USNA summer seminar and stats

[Heatherg21]

Wow I don’t even know what to say, everything you have right now is amazing I really don’t know what you can improve on besides SAT score.

You don’t know the quality of the essay or personal statements. You can’t know the required teacher evals. You weren’t in the room for interviews. You cannot possibly see the BGO interview write up.

Lots of variables.

 

[Navyaddict]

You don’t know the quality of the essay or personal statements. You can’t know the required teacher evals. You weren’t in the room for interviews. You cannot possibly see the BGO interview write up.

Lots of variables.

Yes, I know that I was just stating from what he put that what he has currently is amazing.

 

[justdoit19]

I read through the thread. Great resumes posted. As @Heatherg21 pointed out, there are variables you do not control that weigh into decisions. Another one is the other candidates on your slate. You do not know their intangibles.

To anyone who asks ‘how can I improve’…beyond specific recommendations, I would say to have an open mind about reapplying. Every year amazing applicants are not appointed. No matter how many noms. So don’t look at this as ‘one and done’ if an appointment is the goal.

Every year a significant part of the class are reapplicants. Being open to that is a way to improve your chances of an appointment!

 

[OldRetSWO]

Wow I don’t even know what to say, everything you have right now is amazing I really don’t know what you can improve on besides SAT score.

To add to what others have already said, in some districts, that SAT score ALONE will keep a candidate out of the running for a nom, much less admission.
My panel saw 12 candidates this cycle and I think that the lowest SATs that I saw were in the 1400s and not all of these candidates will be
getting a nomination much less admission. Most were multi-sport or if single sport, were outstanding in their sport.

 

[gniyji]

Last year this time,

DS had SAT 1580, AP Calculus BC 5 (along with some less important APs), a club competitive swimmer (USA swimming A, AA cut off time), High school varsity swimmer (with 2 letters). He applied for Summer Seminar on the first day when the application portal opened but it took USNA over three months, in later April to have him rejected.

He has his application ready for appointment since Dec 5, 2023 (2Q with MOC nomination) -- he is still pending, likely a déjà vu as his summer seminar result, TWE

At the same time, he got SLE from West Point on Feb 15, 2023 -- not long after his application to West Point, and received his LOA in July -- and an appointment in the middle of December 2023.

Just can't count on stats --- it is up to SA to select --- you just put the best application and wait

 

[USMC Crayons]

Last year this time,

DS had SAT 1580, AP Calculus BC 5 (along with some less important APs), a club competitive swimmer (USA swimming A, AA levels), High school varsity swimmer (with 2 letters). He applied for Summer Seminar on the first day when the application portal opened but it took USNA over three months, in later April to have him rejected.

He has his application ready for appointment since Dec 5, 2023 (2Q with MOC nomination) -- he is still pending, likely a déjà vu as his summer seminar result, TWE

At the same time, he got SLE from West Point on Feb 15, 2023 -- not long after his application to West Point, and received his LOA in July -- and an appointment in the middle of December 2023.

Just can't count on stats --- it is up to SA to select --- you just put the best application and wait

Definitely not the same stats as your DS score wise, but similar results. Waitlisted for NASS (ultimately didn't get to go), rejected from Inspire twice, only ray of light was 2 CVW's. There's really no rhyme or reason to it, just have to go with the flow I guess. Have met Mids that got direct entry the 1st time with a 1230 SAT score (not a recruited athlete) and others with almost perfect stats that were rejected. It's a wicked mistress that's for sure.

 

[Waitandsee]

To add to what others have already said, in some districts, that SAT score ALONE will keep a candidate out of the running for a nom, much less admission.
My panel saw 12 candidates this cycle and I think that the lowest SATs that I saw were in the 1400s and not all of these candidates will be
getting a nomination much less admission. Most were multi-sport or if single sport, were outstanding in their sport.

Wow interesting...I'm curious as to which districts.

 

[USMC Crayons]

To add to what others have already said, in some districts, that SAT score ALONE will keep a candidate out of the running for a nom, much less admission.
My panel saw 12 candidates this cycle and I think that the lowest SATs that I saw were in the 1400s and not all of these candidates will be
getting a nomination much less admission. Most were multi-sport or if single sport, were outstanding in their sport.

It's a shame that the SAT carries so much weight with some MOC's. Especially since it's such a small measure of what Annapolis is looking at overall.

 

[Waitandsee]

Definitely not the same stats as your DS score wise, but similar results. Waitlisted for NASS (ultimately didn't get to go), rejected from Inspire twice, only ray of light was 2 CVW's. There's really no rhyme or reason to it, just have to go with the flow I guess. Have met Mids that got direct entry the 1st time with a 1230 SAT score (not a recruited athlete) and others with almost perfect stats that were rejected. It's a wicked mistress that's for sure.

This is all great information as we begin this venture this summer. What I'm gathering is, during this process, never get too high and never get too low. You just never know until you know.

 

[Navyaddict]

Definitely not the same stats as your DS score wise, but similar results. Waitlisted for NASS (ultimately didn't get to go), rejected from Inspire twice, only ray of light was 2 CVW's. There's really no rhyme or reason to it, just have to go with the flow I guess. Have met Mids that got direct entry the 1st time with a 1230 SAT score (not a recruited athlete) and others with almost perfect stats that were rejected. It's a wicked mistress that's for sure.

