USAFA Cadet Death

[soccer67]

It is still an issue. My cadet, that is an athlete, said in the last 2 weeks Mitches has run out of food by the time they made it there on 3 occasions.

1. What sport?

2. "run out of food". Do you mean for us to take that literally"?

3. Maybe its time for all cadets to adhere to the same time schedule. That means jocks finish their sports training early enough to rejoin the wing as a cadet and not as a member of some different group.

 

[CoffeeIVDrip75]

1. What sport?

2. "run out of food". Do you mean for us to take that literally"?

3. Maybe its time for all cadets to adhere to the same time schedule. That means jocks finish their sports training early enough to rejoin the wing as a cadet and not as a member of some different group.

Yes, I mean Literally. I mean when my cadet got there, nothing was left to consume for that meal. My cadet is fine. They adapt and over come. I am making the statement that the food issues has not been corrected 100%.

 

[soccer67]

Yes, I mean Literally. I mean when my cadet got there, nothing was left to consume for that meal.

OK, then taking that at face value, have you communicated this to the appropriate supervisors? What was their response?

 

[ZoomieFrom1994]

I am about 94% sure that during my tenure at USAFA, that there were times that Mitch’s ran out of food completely at dinner, or maybe just some food items. Also, IIRC, we all understood that dinner was a matter of “first come, first served”. If you got there “late”, that was on you. You figured out a Plan B. That could have meant buying food from the “C-store”. Or digging through the overhead bins in our cadet dorm room for food that we had squirreled away. Or going in with a few other cadets to order some BlackJack pizzas. The worst case scenario was always the vending machines.

But back then, we never felt the need to call the Gazette Telegraph to tell them about our lack of planning.

I am assuming cadets still do not go through SERE between their 4 degree and 3 degree years???

These would be pilots do understand there are no buffets to stop at while they are land nav’ing at night between partisan camps up in the mountains surrounding Fairchild AFB, right?

 

[SpiritCommitteeLiaison]

I am about 94% sure that during my tenure at USAFA, that there were times that Mitch’s ran out of food completely at dinner, or maybe just some food items. Also, IIRC, we all understood that dinner was a matter of “first come, first served”. If you got there “late”, that was on you. You figured out a Plan B. That could have meant buying food from the “C-store”. Or digging through the overhead bins in our cadet dorm room for food that we had squirreled away. Or going in with a few other cadets to order some BlackJack pizzas. The worst case scenario was always the vending machines.

But back then, we never felt the need to call the Gazette Telegraph to tell them about our lack of planning.

I am assuming cadets still do not go through SERE between their 4 degree and 3 degree years???

These would be pilots do understand there are no buffets to stop at while they are land nav’ing at night between partisan camps up in the mountains surrounding Fairchild AFB, right?

94% -- I see what you did there.

They do not have full SERE. No evasion, resistance, nor escape. They have combat survival training, though.
CST includes training on medical care, food preparation, aircraft signaling and navigation.

 

[unkown1961]

94% -- I see what you did there.

They do not have full SERE. No evasion, resistance, nor escape. They have combat survival training, though.
CST includes training on medical care, food preparation, aircraft signaling and navigation.

Unless they changed from last summer they do evasion now as well. My AFROTC son and a few other ROTC cadets participated with USAFA cadets in the program last summer. The evasion was down near Trinidad.
The ROTC cadets had fun answering questions like ‘do you have a curfew at your university?’

 

[SpiritCommitteeLiaison]

Unless they changed from last summer they do evasion now as well. My AFROTC son and a few other ROTC cadets participated with USAFA cadets in the program last summer. The evasion was down near Trinidad.
The ROTC cadets had fun answering questions like ‘do you have a curfew at your university?’

Oh good! Glad they added that back in then.

It isn't the same as the SERE that pilots go through after graduation (or that some of the older grads did). Still, the survival and evasion training is good.

 

[unkown1961]

Oh good! Glad they added that back in then.

It isn't the same as the SERE that pilots go through after graduation (or that some of the older grads did). Still, the survival and evasion training is good.

Actually the two parts are the same. My son is waiting to start flight training and they’re sending him to SERE. He was able to get out of two of the acronym letters based on his training last summer. The word then was that USAFA was going back to the training they used to have (other than resistance and interrogation parts).

 

[SpiritCommitteeLiaison]

Actually the two parts are the same. My son is waiting to start flight training and they’re sending him to SERE. He was able to get out of two of the acronym letters based on his training last summer. The word then was that USAFA was going back to the training they used to have (other than resistance and interrogation parts).

I hope so. I think its important training given how dangerous the world has become.

 

[ZoomieFrom1994]

Unless they changed from last summer they do evasion now as well. My AFROTC son and a few other ROTC cadets participated with USAFA cadets in the program last summer. The evasion was down near Trinidad.
The ROTC cadets had fun answering questions like ‘do you have a curfew at your university?’

My little group was late to our first partisan camp.

We got handcuffed, black bagged, and forced to kneel while the partisans asked us questions.

I guess I was a little slow answering the questions, so I got the muzzle end of an AK-47 pressed against my head, and then the partisan racked the bolt/charging handle.

(“HEY! I thought these were supposed to be the good guys?")

Needless to say, my answers came a lot quicker after that.

Anywhoooo…..my point is ….and this pertains strictly to the food issue at Mitch’s….cadets need to realize that they signed up for the military. Some “discomfort” is going to come with the territory. They need to show they have some tougher bark on them. Mitch’s running out of food, especially dinners, is not that big of a deal. The media’s reaction to that, however, is a much bigger deal.

