What Happened to Boxing?

Discussion in 'Coast Guard Academy - USCGA' started by LurkingQuietly, Oct 29, 2018.

  1. LurkingQuietly

    LurkingQuietly Member

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    I asked my DS if he was boxing again during the off-season, and he said that the program was shut down, and all the equipment was donated. He had really no good answer for why.
     
  2. EDelahanty

    EDelahanty 5-Year Member

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    I was hoping it might have been increasing awareness of chronic traumatic encephalopathy. Turns out the coach left.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2018
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  3. LurkingQuietly

    LurkingQuietly Member

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    The Coach Left? So they dismantled the program,? That's about as silly as the answer my DS gave me. Actually, his explanation made more sense. Chronic traumatic encephalopathy? Doesn't football, soccer, rugby and ice hockey have higher instances of that type of injury? I know no one gets recruited for boxing, but still.....its is a life skill, like swimming.

    Next time some bad person hits me in the head, I'm going to get up and say " Don't you know that you could have caused a traumatic encephalopathy?"
     
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  4. ekb1398

    ekb1398 Member

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    This is from the rumor mill, but I've heard it was due to safety concerns about how the program was being run.
     
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  5. EDelahanty

    EDelahanty 5-Year Member

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    Try not letting bad people hit you in the head. If you are still capable, check the August 21 post on the USCGA Boxing Team's Facebook page.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2018
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  6. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator 5-Year Member

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    I don't think I've used that particular "life skill" since my teens. Swimming, on the other hand, actually is a life skill.
     
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  7. flieger83

    flieger83 Super Moderator 10-Year Member

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    An example of something that might have contributed to USCGA getting away from boxing.

    A recent graduate from USCGA...a 4.00 GPA during first two years, this cadet was sent to West Point on the semester exchange. While there had to take boxing. The rules: body shots...one to the head; after two to the head, the bout is stopped and all bouts are filmed.

    This cadet fought a golden gloves boxer...everyone has USMA athletic gear, while this person has USCGA gear. The fight commenced...the USCGA cadet took 31, yes, THIRTY ONE blows to the head (all on the video, which the parents and lawyers have copies of) before the bout ended. It was not stopped. That night, the cadet collapsed in their room, vomiting, incoherent...all the signs of serious concussion.

    LONG story short...this cadet was diagnosed at the nations finest neurological hospital with TBI, caused by repetitive blows to the head. This person was allowed to graduate from USCGA (it took legal action and congressional assistance to ensure that) but was not commissioned as headaches continue on a daily basis and the neurologists are uncertain if they'll ever go away. Therefore this graduate is not universally assignable. The only "good" thing to come out of this? The person was medically retired with full benefits and has a VA disability rating over 60%; it may end up 100% if the headaches don't subside.

    I'm thinking this may have played a role in their decision. And please forgive the stilted language; I'm trying very hard to make it very difficult to identify the person.

    Steve
    USAFA ALO
    USAFA '83
     
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  8. MJ2020

    MJ2020 Member

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    Thx for the info. My 2C was very interested to join the team in his first semester freshman year. He discussed it with me and to his grandma. We both said, “oh nooo! Your face/head will get mess up”. Then I didn’t hear and didn’t see pictures any more. DS font usually loss interest that quick.
     
  9. LurkingQuietly

    LurkingQuietly Member

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    You're response seems to be mocking me, but I'm pretty sure that "self defense" is a required class at this school as is swimming.
     
  10. LurkingQuietly

    LurkingQuietly Member

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    Wouldn't a more logical reaction to this situation be to never to send another cadet to West Point. What if it happens again? Whose fault is it going to be?
     
  11. kinnem

    kinnem Moderator 5-Year Member

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    Absolutely correct, but that doesn't make it a life skill. A life skill is defined as "a skill that is necessary or desirable for full participation in everyday life." Managing a checkbook is a life skill. It's something the vast majority of people need to handle their normal life. Boxing, to me, is not. But maybe that's just me.
     
  12. trackandfield08

    trackandfield08 USCGA 2014 10-Year Member

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    I have been told the same when I started to ask around, the program was dismantled and moved offsite because of safety concerns. The program was not being run properly. However, there are steps being taken to reinvigorate the program and re-introduce it back as a club sport option. That being said, there is not any formal timeline associated (that I am aware of).

    Yes, Personal Defense I and II are required courses for all cadets. Boxing is not - it is (or was) a voluntary sport cadets could participate in to earn their required sports credits. There is a big difference between the PD I and II courses and boxing, PD I and II is geared towards self-defense, but also towards training cadets on law enforcement techniques (appropriate strikes, pressure points, counters, etc.) as many cadets will serve as Boarding Officers and conduct law enforcement boardings.

    Disagree - the benefits of the Service Academy exchange program should not be shut down by the unfortunate incidents that occurred - hopefully, WP has taken steps to address and modify their program just as USCGA is now.
     
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  13. Alaskan

    Alaskan Member

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    DS was planning on boxing this year before the program was dismantled. The scuttlebutt was that it was being ran improperly and it may come back in the future.
     