I guess its up to fate lol

 

[gniyji]

Definitely not the same stats as your DS score wise, but similar results. Waitlisted for NASS (ultimately didn't get to go), rejected from Inspire twice, only ray of light was 2 CVW's. There's really no rhyme or reason to it, just have to go with the flow I guess. Have met Mids that got direct entry the 1st time with a 1230 SAT score (not a recruited athlete) and others with almost perfect stats that were rejected. It's a wicked mistress that's for sure.

I told my son, SA application (and other colleges as well) is like dating ---- you are the same person -- smart and handsome, West Point can see that -- other may not -

 

[IronmanDaremo]

Wow interesting...I'm curious as to which districts.

I cannot speak to where OldRetSWO is from, but I've said it before - where we are (District 3 in Maryland - same one as Annapolis), if you aren't 1500+, varsity multi-sport (or the absolute superstar in one), near 4.0 unweighted, multiple AP classes, extracurriculars all over the place, etc., you will more than likely not get an MoC nom. The field is incredibly stacked around here with a lot of kids who wouldn't mind being near home for school with typically well over 200 people actually getting interviews for the noms.

My kid was all of those things except he had mediocre SATs (1250). Did not get a USNA nom from our MoCs in two different cycles, even with an LOA in the first one. Thank goodness for other sources in the long run!!

As for summer STEM/NASS? People have to realize that they are marketing tools. It is not about your specific statistics. It is where you are from, who you are (whether or not your demographic is underrepresented as an example), and what you might be able to bring to the Brigade in the long run.

Nearly everyone at the Academy was one of the big fish in their local little pond. On the Yard, you are a big fish surrounded by tons of other big fish in the ocean.

 

[OldRetSWO]

Wow interesting...I'm curious as to which districts.

Northern NJ. Just looking at AVERAGE SAT scores in this state - the top ten highest AVERAGE score high schools are over 1360. . . and that is for the AVERAGE.

 

[OldRetSWO]

It's a shame that the SAT carries so much weight with some MOC's. Especially since it's such a small measure of what Annapolis is looking at overall.

I kind of think that my MOC knows something about what USNA is looking for since she (and her husband) are grads.

I think that we had seven or eight panels and all saw a slate of candidates. The competition that I've seen over the past four or so years is such that there are enough really super candidates WITH high SAT scores that a low/medium SAT score candidate has a very steep hill to climb.

 

[OldRetSWO]

Last year this time,

DS had SAT 1580, AP Calculus BC 5 (along with some less important APs), a club competitive swimmer (USA swimming A, AA cut off time), High school varsity swimmer (with 2 letters). He applied for Summer Seminar on the first day when the application portal opened but it took USNA over three months, in later April to have him rejected.

He has his application ready for appointment since Dec 5, 2023 (2Q with MOC nomination) -- he is still pending, likely a déjà vu as his summer seminar result, TWE

At the same time, he got SLE from West Point on Feb 15, 2023 -- not long after his application to West Point, and received his LOA in July -- and an appointment in the middle of December 2023.

Just can't count on stats --- it is up to SA to select --- you just put the best application and wait

Many, many great candidates get turned down for NASS simply on the basis of geography. I won't repeat the rest of the spiel here but it is really true. And yes, they do take months to send a rejection which I don't really understand but that is how NASS operates.

 

[USMC Crayons]

I kind of think that my MOC knows something about what USNA is looking for since she (and her husband) are grads.

I think that we had seven or eight panels and all saw a slate of candidates. The competition that I've seen over the past four or so years is such that there are enough really super candidates WITH high SAT scores that a low/medium SAT score candidate has a very steep hill to climb.

That may be true, but in my opinion a test like the SAT that heavily favors the wealthy and well to do isn't exactly the best gauge for who will be a great naval officer. Is that not what the service academies mission is? If the SAT were so important to Annapolis, the SAT 25th to 75th range would certainly be higher than 610-700. That's on the lower end considering Annapolis' academic rankings.

 

[Navyaddict]

That may be true, but in my opinion a test like the SAT that heavily favors the wealthy and well to do isn't exactly the best gauge for who will be a great naval officer. Is that not what the service academies mission is? If the SAT were so important to Annapolis, the SAT 25th to 75th range would certainly be higher than 610-700. That's on the lower end considering Annapolis' academic rankings.

I think USNA likes to see what type of person you are. You have to be well-rounded and passionate. They wouldn't take someone whose only interested in the school because its free but someone who has the passion and dedication to be in the navy for the rest of their life. Someone who is willing to fight and die for their country

 

[gniyji]

That may be true, but in my opinion a test like the SAT that heavily favors the wealthy and well to do isn't exactly the best gauge for who will be a great naval officer. Is that not what the service academies mission is? If the SAT were so important to Annapolis, the SAT 25th to 75th range would certainly be higher than 610-700. That's on the lower end considering Annapolis' academic rankings.

USNA has large number of enlists -- they may have left high school too long to do well SAT.

 

[OldRetSWO]

SAT 25th to 75th range would certainly be higher than 610-700. That's on the lower end considering Annapolis' academic rankings.

If you take out the candidates who are coming from NAPS and athletic recruits, the range would be substantially higher. Remember also that some areas just have better scores.
FWIW, my sister and I graduated from a high school that has among the lowest average SAT scores in my state. Number of students even taking the test is very low as most aren't planning on applying for higher education and so the scores reflect the kids who are at least thinking of moving on educationally. The last average score I saw (a few years ago) was below 900 combined. While that agrees with your statement about relationship to income, it is not absolute as there are folks who still manage to do OK on the tests without being well to do or wealthy.

 

[IronmanDaremo]

"Whole candidate" ..............