 

[Osprey123]

My little group was late to our first partisan camp.

We got handcuffed, black bagged, and forced to kneel while the partisans asked us questions.

I guess I was a little slow answering the questions, so I got the muzzle end of an AK-47 pressed against my head, and then the partisan racked the bolt/charging handle.

(“HEY! I thought these were supposed to be the good guys?")

Needless to say, my answers came a lot quicker after that.

Anywhoooo…..my point is ….and this pertains strictly to the food issue at Mitch’s….cadets need to realize that they signed up for the military. Some “discomfort” is going to come with the territory. They need to show they have some tougher bark on them. Mitch’s running out of food, especially dinners, is not that big of a deal. The media’s reaction to that, however, is a much bigger deal.

They KNOW they are in the military which is why they're acting like it by complaining.

 

[Cerberi]

My little group was late to our first partisan camp.

We got handcuffed, black bagged, and forced to kneel while the partisans asked us questions.

I guess I was a little slow answering the questions, so I got the muzzle end of an AK-47 pressed against my head, and then the partisan racked the bolt/charging handle.

(“HEY! I thought these were supposed to be the good guys?")

Needless to say, my answers came a lot quicker after that.

Anywhoooo…..my point is ….and this pertains strictly to the food issue at Mitch’s….cadets need to realize that they signed up for the military. Some “discomfort” is going to come with the territory. They need to show they have some tougher bark on them. Mitch’s running out of food, especially dinners, is not that big of a deal. The media’s reaction to that, however, is a much bigger deal.

Isn’t what happens at survival school classified?

I recall that when USAFA had SERE and I participated, we weren’t really supposed to discuss it?

 

[teksmith]

Her parents entrusted the Academy to take care of her daughter and the Academy didn't do it. This is a leadership failure. No one should be getting so sick that they die while in a place like a US Service Academy. With all that oversite they still denied her the appropriate care and sent her back to her room to die. And the worst thing about it is it seems if she would have gotten something as simple as antibiotics she would be alive today.

 

[Stormbird]

Her parents entrusted the Academy to take care of her daughter and the Academy didn't do it. This is a leadership failure. No one should be getting so sick that they die while in a place like a US Service Academy. With all that oversite they still denied her the appropriate care and sent her back to her room to die. And the worst thing about it is it seems if she would have gotten something as simple as antibiotics she would be alive today.

I would like to know where you got your information. I ask that because it is incorrect. I was in her Squadron 2 days ago. As for those saying there is no investigation going on, that too, is incorrect.

Stop guessing, stop speculating, and please stop making accusations and let the investigation finish. Just like an aircraft mishap investigation, it takes time.

 

[soccer67]

Stop guessing, stop speculating, and please stop making accusations and let the investigation finish. Just like an aircraft mishap investigation, it takes time.

Good advice. I'd like to see better communication to us grads on this and other issues. That's one way to stop speculation.

 

[unkown1961]

On the topic of internal investigations by the Academy on their actions and inactions, these articles were posted this morning from the local paper (neither had a paywall).

Parents pursue accountability in Air Force Academy graduate's rape, subsequent suicide​

And:

Air Force Academy phased out sexual assault prevention program shown to work at other schools​

 

[Stormbird]

On the topic of internal investigations by the Academy on their actions and inactions, these articles were posted this morning from the local paper (neither had a paywall).

Parents pursue accountability in Air Force Academy graduate's rape, subsequent suicide​

And:

Air Force Academy phased out sexual assault prevention program shown to work at other schools​

Please start another thread if you want to talk about this, otherwise people are going to think you're trying to establish some kind of linkage between the original post and the linked articles.

 

[ZoomieFrom1994]

Isn’t what happens at survival school classified?

I recall that when USAFA had SERE and I participated, we weren’t really supposed to discuss it?

I make it a point to never discus the R part…the POW compound part….publicly.

The survival and evasion part(s) have “kinda” been put out there in public in various movies over the years, and events like Capt. Scott O’Grady’s shoot down and then Lt.Col. Dave Goldfein’s shoot down.

Some movie examples:

And of course, there are plenty of other resources out on the internet where people describe their SERE experiences.

 

[teksmith]

I would like to know where you got your information. I ask that because it is incorrect. I was in her Squadron 2 days ago. As for those saying there is no investigation going on, that too, is incorrect.

Stop guessing, stop speculating, and please stop making accusations and let the investigation finish. Just like an aircraft mishap investigation, it takes time.

I am not guessing or speculating. I got my information from the coroners report published in the news. What is incorrect?
https://nypost.com/2024/10/05/us-ne...-cadet-avery-koonces-cause-of-death-revealed/

 

[Cerberi]

I make it a point to never discus the R part…the POW compound part….publicly.

The survival and evasion part(s) have “kinda” been put out there in public in various movies over the years, and events like Capt. Scott O’Grady’s shoot down and then Lt.Col. Dave Goldfein’s shoot down.

Some movie examples:

And of course, there are plenty of other resources out on the internet where people describe their SERE experiences.

I don’t think what happens in SERE is a well kept secret, it at one point is was classified information (at least aspects of it). I do know that if we hold security clearances and are told that who won last year’s Super Bowl is classified secret or higher and ESPN reports it, we have an obligation not to confirm it.