  14. Alaskan

    Alaskan Member

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    One cadet being pummeled in a boxing ring at West Point may or may not have had anything to do with the boxing club at USCGA being removed. DS had reported at the time it was being ran improperly in New London.
     
  15. LurkingQuietly

    LurkingQuietly Member

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    TrackandField, I love you and you usually have great information, but you wrong here. Boxing is a martial art, just like all the others, (judo, karate, wrestling,etc.) and it teaches excellent self defense techniques. I'm not sure what exactly they're teaching in PD I and II, but if you say its appropriate strikes, counters, pressure points, I know those all apply to boxing. If you're going to spend your CG career using Dawn detergent to scrub ducks, hopefully you probably don't have to worry about this. If you're going to be apprehending bad guys, you probably do. If you don't know how to stand, keep you chin down and your hands up, you're probably going to have bad time. You learn nothing in a 1 credit class, only sparing teaches you those lessons.

    Well....I disagree also....what I said was the "logical" reaction would be to not send any more cadets, I didn't say that I think that should happen. I never heard anything about a cadet getting pummeled at West Point. Anyone who would let this happen, or would do this to a novice (a golden gloves boxer?) probably doesn't have the character to be a boxer or an officer, and i hope there was an Article 15 hearing for all those involved. But poster suggested that this played a role in ending the CGA boxing program....I don't see the logic in that. Logic would dictate: don't send a cadet to WP ; ask WP to exempt your cadet from the boxing requirement; make sure the exchange student knows how to throw fists before sending them to WP.

    You're hopeful that someone made a change there? And you feel that the modification that the USCGA made will address this in the future? What change did the USCGA make?

    I'm going to have to agree with this. I was in the room for practice once, there was no instructor present, and the more experienced fighters decided to have live sparing. I was surprised. I Didn't think that was safe or appropriate.

    Maybe ask Marine.
     
  16. trackandfield08

    trackandfield08 USCGA 2014 10-Year Member

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    You seem focused on the idea that boxing is the only way a person can be taught proper self defense techniques, to include sparring. I'll make my statement clearer - the difference between West Point and CGA when it comes to boxing is that it is MANDATORY for all cadets at WP and a VOLUNTARY extracurricular activity for all cadets at CGA. It is not part of the curriculum, nor do I think it should be, because there are other classes in place (PD I and II) that cover the basics of self-defense and law enforcement training.

    Again - they cover the basics. Cadets don't come out of CGA prepared for all aspects of being an officer. For those requiring law enforcement training, they will train on their cutters or at their sectors, and attend a formal 6 week Boarding Officer Course at the Federal Law Enforcement Training Center (FLETC) in North Charleston, SC. There, you get plenty of "sparring" experience as well as all of the academic training needed to be a Boarding Officer. Once they graduate the course, they will continue to train at their units and are required to meet annual benchmarks to maintain their qualification. Additionally, FLETC instructors conduct formal inspections of each unit's LE program every two years on the unit's safety measures and training effectiveness. Boxing is not the CG-policy dictated method of training CG law enforcement officers, so it makes sense that the CGA would follow the same CG policy. Cadets (and newly commissioned officers) will have plenty of opportunities to learn how to keep their chin down through other courses.

    "You learn nothing in a 1 credit class" - I remember learning plenty and having it cemented through formal CG training later on.

    I would think the more logical reason would be to still send cadets, but not allow them to participate in the boxing course. I can't speak to WP boxing courses or reports of WP cadets getting pummeled. The poster who talked about this said it may have attributed to the removal of the sport, not that it did.

    Change - they disbanded the program, at least for the short term. While it may not be everyone's favorite change, its still change. I know they are in talks with the previous coaches (the original coaches), who ran an excellent program. It's possible the original CG Boxing coaches could return, I believe one is acting a sort-of consultant.
     
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  17. billyb

    billyb 5-Year Member

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    Guess you didn't go to WP.....

    In PE boxing class you definitely can get paired with a seasoned boxer even when you have no experience at all. In my day the only ones they let out of boxing were golden gloves types. I remember we had a bout where you had to box with your right hand behind your back and only use your left hand. I'm right handed and unfortunately the guy I was boxing was a leftie. I got pummeled. The instructors would take off points if you didn't knock the opponent down with blows. They would basically scream for blood to be drawn (no joke). I saw multiple people get roughed up pretty well in PE. One thing it definitely does teach you is personal courage to stand in the face of direct danger and keep fighting no matter what. I think that's the point of it.
     
  18. Alaskan

    Alaskan Member

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    A very close friend of mine is a West Point grad and was the boxing instructor at WP for a number of years in the late 80’s. He loved the program and what it taught. Courage, confidence under fire, perseverance. I remember the days.......
     
  19. billyb

    billyb 5-Year Member

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    Alaskan- your friend might have been my instructor. Those instructors were no joke.
     
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  20. LurkingQuietly

    LurkingQuietly Member

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    West Point....where its perfectly acceptable to knowingly and purposely permanently disable a USCG cadet with novice boxing skills.....but god forbid harming a mule (or a bird).
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2018
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