their way out of the stadium during the show, and there was a lot of other stuff that was going on. I honestly don't think that I would have missed out on anything without the show. The fact of the graduation overshadowed everything else.

Stealth_81
 
Let not forget about all ceremonial units. Marine military drill unit H and I, all military bands. Congressional interns. Veterans Day ceremonies. All academy sports teams. All military sports teams. Chorus. White house entertainment.
 
The more important, and memorable, traditions at a service academy graduation are taking the oath, tossing the cover with your classmates, and the first salute.

Sure whatever, it was nice to have the Blue Angels I guess (I actually had to think for a few minutes about whether or not they did the flyover) but that memory faded at about the same rate as my sunburn. That other stuff is going to be with me for a lot longer.
 
Hurricane are you SWO or an Naval Aviator?

.....-1 for lack of situational awareness.

I'm a Marine....who's about to head down to Pensacola at the end of the month to train as a Naval Aviator.
 
Hurricane weren't the Blue Angels grounded last year for USNA graduation.
 
Hurricane weren't the Blue Angels grounded last year for USNA graduation.

We didn't have the airshow, which we knew well in advance, because of stupid scheduling issues (clearing the water of boats wasn't feasible on Memorial Day weekend) but did have the flyover.

2011 didn't have the airshow/flyover because the Blue Angels were grounded following an incident. Their flyover was by VFA-143, the Pukin' Dogs.
 
We didn't have the airshow, which we knew well in advance, because of stupid scheduling issues (clearing the water of boats wasn't feasible on Memorial Day weekend) but did have the flyover.

2011 didn't have the airshow/flyover because the Blue Angels were grounded following an incident. Their flyover was by VFA-143, the Pukin' Dogs.

Are the Pukin Dogs still available?
 
Every year in high school the seniors would do something. Before I was a senior it was fairly minor stuff... like PJ day. I don't remember what we did my year, but it was fairly tame. My class liked to have fun, but we took high school for what it was, a required step to going to college, and 99% of us did (the other 1% first enlisted in the Air Force).

Well my mother was a guidance counselor at my school, and from time to time she would give me updates on how things were.

Eventually I heard about "senior week"... keep in mind, we had a sedate "day" but the seniors of 4-6 years later wanted a week. As things got a little out of hand, the school administration throttled it back a little. The uproar was immediate.

"But it's tradition. It's how it's always been. It's our right."

Truth be told, it wasn't tradition, and a day, a week a year, a decade later, it didn't mean anything anyway.

I understand that a "fly over" is tradition. I like that someone brought up the Blue Angels at the Naval Academy. I'm no expert, but I'm guessing the Naval Academy was having commencements LONG before fly overs were possible. Call me crazy.

Did we cheer when we had an MH-60 and MH-65 fly over my graduation? Sure. But you know what, at the end of the day, if it hadn't happened, I wouldn't have been any less excited. The President, Vice President or secretary of defense could be there. A cadet could shake their hands and become an actual officer (something that never seemed possible when your a cadet or midshipmen).


"Come on parents, lets raise the money!!!"

Since I was a senior, or maybe earlier I have paid to be a member of the Coast Guard Academy Alumni Association. Each year the amount I paid increased a little bit. When I graduated it increased a lot.

Why do I give money? My school's alumni association gives a nice chunk of change to club sports and activities. I benefited from that money as a cadet. And now that I make money, I feel the need to give some back.

If I found out the money I hoped to give cadets to benefit their programs for years to come was used to pay for a 2 second fly over on a day that has so much more important stuff going on, I'd say it was an absolute waste.

Is it your money to spend? Sure, but it will never work. Why? Well, partially because fly overs are approved in Washington (the Pentagon asked if we wanted a similar approval process, but we declined... it was better to leave that authority at the district levels) and finally how exactly would the Air Force account for this "gift"? And if there was an accident, how would they explain that it was funded privately?


They wouldn't and they won't. Won't happen. And at the end of the day the cadets won't think another thing of it. For 100 years cadets and midshipmen graduated without fly overs before the Air Force was a twinkle in Daddy Sam's little eye. They'll survive and they're get more than their share of fly overs during their careers.
 
Hell with it. Let's just have them do a flyover with "DRONES". Apparently they are flying over towns, cities, farms, etc... throughout the country. How expensive would it be to play "Playstation"? There's quite a few in the Colorado area.
 
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